Needs Analysis: Linebacker

[Ochmed Jones]

I am not sold on the four either. However, we seem set for 2009 with six solid linebackers, three inside and three outside.

By saying 3 on the inside and 3 on the outside, are you hinting at the suggestion that the other two LB spots currently being manned by ST only is a waste?

 

[VJCPatriot]

OG? Matt Light wont be getting any faster with age...how bout an ot and slide kaczur to rg? Mankins is one bad mutha...

Mankins is fine based on 2007. Looks worse based on 2008. I'm not worried about Makins though, I'm worried about RG - Neal is continually injured and Yates is just a turnstile at RG. This offensive line looks 10x worse when Yates is in there. In fact, losing Neal to injury early in the Superbowl is probably a huge reason why we lost to the Giants when we had no business doing so. If we can find a starting quality LT that's fine too, but that would require an earlier draft pick and OLB/Pass rusher is a bigger priority imo.

 

[KillEM]

I don't see us drafting a LB in the first four rounds, although a tweener DE/OLB is always a possibility. I expect that we will pay Woods $2.2M to stay for a year under an RFA tender, even if we don't sign a new contract

People like you are the reason franchises like Detroit exist.

 

[KillEM]

But if you're going to upgrade over Crable and Redd - and understanding that no draft pick is a sure thing - you're going to go with a guy with higher upside...to me, that's gotta be Day 1. Redd and Crable already have added to their value by experiencing a year in the Patriots organization, so whoever they add in 08 will be at that disadvantage when it comes to allocating roster spots.

Yeah... we need more LaMarr Woddleys, and less Shawn Crables.

 

[DaBruinz]

People like you are the reason franchises like Detroit exist.

MGTeich has more knowledge in his pinkie than you've shown to possess in that entire gray matter inside your skull.

How many seasons did it take Adalius Thomas to be a full time starter?

 

[DaBruinz]

Yeah... we need more LaMarr Woddleys, and less Shawn Crables.

Again, how many seasons did it take Adalius Thomas to become a full time starter.

Comments like this show the lack of intelligence you have and the severe short-sightedness you posses. It is YOUR comments that are the reason that franchises like Detroit exist. Not MG's.

 

[VJCPatriot]

It's way too early to say what Crable can actually do. However we do know that we need to find an elite Pass Rusher. That much is obvious after watching this season unfold. Whether that be from FA or the draft, just get it done.

 

[KillEM]

Bruinz... Were you molested as a child?

do you expect ppl to even give you a legitimate reply when every post you make is basically "hey look at me, im a piece of **** and i think i know everything". You must have no friends in real life. What a loser.

 

[KillEM]

It is YOUR comments that are the reason that franchises like Detroit exist. Not MG's.

So you'd rather have Crable than Woodley? You're an idiot.

My point was that we need to draft someone like Woodley - high draft pick, safe pick, proven player, ideal size... instead of someone like Crable - lower draft pick, huge project that takes time, never played to his full potential, needs a year on the bench to put on weight, boom or bust pick, etc.

Ofcourse, you're too busy stroking your own ego to realize what any one other than yourself is saying. If you spoke like that in real life I'd smack your teeth down your throat. Get a life cyber genius.

 

[DaBruinz]

So you'd rather have Crable than Woodley? You're an idiot.

I didn't say that. But, as usual, anytime someone contradicts you and shows the fallacy behind your thinking, you throw a temper tantrum.

Woodley works in the Steelers 3-4 ONE GAP defense. The Patriots run a 3-4 2 GAP defense. Its different. And there is no guarantee that Woodley would have the same success. Also, you have to look at who is around Woodley. There are 3 other VERY TALENTED LBs on that team.

To attempt to compare Crable to Woodley is just assinine at this point because you don't know what Crable is capable of. Also, I suggest you go back and review your history a bit. It took Adalius Thomas 3 years to become a full time starter. Woodley did squat last year as a rookie.

My point was that we need to draft someone like Woodley - high draft pick, safe pick, proven player, ideal size... instead of someone like Crable - lower draft pick, huge project that takes time, never played to his full potential, needs a year on the bench to put on weight, boom or bust pick, etc.

As usual, you have no point because the basis for your "opinion" is warped. Any OLB coming into the Pats system is going to be a project. There is no HIGH draft pick that is a safe pick. Proven? I suggest you go and compare Crable's college stats to Woodley's. I think you'll be surprised. Crable was a 3rd round pick. That is hardly a boom or bust pick.

Ofcourse, you're too busy stroking your own ego to realize what any one other than yourself is saying. If you spoke like that in real life I'd smack your teeth down your throat. Get a life cyber genius.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I don't need to stroke "my own ego". Unlike you, I take into consideration what others say. And there are plenty of people whose opinion I listen to and respect, regardless of whether they are the same or differernt than my own.. The difference between you and them is that they actually think out their posts, provide adequate facts in which they've based their opinions on, and show that they have a good understand of the subject being talked about. Those are things you continue to be lacking in.

Hell, you started off tonight by attacking MG and that is just BS. As I said, he's got more football knowledge in his pinkie than you've shown to have in your entire brian. If you don't like it, tough. YOU are the one who has shown a lack of knowledge and understanding of the Patriots. Not myself. And certainly not MG.

 

[KillEM]

Are you MG's girlfriend? You seem pretty defensive.

My point was that giving Woods 2.2 million is ridiculous. Understand?

Now stop being a petty little girl and find something better to do with your time. 10,000 posts of "I iz right. YOU are wrong. I am smartest poster on the entire internetz. YOU are not". What a waste of time. You need a hobby.

 

[DaBruinz]

Are you MG's girlfriend? You seem pretty defensive.

My point was that giving Woods 2.2 million is ridiculous. Understand?

Now stop being a petty little girl and find something better to do with your time. 10,000 posts of "I iz right. YOU are wrong. I am smartest poster on the entire internetz. YOU are not". What a waste of time. You need a hobby.

Gotta love the insults coming from you. They are pretty amazing.

MG has my respect. He's earned that.

As for your "point" about Woods, I went back through the thread and that is the first time you've mentioned anything about giving Woods 2.2 Million. So, you acting like that was some how your point is pretty ridiculous because you've never said anything of the sort.

Why do you think it would be ridiculous to give Woods the 1st round tender offer? It would all but ensure that he re-signed with the Patriots. It would basically keep Woods with the Patriots for 2 more years on top of that because of how the CBA stands currently. Now, could the Patriots offer up a 1.42 mill tender (2nd round)? Sure. But its much more likely that someone would offer Woods a poison pill contract that the Patriots couldn't match. A team like the Jets, maybe?

What you don't seem to understand is that I know I don't know everything, but I know a helluva lot and there have been similar conversations every year about other players. I try to make it a point to remember those things so that I don't look foolish later on. And I've been following football since 1982. So I remember quite a bit. I'm sorry if that offends you, but I am going to post MY opinion when I damn well please and I'll post facts to support it as well.

 

[KillEM]

As for your "point" about Woods, I went back through the thread and that is the first time you've mentioned anything about giving Woods 2.2 Million. So, you acting like that was some how your point is pretty ridiculous because you've never said anything of the sort.

You're inability to read between the lines is astounding.

Why do you think it would be ridiculous to give Woods the 1st round tender offer? It would all but ensure that he re-signed with the Patriots. It would basically keep Woods with the Patriots for 2 more years on top of that because of how the CBA stands currently. Now, could the Patriots offer up a 1.42 mill tender (2nd round)? Sure. But its much more likely that someone would offer Woods a poison pill contract that the Patriots couldn't match. A team like the Jets, maybe?

Woods has not shown any reason why he'd be worth that. He's a STer and back up at best. If he were that good, we wouldn't have even drafted Crable. Everyone sees the need for an upgrade at OLB, except for you.

I've been following football since 1982. So I remember quite a bit. I'm sorry if that offends you, but I am going to post MY opinion when I damn well please and I'll post facts to support it as well.

Ha. Trust me. it doesnt offend me. You are an idiot and a waste of time. Go ahead and state your opinions. Being outspoken doesn't change the fact that your opinion is worthless.

2nd, if you don't like my posts, don't even read them. No one is forcing you to. Right now you bordering on stalker status, following me around in every thread. Go make some friends, corky.

 

[DaBruinz]

You're inability to read between the lines is astounding.

My ability to read between the lines is just fine. Your inability to just say what you mean is what is astounding.

Woods has not shown any reason why he'd be worth that. He's a STer and back up at best. If he were that good, we wouldn't have even drafted Crable. Everyone sees the need for an upgrade at OLB, except for you.

Where to start with all the false information in this paragraph.
1) Crable was drafted because Vrabel's contract is up after next season and Adalius isn't that much younger than Vrabel. Woods had nothing to do with the situation

2) Woods more than held his own as a starter the past couple of weeks. He's more than just a STer and back-up, though that sort of player is needed also.

3) There are several people in this thread who have stated that they don't believe that OLB is an issue.

Ha. Trust me. it doesnt offend me. You are an idiot and a waste of time. Go ahead and state your opinions. Being outspoken doesn't change the fact that your opinion is worthless.

Yes, my opinion is worthless, but you are the one throwing the temper tantrums, getting upset, and showing the lack of intelligence in your personal attacks. You are the one sending the vulgar PMs and making the lude comments.

Sorry, but you've proven that the only opinion that is worthless is yours. I can guarantee you that I am no idiot and that there is more facts as the basis of my opinion than anything you've posted.

2nd, if you don't like my posts, don't even read them. No one is forcing you to. Right now you bordering on stalker status, following me around in every thread. Go make some friends, corky.

Pot: "Hey KETTLE. YOU'RE BLACK"

 

[Taxed in Maine]

No need to draft an OLB in the first round, he would become a very highly paid conversion project for at least one season.

He damn sure wouldn't start in front of Vrabel and Thomas.
By the way, Vrabel was a 3rd rounder who didn't get a start until his fifth year, when he became a patriot, Thomas was a 6th rounder who didn't become a full time starter until his third year.
I don't see an OLB being drafted until the 3rd round, if then.

I mean really, Vernon Golston is looking real good down in NY isn't he. Is that the type of freak pass-rusher your looking for?

Vrabel, Thomas, Crable, Redd, Woods an rfa, Guyton has snaps at OLB, and two more on the practice squad. Yeah we need another OLB

On the other hand the Patriots have ONE safety signed for next year, Meriweather. With no guarantee that Sanders will re-sign. Harrison is done.

I would think it's a good possibility that a high need could be a SS. Someone like William Moore could project as a starter immediately, like Mayo or Mankins.

Let's see,
A) draft a possible starter in an area of need,
or
B) draft a multi-year conversion project in one of our deepest positions.

A - is what the Patriots would do.

B - is what Matt Millen would do.


Taxed

 

[Wotan_the_Wanderer]

Though Rey justifiably gets all the national attention and will most likely be gone by the time Pats get around to picking in the first round, the little guy lining up next to him is a hell of a football player. Have no idea if Maiava is coming out this year and he's probably a bit small for our system, but I'd love to see guys like him brought in on day 2 as projects. Izzo also isn't getting any younger.

 

[DaBruinz]

As things start to flesh out, this is looking to be an extremely deep draft for LBs. The last time the draft was this deep was in 2006 when there were 10 LBers drafted in the 1st 40 picks. There are currently 10 seniors ILBs and OLBs who could go on day 1. And that isn't including the DEs who many figure will be moving to OLB or any of the juniors who might declare.

I believe that this will give the Pats more flexibility in who they can look at for the LB position and will allow them to get 3 truly talented value players on day 1.

 

[TheKraftyOne]

And now there is Robertson, our #12. I don't see us drafting a LB in the first four rounds, although a tweener DE/OLB is always a possibility. I expect that we will pay Woods $2.2M to stay for a year under an RFA tender, even if we don't sign a new contract. That gives us three experienced players inside and out while we see what we have in the kids that haven't played yet: Crable, Redd, Ruud, Robertson.

We may also keep Alexander or Izzo but that is a ST issue not a LB issue.

Robertson blew my final Pats mock up. I had them taking him either in the 3rd or 4th round because I didn't know he was injured. I think they might get something from him down the road. I'd still like to see a player with some strength and speed coming off the edge out of this coming draft.

 

[jsull87]

i am not a very big fan of woods i havent seen him do that much this year i will admit i don't follow him as closley as other players all i am saying is when he has been on the field he has been very missable. on the other hand i know crable was on ir all season but i do remember him making some plays e.g 2 interceptions in the pre season. i think if we take another linebacker i would like either a 1st or 2nd rounder to hopefully rotate/eplace teddy at silb or a later round pick e.g one of our 3's for another olb to hopefully take the reins in a year or 2. but i still am of the opinion it is best to use free agent e.g ad and maybe the likes of suggs to fill imediate roll of someone like vrable at olb until one of our conversions can take the reigns

 

[DaBruinz]

I think its very likely that the Pats put a 2nd round tender on Woods. That would be 1.545 million. I don't think that the Pats offer him more than a 1 year deal, basically doing the same with him that they did with TBC.

Woods has been stellar on special teams since he came to the Pats. This year, he finally started seeing snaps in rotation, but also on the nickel. He was solid, but not spectacular. That being said, he showed improvement, imho, in each game until he got injured. What is puzzling is that the Pass Rush was supposedly his strong point according to both BB and Pees, yet, I didn't see him being turned loose on the pass rush the way Vrabel or Thomas were.

Redd, Crable, Robertson and Craig are X-factors. Redd saw time on special teams after he was activated and occasionally on the pass rush at the end of games.. Robertson got at least 1 black jersey which is really good considering that he was only on the team for a short time. Robertson was very highly touted coming out of college and he could be a steal.

And, for the record, I am not saying that either of the 4 are going to be the answer the Pats are looking for. But I am also not saying that they are scrubs who will amount to anything. I am being honest and realistic in saying that we don't know what the Pats have and anything they give will be a surprise and a bonus.