Would you trade Garoppolo to the Cowboys?

[rochrist]

You guys are all trying to use examples of older quarterbacks being done at a certain age but it's not relivent to today's game. Why does is matter how old Montana/Aikmen were when they retired? Quarterbacks 15 years ago were done at 36. The way the league is now, they will be playing till mid 40s if they choose to. Drew Brees is on record saying he wants to play until 45 and it's more than clear that Brady is going to have to literally get dragged off the field against his own will. I think Manning's neck makes his situation different, but if not for that injury, the dude would probably go to his mid 40s. Even with the neck injury, he still might.

Players all say that. Sure, the rules are more favorable to them now, but the defensive players are bigger, stronger and faster as well. Look at how Tony Romo got crushed on MNF. Anyway, as I've said before, it isn't necessarily big injuries that get you as you grow older. It's the little nagging ones that you can't come back from as fast and that cause a drain on your performance. TB is a pretty imobile QB (although he's been tryng to change that). As he continues to get older, IMHO, it will get harder and harder to protect him effectively enough for him to do his job.

I could be wrong, but I doubt it. Football, at the NFL level, is not a game for the oldsters. I have no doubt a QB in his forties could be a great backup and come in and be outstanding for a few games. I have a lot of doubt that a QB in his forties can survive the 19 (or 20 or 22 if they up the regular season schedule) games it takes to get to the SB.

 

[Brady6]

Your line of thinking is that Brady will not decline at all when he enters his 40s. That would be great. But when you look at NFL history you'll see that he most likely will decline. It's very unlikely that Brady will perform at the level of "Greatest QB of all time", in 4 or 5 years. History has shown us that just as RBs go bad very fast at 30, even the best QBs go bad quickly at 40. When people talk about a successor for Brady they don't talk about the current level of Brady. They talk about the likely declined Brady in a few years.

When talking about giving Garoppolo a new contract in 2017 you seem to completely throw out the fact that he trains with the team and plays in pre season games. Because you talk about it like Belichick has never seen him at all. I think he will have a pretty good idea if Garoppolo is worth keeping or not by then.

Brady will be 38 in 2015, 39 in 2016, and 40 in 2017. That is when his contract ends. Where is this playing into his 40s? He will play his final season under contract.

Practice and preseason is a lot different then a real game. Why would we pay Garopollo a second contract to be are starter when we could just draft a QB in 2016 or 2017 and have them on a rookie contract. You think we can't find a QB with Garopollo talent in a future draft? I cannot see them paying a premium for Garopollo unless he proves he can start and win games prior to the end of his contract.

 

[Oswlek]

Why would we pay Garopollo a second contract to be are starter when we could just draft a QB in 2016 or 2017 and have them on a rookie contrac

Because he would have four years in the system and still get reasonable pay because he hadn't yet proven his value across the league? You really don't think there is significant value in that over just hoping a QB you like becomes available when you need him... and that he can get up to speed immediately?

I understand the consternation over Gop's selection. I wholly disagree with it, but I can at least appreciate it. But this line of reasoning makes no sense at all.

 

[chasa]

Brady will be 38 in 2015, 39 in 2016, and 40 in 2017. That is when his contract ends. Where is this playing into his 40s? He will play his final season under contract.

Practice and preseason is a lot different then a real game. Why would we pay Garopollo a second contract to be are starter when we could just draft a QB in 2016 or 2017 and have them on a rookie contract. You think we can't find a QB with Garopollo talent in a future draft? I cannot see them paying a premium for Garopollo unless he proves he can start and win games prior to the end of his contract.

paying a Backup QB who has never started a game at the end of his rookie deal isn't going to require a commitment of 20 million a year like a typical contract would require.

Should brady retire at 40 after winning 3 more titles, we could sign garrapolo somewhere in the range of 7 million a year, and then draft a new rookie.

at that point Jimmy will either work out and play on a team friendly deal for 4-5 years before getting an "elite" contract, or the rookie will step in and we will repeat the process.

what WONT happen is brady retiring, Jimmy leaving in FA and the patriots signing and starting a rookie while signing an expensive veteran backup, example: see the jets.

 

[Brady6]

My position is pretty simple. No one plays forever. I really don't want to see TB out there struggling like Unitas at the end, or Joe Montana with KC. I'd rather he went out on top. We'll see.

I see know reason that he cannot sustain his current play through the end of 2017 when his contract is scheduled to expire. In which case Garopollo would have to be resigned to be the heir apparent, which is not a guarantee at all. That is my point, Garopollo was drafted to replace Mallett as a backup developmental QB that could be traded if the return is more than they invested.

 

[Brady6]

Because he would have four years in the system and still get reasonable pay because he hadn't yet proven his value across the league? You really don't think there is significant value in that over just hoping a QB you like becomes available when you need him... and that he can get up to speed immediately?

I understand the consternation over Gop's selection. I wholly disagree with it, but I can at least appreciate it. But this line of reasoning makes no sense at all.

I disagree, I don't care about a system when Brady gone the system will change anyway because the next guy is not going to be able to do what he does right away. I would rather hand the ball to a 23 year old then a 28 year old who I will have to replace in less then a decade. I think people overlook the bad times the 49ers had after Young retired in large part due to Young's short tenure as their QB because of his age.

For the record I am fine with the Garopollo pick, I would have made it personally but it is fine. I just disagree with the belief that Garopollo is anything more than a replacement for Mallett as the backup.

 

[Oswlek]

Garopollo was drafted to replace Mallett as a backup developmental QB that could be traded if the return is more than they invested.

No, JG was drafted as a low cost replacement to Mallett and as a possible heir to Tom's throne. As much as we all love Tom, he is at an age when injury rates and risk of decline increase substantially.

That's why Jimmy was worth selecting high, because he is valuable in multiple ways.

 

[Brady6]

paying a Backup QB who has never started a game at the end of his rookie deal isn't going to require a commitment of 20 million a year like a typical contract would require.

Should brady retire at 40 after winning 3 more titles, we could sign garrapolo somewhere in the range of 7 million a year, and then draft a new rookie.

at that point Jimmy will either work out and play on a team friendly deal for 4-5 years before getting an "elite" contract, or the rookie will step in and we will repeat the process.

what WONT happen is brady retiring, Jimmy leaving in FA and the patriots signing and starting a rookie while signing an expensive veteran backup, example: see the jets.

Garopollo grew up in Illinois and played his college ball in Illinois. Maybe he will want to go play for Chicago and the contract we offer will not matter at all he will be gone. Point being that if you want to label a player the heir apparent he should be under contract for the season he will need to take over, Garopollo is not. He is a backup QB that we took 12 picks higher than the last backup QB we took 3 years ago.

 

[Brady6]

No, JG was drafted as a low cost replacement to Mallett and as a possible heir to Tom's throne. As much as we all love Tom, he is at an age when injury rates and risk of decline increase substantially.

That's why Jimmy was worth selecting high, because he is valuable in multiple ways.

He was not a high pick he was 12 picks higher then Mallett who we just traded, we could do the same thing in 3 years with Garopollo.

 

[Oswlek]

I disagree, I don't care about a system when Brady gone the system will change anyway because the next guy is not going to be able to do what he does right away. I would rather hand the ball to a 23 year old then a 28 year old who I will have to replace in less then a decade. I think people overlook the bad times the 49ers had after Young retired in large part due to Young's short tenure as their QB because of his age.

For the record I am fine with the Garopollo pick, I would have made it personally but it is fine. I just disagree with the belief that Garopollo is anything more than a replacement for Mallett as the backup.

We've already seen a season sans Tom and the system was adapted, not ditched.

I also find it odd to complain about turning it over to a 28 year old when in the same breath you claim that there is no reason to believe a 37 year old might decline.

Your Steve Young comment makes no sense because he was 30 when he took over SF, a full three years older than JG will be in 2018, and he had serious issues with concussions.

Sorry, B6, you are completely off base here.

 

[Brady6]

We've already seen a season sans Tom and the system was adapted, not ditched.

I also find it odd to complain about turning it over to a 28 year old when in the same breath you claim that there is no reason to believe a 37 year old might decline.

Your Steve Young comment makes no sense because he was 30 when he took over SF, a full three years older than JG will be in 2018, and he had serious issues with concussions.

Sorry, B6, you are completely off base here.

There is no reason to believe that Brady will not be able to 40. The key thing in that statement is BRADY. First, Garopollo has to be willing to resign, which is not a given. Second, the team will have to be willing to pay him market value, which is very, very far from a given. Then you get a 27 turning 28 year old QB starting his first season in the NFL. The team will likely need to replace Edelman, LaFell, and Vollmer around that time, and Gronkowski will be entering his 30s, so the offense is going to be in rebuild mode, give in a few years to come together and what is left at best 4-6 years of being competitive with Garopollo before a new QB is needed? That does not position this team for long term success and I do not think it is the best approach to moving on from Brady. I would trade Garopollo for a first round pick if possible between now and 2016s draft, take that extra first and our own first and move up to draft Christian Hackenberg in the 2016 draft, have him sit behind Brady for 2016 and 2017, and take over in 2018 at age 24 with 3 years remaining on his rookie contract.

 

[Oswlek]

There is no reason to believe that Brady will not be able to 40. The key thing in that statement is BRADY. First, Garopollo has to be willing to resign, which is not a given. Second, the team will have to be willing to pay him market value, which is very, very far from a given. Then you get a 27 turning 28 year old QB starting his first season in the NFL. The team will likely need to replace Edelman, LaFell, and Vollmer around that time, and Gronkowski will be entering his 30s, so the offense is going to be in rebuild mode, give in a few years to come together and what is left at best 4-6 years of being competitive with Garopollo before a new QB is needed? That does not position this team for long term success and I do not think it is the best approach to moving on from Brady. I would trade Garopollo for a first round pick if possible between now and 2016s draft, take that extra first and our own first and move up to draft Christian Hackenberg in the 2016 draft, have him sit behind Brady for 2016 and 2017, and take over in 2018 at age 24 with 3 years remaining on his rookie contract.

I didn't even realize we were still talking about JG for a first rounder.

Otherwise, your post doesn't follow a solid logical path. Why would it be very, very far from a given that NE would not be willing to pay him market value? Why should I assume all of these players are going to need to be replaced all at once instead of the gradual rebuilding the team has done for over a decade now?

You may end up being correct that Tom plays well through 2020 and the team is forced to move on from Jimmy, but your reasoning is far from sound.

 

[Marinlik]

There is no reason to believe that Brady will not be able to 40. The key thing in that statement is BRADY. First, Garopollo has to be willing to resign, which is not a given. Second, the team will have to be willing to pay him market value, which is very, very far from a given. Then you get a 27 turning 28 year old QB starting his first season in the NFL. The team will likely need to replace Edelman, LaFell, and Vollmer around that time, and Gronkowski will be entering his 30s, so the offense is going to be in rebuild mode, give in a few years to come together and what is left at best 4-6 years of being competitive with Garopollo before a new QB is needed? That does not position this team for long term success and I do not think it is the best approach to moving on from Brady. I would trade Garopollo for a first round pick if possible between now and 2016s draft, take that extra first and our own first and move up to draft Christian Hackenberg in the 2016 draft, have him sit behind Brady for 2016 and 2017, and take over in 2018 at age 24 with 3 years remaining on his rookie contract.

Have you not watched the Pats for the last decade? We rarely ever go into rebuild mode. We constantly rebuild this team. And don't say the receiving core last year. Because that was under extraordinary circumstance.

You do realize that Hackenberg is projected to very early in the draft when he declares, right? 2 first round picks will be no where near enough to trade up for him if we are close our usual draft spot. Especially not if we continue to pick where we usually do. And if our pick is early in the first round, then Brady has most likely begun to play really bad and Garoppolo would most likely get a chance to play.

You say that you can't see the team paying for Garoppolo, even if he suceeds in practise and in pre season, as he seems to have done. But you can see them trade up to the very early picks in the first round to grab a QB that BB has never coached and who has never played a single down in the NFL.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Have you not watched the Pats for the last decade? We rarely ever go into rebuild mode. We constantly rebuild this team. And don't say the receiving core last year. Because that was under extraordinary circumstance.

You do realize that Hackenberg is projected to very early in the draft when he declares, right? 2 first round picks will be no where near enough to trade up for him if we are close our usual draft spot. Especially not if we continue to pick where we usually do. And if our pick is early in the first round, then Brady has most likely begun to play really bad and Garoppolo would most likely get a chance to play.

You say that you can't see the team paying for Garoppolo, even if he suceeds in practise and in pre season, as he seems to have done. But you can see them trade up to the very early picks in the first round to grab a QB that BB has never coached and who has never played a single down in the NFL.

It is dreaming to think that every year produces franchise QBs, It is dreaming to think that you can move up to #1, with even 3 End of First round picks.

Every high QB pick is a gamble, like Jamarcus Russel or Ryan Leaf.

 

[ausbacker]

I'd prefer to keep JAG and let him develop behind Brady but if the Cowboys insist on offering a nice collection of picks for his services then yes, I would trade him. It all depends on the haul coming to Foxboro.

 

[Pessimistic Pete]

Haven't read the thread yet but people here REALLY, REALLY, REALLY need to stop pretending any Patriots backup automatically is worth a 1st round pick to any other team in the league.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Haven't read the thread yet but people here REALLY, REALLY, REALLY need to stop pretending any Patriots backup automatically is worth a 1st round pick to any other team in the league.

When will this damn thread end? BB drafted Polo as a both a backup, and developmental QB.

He ain't for sale, on a Team bidding for a SuperBowl, even if the Cowboys came calling.

Which they haven't done !!!. The Pats don't need another end-of-first round pick. Hell they almost don't need very many picks for the next few years. The only guys over 30 are Wilfork Connolly, and Brady.

And they have Branch, Flemming and Polo behind all three, plus lots of picks to trade, already.

 

[Danger Zone]

If we had traded someone the 2nd round pick we used on Garappolo last year, couldn't we have gotten a first for this year anyway?

 

[Oswlek]

If we had traded someone the 2nd round pick we used on Garappolo last year, couldn't we have gotten a first for this year anyway?

Unlikely. That practice has lessened and it usually took a much higher second to earn a future first.

 

[Brady6]

It is dreaming to think that every year produces franchise QBs, It is dreaming to think that you can move up to #1, with even 3 End of First round picks.

Every high QB pick is a gamble, like Jamarcus Russel or Ryan Leaf.

At this juncture it is dreaming to think Garopollo is a franchise QB as well.