Would you trade Garoppolo to the Cowboys?

[rochrist]

It's hardly a wall of text. I am not sure what exactly "your mind" is. Do you really think that between now and the end of 2017 Jimmy Garopollo will give us a better chance to win then Brady? You seem to think that Brady will not be here but what has Brady done to merit this thinking? Has his play diminished, is his cap number higher then his worth to the team? Garopollo is never going to be good enough to justify pushing arguably the best QB ever out the door early, so I do not understand your position at all.

My position is pretty simple. No one plays forever. I really don't want to see TB out there struggling like Unitas at the end, or Joe Montana with KC. I'd rather he went out on top. We'll see.

 

[Deus Irae]

My position is pretty simple. No one plays forever. I really don't want to see TB out there struggling like Unitas at the end, or Joe Montana with KC. I'd rather he went out on top. We'll see.

Joe Montana took the Chiefs to the AFCCG. They hadn't gotten that far since the merger.

 

[rochrist]

Joe Montana took the Chiefs to the AFCCG. They hadn't gotten that far since the merger.

He also went to KC at age 37, could only play 11 games his first year, 14 his second and had a combined qb rating for the two years of 85. He was hardly the Joe Montana of legend. Note also that he was done at 38.

 

[Deus Irae]

He also went to KC at age 37, could only play 11 games his first year, 14 his second and had a combined qb rating for the two years of 85. He was hardly the Joe Montana of legend. Note also that he was done at 38.

You seem to be ignoring the reality of the lower QB rating back then. He was 5th in QB rating in his second to last season, and 8th in his last.

And, again, he took that team to the AFCCG, despite his injuries.

 

[rochrist]

You seem to be ignoring the reality of the lower QB rating back then. He was 5th in QB rating in his second to last season, and 8th in his last.

And, again, he took that team to the AFCCG, despite his injuries.

His average rating over his last five years at SF was 102. Great, he was good enough to take KC to the AFC championship game. You know who else 'took' their team to TWO AFC championship games? Mark Sanchez.

 

[Deus Irae]

His average rating over his last five years at SF was 102. Great, he was good enough to take KC to the AFC championship game. You know who else 'took' their team to TWO AFC championship games? Mark Sanchez.

His last 'full' year in SF, his QB rating was 89.0

The 5 year span you are pointing to had ratings of

102.1
87.9
112.4
89.0
118.4 (just one game)

and, if you add in the year prior, in order to get 5 'full' years, you go back to 1986, where his QB rating was 80.7, in 8 games.

Also, regarding his games played, which you cited in your previous post, Montana only played 16 games 4 times in 15 seasons.

Care to try again?

 

[AzPatsFan]

It was a terrible pick. Calling others "self professed experts" when you're grading the pick as a "no brainer" yourself, is the height of irony, btw.

Are you just trolling for amusement now? You ought to use the /sarc on suffix ending. lol.

 

[Deus Irae]

Are you just trolling for amusement now? You ought to use the /sarc on suffix ending. lol.

You thought Brady was going to be pushed aside for Mallett. When it comes to QBs, you should never, ever, post.

 

[rochrist]

His last 'full' year in SF, his QB rating was 89.0

The 5 year span you are pointing to had ratings of

102.1
87.9
112.4
89.0
118.4 (just one game)

and, if you add in the year prior, in order to get 5 'full' years, you go back to 1986, where his QB rating was 80.7, in 8 games.

Also, regarding his games played, which you cited in your previous post, Montana only played 16 games 4 times in 15 seasons.

Care to try again?

Seeing as how I actually watched the games he played for KC, I don't need to try again. He wasn't the player he was at SF. If you think he was, you're mistaken.

 

[Deus Irae]

Seeing as how I actually watched the games he played for KC, I don't need to try again. He wasn't the player he was at SF. If you think he was, you're mistaken.

Seeing as how I never claimed that he was "the same player", you're building another straw man. The reality is, no matter how much you try to deny it, that the Montana era in K.C., while short, is the best they've had since Dawson. Or to put it another way:

The Chiefs have not won a playoff game since Joe Montana was the team's QB.

 

[AzPatsFan]

You thought Brady was going to be pushed aside for Mallett. When it comes to QBs, you should never, ever, post.

You complain of people putting words in your mouth. Please
don't do it to others. Having a good and inexpensive backup, and a possible successor vs having no one, is not what you said, nor my position.

 

[Deus Irae]

You complain of people putting words in your mouth. Please
don't do it to others. Having a good and inexpensive backup, and a possible successor vs having no one, is not what you said, nor my position.

That's not putting words in your mouth. You posted that. Unfortunately, it's in the older archives. But here's you talking QB earlier this year:

who is an NFL QB in this draft class then?

Nobody.

1. Most important is the position he plays. Tom Brady is going to be the starter here for the next 3 seasons. It makes no sense to pick a player who is unlikely to see the field for 3 years with a #1 pick. C'mon guys Lets be reasonable here.


Sorry Ken. You are dreaming. The end is coming for both Peyton and Tom and it is NOT three years or more away. Both have visibly lost some talent. Peyton's arm is nowhere what it used to be. He floats his passes now.

Both are getting by with experience and wile now, But for how much longer?

Tom's long accuracy, never great to start with is visibly declining, as is his pocket shuffling mobility. Credit some of his declining completion percentage to the new receivers last season, if you wish; but the reality is still it was below 60% and his QB rating was only mediocre.

No one wants to say it but Time waits for no man.

 

[rochrist]

Seeing as how I never claimed that he was "the same player", you're building another straw man. The reality is, no matter how much you try to deny it, that the Montana era in K.C., while short, is the best they've had since Dawson. Or to put it another way:

The Chiefs have not won a playoff game since Joe Montana was the team's QB.

So, given that, what does any of it have to do with what I was talking about?

Also. I notice how skillfully you just flew right by Mark Sanchez taking the Jets to back to back AFC championship games.

 

[Deus Irae]

So, given that, what does any of it have to do with what I was talking about?

Montana was still top 10 in QB rating (your cited stat) and was still bringing his team deep into the playoffs in his second to last season. The "go out on top" doesn't get much better than that, short of pulling an Elway.

Also. I notice how skillfully you just flew right by Mark Sanchez taking the Jets to back to back AFC championship games.

Before Sanchez, Pennington won playoff games with the Jets. Before Pennington, Testaverde took the Jets to the AFCCG.

Unless you're trying to claim that the Chiefs carried Montana to the AFCCG the way the Jets carried Sanchez, there's no need to mention Sanchez. And you're not that crazy, are you?

 

[rochrist]

Considering Montana threw 13 TDs and 7 ints while completing 60 percent of his passes, I'm not sure you could say he 'carried' the Chiefs to the championship game either. He was pretty much a game manager by that point.

 

[chasa]

strawman arguments, you are all using strawman arguments!!!!

/sarc

 

[Marinlik]

It's hardly a wall of text. I am not sure what exactly "your mind" is. Do you really think that between now and the end of 2017 Jimmy Garopollo will give us a better chance to win then Brady? You seem to think that Brady will not be here but what has Brady done to merit this thinking? Has his play diminished, is his cap number higher then his worth to the team? Garopollo is never going to be good enough to justify pushing arguably the best QB ever out the door early, so I do not understand your position at all.

Your line of thinking is that Brady will not decline at all when he enters his 40s. That would be great. But when you look at NFL history you'll see that he most likely will decline. It's very unlikely that Brady will perform at the level of "Greatest QB of all time", in 4 or 5 years. History has shown us that just as RBs go bad very fast at 30, even the best QBs go bad quickly at 40. When people talk about a successor for Brady they don't talk about the current level of Brady. They talk about the likely declined Brady in a few years.

When talking about giving Garoppolo a new contract in 2017 you seem to completely throw out the fact that he trains with the team and plays in pre season games. Because you talk about it like Belichick has never seen him at all. I think he will have a pretty good idea if Garoppolo is worth keeping or not by then.

 

[Deus Irae]

Considering Montana threw 13 TDs and 7 ints while completing 60 percent of his passes, I'm not sure you could say he 'carried' the Chiefs to the championship game either. He was pretty much a game manager by that point.

I didn't claim Montana carried the Chiefs. I said he took them to the AFCCG, which he did, and this was in the context of your comments about going out on top.

 

[New England Pride]

You guys are all trying to use examples of older quarterbacks being done at a certain age but it's not relivent to today's game. Why does is matter how old Montana/Aikmen were when they retired? Quarterbacks 15 years ago were done at 36. The way the league is now, they will be playing till mid 40s if they choose to. Drew Brees is on record saying he wants to play until 45 and it's more than clear that Brady is going to have to literally get dragged off the field against his own will. I think Manning's neck makes his situation different, but if not for that injury, the dude would probably go to his mid 40s. Even with the neck injury, he still might.

 

[rochrist]

I didn't claim Montana carried the Chiefs. I said he took them to the AFCCG, which he did, and this was in the context of your comments about going out on top.

Well, he did play one more year after that, but I take your point. Hopefully, TB can take the Pats a little bit further in the next couple of years.