Would you trade Judon?

[archstanton543]

@archstanton543 what do you "disagree" with?
In your experience, have you witnessed a lot of older players participating in a major re-build for ANY major sports franchise?

I disagree because there are still football games to be played. The team needs to play defense in those games. You need playmakers on defense. Judon is a playmaker. He's under contract for reasonable money for another year. I'd like for the team not to get blown out and perhaps even win some games next season even though it's the beginning of a heavy rebuild. Getting a 4th rounder (maybe at best) is not going to help the team next year and you're trading a known quantity for a player who's not going to help right away and who has a high likelihood of busting.

 

[Kdo5]

I disagree because there are still football games to be played. The team needs to play defense in those games. You need playmakers on defense. Judon is a playmaker. He's under contract for reasonable money for another year. I'd like for the team not to get blown out and perhaps even win some games next season even though it's the beginning of a heavy rebuild. Getting a 4th rounder (maybe at best) is not going to help the team next year and you're trading a known quantity for a player who's not going to help right away and who has a high likelihood of busting.

We didn’t need him last season. The defense was solid despite having an absolutely miserable offense. They were on the field constantly and constantly getting stops.

I’m not saying they were some all-time great defense but considering the circumstances it was impressive. If we had a competent offense we could’ve been a playoff team due to our defense.

I think you are overstating his importance. Maybe if our defense fell to pieces when he got injured I’d have a different opinion. But we have talent in that front seven and we can acquire more of it and younger guys.

 

[Scotty]

I can see both sides on this. The defence did seem to manage when he went out injured but if he is back to full strength then he will be a force to be accounted for. I guess it could be down to how the team views him going forwards.....could go either way ?

 

[DaBruinz]

The future of any player over the age of 30 needs to be at least discussed on a team that won 4 games.

Discussing it in terms of what he means to this team from both a production and leadership standpoint.

Let's look. They last McCourty prior to the start of last year and it was telling.
They lost Judon mid-season and the defense reverted more to Bend don't break. Having the top 4 CBs out at one point didn't help, but they survived it and may have found another diamond in the rough in Alex Austin.

Anfernee Jennings FINALLY broke out. He should he's an above average to good DE/OLB who CAN set the edge. Something that Uche never showed he could do.

The interesting thing will be what Mayo's plans are for the defense. Will it be the Hybrid 2-2 that BB was running the last few years? Will it be more of a traditional 3-4, a traditional 4-3, a 4-3 Over? Will it be something else entirely?

Unless they are certain that someone like Josh Allen (DE) or Chase Young can bring the leadership on the field and int the Lockerroom that Judon brings, then they need to stick with Judon. They can STILL bring in one of the other guys. They certainly have the money to do so.

 

[zimmy]

He's a soon to be 32 year old player on a big contract who will be past his prime by the time we are ready to compete. This is an easy sell for a 3rd or more.

 

[DaBruinz]

We didn’t need him last season. The defense was solid despite having an absolutely miserable offense. They were on the field constantly and constantly getting stops.

I’m not saying they were some all-time great defense but considering the circumstances it was impressive. If we had a competent offense we could’ve been a playoff team due to our defense.

I think you are overstating his importance. Maybe if our defense fell to pieces when he got injured I’d have a different opinion. But we have talent in that front seven and we can acquire more of it and younger guys.

We didn't? Hmm.. So, it was my imagination that the Pats gave up 38 and 34 in back to back games starting with Judon's injury?

They gave up 21ppg in the 1st 3 games.

38, 34, 21, 29, 31, 20, 10, 10, 6, 21, 27, 26, 27, 17 = 317 = 22.6 ppg

The 10, 10, and 6 were against the 10th ranked offense in the Colts, the 30th ranked offense in the Giants, and the 21st ranked offense in the Chargers. Not exactly world beaters..

I think you're severely understanding Judon's importance from a leadership perspective.

 

[DaBruinz]

He's a soon to be 32 year old player on a big contract who will be past his prime by the time we are ready to compete. This is an easy sell for a 3rd or more.

Judon is NOT on a big contract. His contract is not even middle of the pack for Edge players.


You're smoking cheap stuff if you think you're getting anything better than a 5th round pick.

 

[Kdo5]

We didn't? Hmm.. So, it was my imagination that the Pats gave up 38 and 34 in back to back games starting with Judon's injury?

They gave up 21ppg in the 1st 3 games.

38, 34, 21, 29, 31, 20, 10, 10, 6, 21, 27, 26, 27, 17 = 317 = 22.6 ppg

The 10, 10, and 6 were against the 10th ranked offense in the Colts, the 30th ranked offense in the Giants, and the 21st ranked offense in the Chargers. Not exactly world beaters..

I think you're severely understanding Judon's importance from a leadership perspective.

Context. How many of those points came directly off of god awful interceptions and bad field position?

The ineptitude of the offense played a big role in a lot of the points that were actually scored.

 

[archstanton543]

We didn’t need him last season. The defense was solid despite having an absolutely miserable offense. They were on the field constantly and constantly getting stops.

I don't agree. You always need an elite pass rusher. You always need an elite player at any position wherever you can find them.

 

[archstanton543]

He's a soon to be 32 year old player on a big contract who will be past his prime by the time we are ready to compete. This is an easy sell for a 3rd or more.

6 mil and change isn't a big contract.

 

[DaBruinz]

And YES, I expect the Franchise tags to be used on DE Josh Allen, Chase Young, and Brian Burns.

 

[1960Pats]

This season out of the top 20 players in sacks only 3 of them are 30 or over. Last season it was it was 5 out of 20. Out of the 5 in 2022 none of them were top 20 in sacks this season.

If we were in win now mode I say roll the dice and sign Judon to a short extension and hope he doesn't decline like most pass rushers in their 30's. This is a rebuilding team and we need to be stockpiling picks and figuring out which guys on rookie contracts can play not investing in declining assets. If we can get something of value for Judon now I would.

I'm not sure the Pats are as far off as you think.

 

[DaBruinz]

It will be interesting to see if the Pats look at guys like Bryce Huff and A.J. Epenesa who are not the greatest at setting the edge but are better pass rushers or if they go with a Malik Harrison who is better at run defense and provides little in the way of pass rush.

 

[203Pat]

I'm not sure the Pats are as far off as you think.

We are needy at some high price positions on offense in a lean year for offensive free agents. Both tackle spots, at least one starting caliber receiver, and at least one starting caliber TE and this is considering we draft a QB. Even if we hit on the QB in this draft and one of those spots I just mentioned we are still short in multiple areas. If, and it is a major if, we hit on a rookie QB I still think we aren't likely to be competing in the playoffs till 2026. Judon would be 34 entering 2026 and more likely to be out of the league than a high end pass rusher.

 

[Boomer B]

30+ coming off an injury on a rebuilding team. No chance anyone would give a 2nd. I’d take a 3rd all day long for him.

 

[SammyBlueCat]

I disagree because there are still football games to be played. The team needs to play defense in those games. You need playmakers on defense. Judon is a playmaker. He's under contract for reasonable money for another year. I'd like for the team not to get blown out and perhaps even win some games next season even though it's the beginning of a heavy rebuild. Getting a 4th rounder (maybe at best) is not going to help the team next year and you're trading a known quantity for a player who's not going to help right away and who has a high likelihood of busting.

That's true: a young player may be a bust.

Never the less this team will trend younger (and cheaper) regardless of who us fans like or dislike.

The Patriots are going to "clean house"...

 

[tasmlab]

I'd like to know where Judon's heart is at the moment. I was under the impression that a lot of his excitement for the team was to play for Belichick's program. (I don't know if this is true, just seemed like it to me from watching TV, hearing him talk). And it's not like the team has done much good since he's arrived.

Great player, though, and I agree with other posters about him being a leader and a locker room/culture guy.

 

[SammyBlueCat]

@archstanton543 you really like that "I don't agree" button.

That's your choice - no harm no foul except it draws attention back to the posts.

There's no way to place a friendly wager using this site.... (I don't drink beer anyways)

Only time will tell who is right and who is wrong.

 

[TheRainMaker]

We didn’t need him last season. The defense was solid despite having an absolutely miserable offense. They were on the field constantly and constantly getting stops.

You always need a pass rusher. Look what happened in this Super Bowl with all the money SF spent on their DL and they failed to show up when it mattered. Mahomes and the O walked right down the field to tie and then win the game. Even with an offense, the defense has to have a pass rush if they expect to compete in this league.

He's a soon to be 32 year old player on a big contract who will be past his prime by the time we are ready to compete. This is an easy sell for a 3rd or more.

Big contract? His contract is a bargain.

 

[archstanton543]

@archstanton543 you really like that "I don't agree" button.

That's your choice - no harm no foul except it draws attention back to the posts.

There's no way to place a friendly wager using this site.... (I don't drink beer anyways)

Only time will tell who is right and who is wrong.

If I don't agree, I'm going to "smash" that "I don't agree button".