Happy New Year Roger Goodell

[upstater1]

Maybe they'll schedule all the games at one o'clock next year so there's no question.

I think they should.

The Phin fans were celebrating after the schedule was made, and I understand why they were happy.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

One more thing. Damien Woody was quoted as saying that all the Jets saw the scoreboard at Giants Stadium when it read Jaguars 7 and Jets 3. Woody said that they never showed the scor again,

Man the Jets really DO suck. I mean losing to 2 different teams at the same time. Wow!

 

[upstater1]

Damn right, people should be ashamed of all of their whining. If you want to whine, put on a dress and go become a Jets fan. Some people always look for someone else to blame, they're the losers in life. The Pats did control their own destiny, until they lost 5 games. That's how it goes sometimes.

I'm doing very well in life, actually. Good job, good family, very happy person. The NFL changed the schedule in week 17 to the patriots detriment. This is a fact. That's all we're saying. No one is even blaming the playoff miss on this set of events. All we're saying is that the NFL did not do right by the patriots.

Why is that so hard to understand?

Why must it be all or nothing?

 

[Pujo]

I'm doing very well in life, actually. Good job, good family, very happy person. The NFL changed the schedule in week 17 to the patriots detriment. This is a fact. That's all we're saying. No one is even blaming the playoff miss on this set of events. All we're saying is that the NFL did not do right by the patriots.

Why is that so hard to understand?

Why must it be all or nothing?

And I'm not arguing that the change didn't hurt the Pats, but what I'm saying is there is zero evidence that the change was made for the purpose of hurting the Patriots. If you have evidence to the contrary, please lay it out, otherwise it sounds like the same disgruntled blah blah you hear on 19 other teams' messageboards.

 

[Deus Irae]

And I'm not arguing that the change didn't hurt the Pats, but what I'm saying is there is zero evidence that the change was made for the purpose of hurting the Patriots. If you have evidence to the contrary, please lay it out, otherwise it sounds like the same disgruntled blah blah you hear on 19 other teams' messageboards.

As I pointed out, the switch to 4 pm could have involved the Giants, Patriots and Ravens, rather than the Jets/Dolphins game. That is evidence. The issue is not that there's no evidence, the issue is whether the evidence is convincing. I don't find it convincing (although I do find it curious), but the league clearly had other viable options and chose to harm the Patriots chances when it didn't need to. Just claiming that it's about money is a copout, because there were other options that would have brought in high ratings.

 

[Raymond]

1 oclock or 4 oclock. My instincts tell me Favre does what he does best throwing int's anyway.

 

[PatsDeb]

Brett Farve and his stupid INTs, and Eric Mangini not going for in on 4th & 2 in Dolphins territory lost that game, not the Jets (except the QB and lesser so, the coach) mailing it in.

 

[Clonamery]

As I pointed out, the switch to 4 pm could have involved the Giants, Patriots and Ravens, rather than the Jets/Dolphins game. That is evidence. The issue is not that there's no evidence, the issue is whether the evidence is convincing. I don't find it convincing (although I do find it curious), but the league clearly had other viable options and chose to harm the Patriots chances when it didn't need to. Just claiming that it's about money is a copout, because there were other options that would have brought in high ratings.

The Ravens played at 4. Giants fans only show up to 1pm games. Goodell is Goodell, just about everything he does harms the Pats, though if you ask anyone who is not a Pats fan, Kraft has Goodell in his pocket. Go figure.

 

[Pujo]

As I pointed out, the switch to 4 pm could have involved the Giants, Patriots and Ravens, rather than the Jets/Dolphins game. That is evidence. The issue is not that there's no evidence, the issue is whether the evidence is convincing. I don't find it convincing (although I do find it curious), but the league clearly had other viable options and chose to harm the Patriots chances when it didn't need to. Just claiming that it's about money is a copout, because there were other options that would have brought in high ratings.

As other teams pointed out, the Ravens game was already at 4. But moving two games instead of one means the choices really aren't equivilant.

More importantly, even if you could show that there were multiple, equivilant choices, the fact that Goodell chose one over the other doesn't prove his motive. He could have flipped a coin for all we know. The issue is that people see "trends", and then everything snowballs into "Goodell is out to screw the Pats". What about him not suspending Kaczur? Or not suspending Belichick over spygate? I'm not saying suspensions would have been the right course there, but he's certainly has missed some opportunities to take shots at us, if that's what he's after

 

[upstater1]

And I'm not arguing that the change didn't hurt the Pats, but what I'm saying is there is zero evidence that the change was made for the purpose of hurting the Patriots. If you have evidence to the contrary, please lay it out, otherwise it sounds like the same disgruntled blah blah you hear on 19 other teams' messageboards.

Only one poster claimed this was a conspiracy. Most of the rest of us are just saying the NFL screwed the Patriots.

 

[DarrylS]

This kind of thinking I don't understand. If the Patriots had gone 12-4, a couple of more IFs would have us missing the playoffs at 12-4 as well. For example, if Walt Coleman doesn't overturn the ruling on the field in the Steelers-Ravens game, or if Miami doesn't allow a Matt Schaub scramble with 3 seconds left, then the Patriots miss the playoffs with a 12-4 record even with a win over the Jets.

Yes, we could be 12-4 and out of the playoffs right now. I'm just wondering if that would have changed some people's thinking about the system we use.

The same logic applies at 10-6. 11 is just an arbitrary number in the discussion. The point is, the NFL did not maximize its competitive integrity by having 3 games at the same time.

If it had, the Jets would have gone into the second half knowing the Patriots were up only 3-0 on the Bills.

My thinking is that the Pats control their destiny, not Goodell or the Refs, everything balances out in a season for most of the teams.. if there were a couple of these plays as mentioned above we would be talking about the game on Sunday instead of speculating as to why things are not. If we had 12 wins we would be in the tournament..

 

[upstater1]

As other teams pointed out, the Ravens game was already at 4. But moving two games instead of one means the choices really aren't equivilant.

More importantly, even if you could show that there were multiple, equivilant choices, the fact that Goodell chose one over the other doesn't prove his motive. He could have flipped a coin for all we know. The issue is that people see "trends", and then everything snowballs into "Goodell is out to screw the Pats". What about him not suspending Kaczur? Or not suspending Belichick over spygate? I'm not saying suspensions would have been the right course there, but he's certainly has missed some opportunities to take shots at us, if that's what he's after

It wasn't at 4. The Ravens was at 1 pm.

 

[upstater1]

My thinking is that the Pats control their destiny, not Goodell or the Refs, everything balances out in a season for most of the teams.. if there were a couple of these plays as mentioned above we would be talking about the game on Sunday instead of speculating as to why things are not. If we had 12 wins we would be in the tournament..

I'm saying the exact opposite. Are we playing the IF card?

If we are, then there are easy to imagine scenarios where 12 games doesn't get us into the playoffs. Phins beat Texans, Ravens beat Steelers. Both of those games came down to one play.

In the NFL, your destiny is NEVER in your control unless you win 14 games. If you only win 13 games, then conceivably a 3 win team can make the playoffs over a 13 win team. That's why I don't buy the reasoning.

I'm not saying the Patriots got screwed in terms of the playoff berth, because we knew the rules at the start of the season. I'm just not playing this IF game.

Besides, this thread is about the NFL's deliberate decision not to preserve optimal competitive integrity of its games. It makes the claims of Spygate hollow.

 

[Deus Irae]

As other teams pointed out, the Ravens game was already at 4. But moving two games instead of one means the choices really aren't equivilant.

More importantly, even if you could show that there were multiple, equivilant choices, the fact that Goodell chose one over the other doesn't prove his motive. He could have flipped a coin for all we know. The issue is that people see "trends", and then everything snowballs into "Goodell is out to screw the Pats". What about him not suspending Kaczur? Or not suspending Belichick over spygate? I'm not saying suspensions would have been the right course there, but he's certainly has missed some opportunities to take shots at us, if that's what he's after

Belichick's penalty was the most severe in league history, so saying "He could have gotten the chair!" is irrelevant.

The Ravens game was a 1 pm game that was moved to 4 pm along with the Jets game.

Kaczur's punishment was dictated by league policies.

As I said, I find the evidence curious, not convincing, and a more equitable solution could have been found. Or, to put it in police terms, I'd find sufficient basis for continuing an investigation, but not enough evidence to file charges.

 

[Pujo]

Belichick's penalty was the most severe in league history, so saying "He could have gotten the chair!" is irrelevant.

The Ravens game was a 1 pm game that was moved to 4 pm along with the Jets game.

Kaczur's punishment was dictated by league policies.

As I said, I find the evidence curious, not convincing, and a more equitable solution could have been found. Or, to put it in police terms, I'd find sufficient basis for continuing an investigation, but not enough evidence to file charges.

The problem is you will obviously never conclude your investigation for lack of evidence, but the next time any decision that ultimately hurts the Pats is made, you'll use this case as further evidence of a trend. And I'm not saying you specifically, you might be more reasonable than that, but that's been the pattern with dozens of posters on this board.

 

[JMarr]

:spygate: But,

The NFL dropped the ball so to speak on this one. I don't get people saying that it's whining per se to complain about how this could have affected the Jets' performance and thus playoff picture for the Pats. Or how this discussion is silly or irrelevant because "the blame is on the Patriots for not taking care of their own business." (at 11-5 no less!) Would you feel the same if the NFL hadn't moved the Ravens game to 4:00 oclock? I think people would be howling from the rooftops had the Jets been the only game played at 4.

When the NFL/CBS first flexed the Jets and Ravens games, it didn't seem so bad because it would take the perfect storm to make this a real issue. I thought that it was possible that the Pats might lose to Buffalo, the Jacksonville game might be competitive into the second half, or that the Jets would play for pride (some of them did), their coach or their home crowd. None of that occurred and the perfect storm happened.

I was forced to watch the Baltimore game--no cable--and AS SOON the Jests inexpicably allowed the blocked punt, CBS switched BACK over to the (by then completely meaningless) Baltimore game I screamed to my girlfiend that this was a calculated move to make sure that a Jets tank job/give-up would not be allowed to be shown on national TV. Her remark: "You're a conspiracy theorist."

 

[Deus Irae]

The problem is you will obviously never conclude your investigation for lack of evidence, but the next time any decision that ultimately hurts the Pats is made, you'll use this case as further evidence of a trend. And I'm not saying you specifically, you might be more reasonable than that, but that's been the pattern with dozens of posters on this board.

Well, naturally you would do that if you weren't able to close out an earlier investigation. Why wouldn't you? To not look at that 'case' as a possible sign of a trend would be to fail at doing your 'job'. That's just the way it goes when people or organizations don't come clean, even if they have the best of reasons. Now, I'm with you in saying that "curious" does not equal damning proof, but you lose me when you take it further than that.

 

[DarrylS]

I'm saying the exact opposite. Are we playing the IF card?

If we are, then there are easy to imagine scenarios where 12 games doesn't get us into the playoffs. Phins beat Texans, Ravens beat Steelers. Both of those games came down to one play.

In the NFL, your destiny is NEVER in your control unless you win 14 games. If you only win 13 games, then conceivably a 3 win team can make the playoffs over a 13 win team. That's why I don't buy the reasoning.

I'm not saying the Patriots got screwed in terms of the playoff berth, because we knew the rules at the start of the season. I'm just not playing this IF game.

Besides, this thread is about the NFL's deliberate decision not to preserve optimal competitive integrity of its games. It makes the claims of Spygate hollow.

Neither am I, the reason that Pats are not in the playoffs is that a couple of games they did not play well and made some mistakes..

Do not put a lot of stock into the times of the games as major factors, Favre sucked.. he could have sucked @ 1:00 PM or 4:00 PM..

It is not about if, but more about missed opportunities that is all.. they did what they did and now we prepare for next season. Goodell did not do it, the refs did not do it the Pats did it.

 

[RayClay]

I think they should.

The Phin fans were celebrating after the schedule was made, and I understand why they were happy.

Why not, it's only money. One network game on Sunday.

 

[upstater1]

Neither am I, the reason that Pats are not in the playoffs is that a couple of games they did not play well and made some mistakes..

Do not put a lot of stock into the times of the games as major factors, Favre sucked.. he could have sucked @ 1:00 PM or 4:00 PM..

It is not about if, but more about missed opportunities that is all.. they did what they did and now we prepare for next season. Goodell did not do it, the refs did not do it the Pats did it.

Damien Woody said the Jets players knew, during the game, that the Ravens obviously had taken control of the Jags game and had it "well in hand."

It's natural for players to deflate in that situation.