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The Front Office killed it this Off-Season

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by MUFC7, Oct 29, 2012.

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  1. MUFC7

    MUFC7 Rookie

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    The front office gave both Gronk and Hernandez contracts that at first glance seem to be pretty good for both sides. I strongly believe in a few years we will look back and say, that this contracts were simply a stroke of genius let me explain why.

    1) The revolution of the tight end position. When the New England Patriots drafted their 2 new tight ends in 2010 nobody could anticipate what impact they would make on the NFL. The Patriots were the first to play a 2 TE set on a regular basis, simply because their Tight Ends were also great receivers. The league was in awe of the new offense the Patriots had fund. Of course there were already many great tight ends in the league like a Tony Gonzalez, Witten or a Antonio Gates, but no team ever had 2 Tight ends this good. Since that time every team wants to find themselves a Gronk or Hernandez.

    2) Versatility. In 2011 Gronk broke every record there is for a TE and was with Hernandez the best TE duo of all time. What the 2010 season already indicated now turned out to be true. This tight ends are good enough to be counted even as a receiver. Gronks production and play last year was nothing short of amazing. He produced like a top5 WR AND blocked like a top5 tight end. How he handled Suggs in the AFCCG was simply great. Hernandez missed 2 games and still nearly reached the 1000 receiving yards. He can't block aswell as Gronk but has improved tremendously compared to his rookie season. But compared to Gronk he is even more versatile! He can even play HB if needed and looked pretty impressive in his outings. When he lines up he can beat you down the field, play great in the slot or just simply block the way for the RB. Except Percy Harvin and maybe Peterson there isn't a more versatile player in the NFL.

    3)Finances. One of the first rules of economics is: Demand determines the price. But when was the last time one TE this good hit the FA ... You're right it's been a long long time. So we don't even now the value of this 2 tight ends because there simply hasn't been a TE good enough to be compared to Gronk or Hernandez to hit the FA. Let us compare their respective contracts to WR with similiar production. Gronks production can't be compared to any WR that hit the FA last year. The best WR to hit the FA last year was Vincent Jackson. He had a 1106 yards 9 tds season and got a contract that averages 11m$ over 5 years. Gronk had a 1327 yards 17 tds season and got a contract that averages around 7m$ until 2019 (if they take the option)
    If you compare Hernandez to other WR with his production or similiar production like Pierre Garcon and Stevie Johnson he averages less than both of these guys who had similiar prodcution and Hernandez even missed 2 games.

    Yesterday was another great Gronk performance and we all know how good a fit Aaron Hernandez can be. I just wanted to point out what an amazing job the front office did with both these guys to lock them up for a long time in New England. The versatility they give this offense is unmatched and like I told you they can be compared to WR even though they do a lot more for this offense.

    PS: I hope all of you make it safe through hurricane Sandy.
  2. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    It's still early but it looks like a solid offseason.

    The team's main concern was the secondary, and it still remains to be seen if Dennard and one of Wilson/Gregory can become reliable options at their positions. If that happens, the secondary may still need work but at least it's considerable progress. The issues we had would have been very difficult to patch up in one offseason, but if we scored 2 guys that can play starter snaps at a reasonable level it's a success.

    It looks like Lloyd is going to help this offense alot and fills a need.

    Jones/Hightower are meeting or exceeding expectations thus far.

    If Ninko and Cunningham continues their play of recent weeks it'll lessen the blow of the Fanene/Scott failures. Even moreso if Bequette can contribute anything.
  3. condon84

    condon84 Rookie

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    Crushed it.
  4. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    #93 Jersey

    They crushed the draft too.

    Jones, Hightower, Dennard, the much-maligned pick Wilson

    Then kudos for keeping the faith in guys like Cunningham and Ninkovich, and in letting Scar work his magic on developing O-line depth despite substantial turnover

    #1 best run organization in all of sports
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2012
  5. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    MUFC7, that is a great analysis.

    The comparison between the VJackson and Gronk contracts and their 2011 performances (along with Gronk's versatility as a blocker is "game, set and match".

    Not to mention, VJackson turns 30 in just a few weeks compared to Gronk and Hernando (who are probably STILL growing at 23! :) ).

    Edit: Aaron H TURNS 23 in 8 days!
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2012
  6. FreeTedWilliams

    FreeTedWilliams pfadmins PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    You also have to give them credit for the drafting of the two tackles, Vollmer and Solder, when it wasn't a great "need" at the time. Now they are set with a pretty solid young, o-line with solid back-ups.

    Now if they could some how find a shut down corner and a guy who can actually play saftey, this team would be unbeatable!
  7. MrNathanDrake

    MrNathanDrake Rookie

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    If Fanene wasn't injured, the FO wouldve really killed it!
  8. MUFC7

    MUFC7 Rookie

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    If they could've signed Welker to a 3 year extension it would've been perfect.
    But with those 2 guys we have 2 very dangerous weapons for years to come.
    Just look at how this offense evolved from 2009 to 2011.

    Everyone hoped the secondary would be better and I can't really fault the FO for this. With Gregory they got a FA safety who they thought would help our poor safety play. Injuries and very inconsistent performances made that one not working out very good so far. A good CB in the FA is very hard to get and I don't know if I would've really wanted it. Finnegan and Carr were the best CBs in the FA this year and what I've seen from them, they are not playing constant enough to warrant their contracts and don't get me started on the fallen shutdown corner Nnamdi.
  9. aluminum seats

    aluminum seats Rookie

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    Yeah, whatever happened there was unfortunate--that was their first target, and the ongoing need for an interior rush is clear. Too bad.
  10. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    The FO is basically suing Fanene about the hidden medical info, so that one may warrant a pass.
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2012
  11. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    #3 Jersey

    Few things are more obvious than how smart wrapping up Kong & Aaron the Navigator was.

    It need hardly be "explained."
  12. MUFC7

    MUFC7 Rookie

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    Yeah, why bother even giving the FO some credit after that performance from Gronk yesterday. We should bash them for not fixing this secondary and why we are only 5-3
  13. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Shmessy: here's how young GRONKnandez are (I posted this before, but bears repeating):

  14. Ivan

    Ivan On the Roster

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    #75 Jersey


    Fanene and waters were really the only missteps and both are excusable in that they thopught Fanane was healthy and they thought Waters was returning.
  15. patfanken

    patfanken On the Roster

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    #91 Jersey

    Very interesting thread. The FO certainly DID crush it with the Gronk and Hernandez signings. The value we will get for those contracts over the next 4 years compared to the impact of those 2 players is outstanding.....especially when you consider what has being paid to other receivers out there.

    However since we have little to do the next 2 weeks we might as well pick at the scabs of what in reality has been an outstanding off season.

    THE DRAFT -

    Jones, Hightower, Wilson, Dennard and Ebner have to be all considered home runs....at this point of their careers if you consider expectations, impact, and snaps. How they all end up is still a question,but at this moment in time those 5 players have been good picks.

    Jake Bequette however is another story. Granted like the others, we have no idea how this kid will turn out, but given his impact so far, (or lack thereof) I bet the Draft gurus here could drop some names with perfect 20-20 vision, that could have been found at the end of the 3rd round or the beginning of the 4th that would have proven more impactful in a perfect world

    Ebert looked like a decent pick in the 7th, but I guess not. He not only didn't make our PS, but we literally gave up a pick to get another PS player who isn't as fast. So I guess he wasn't that good. BTW- IIRC I don't think he hooked on with another PS. Am I right on that?

    FA -

    Here we had a lot less success.

    1. We'd all like to have a Red Bryant do over, especially given the way the Jonathan Fenene thing turned out. How much better would we be right now if we he had someone capable of pushing the pocket better than what we have now. A healthy Fenene would have been a big plus, let alone Red Bryant and a few less million dollars

    2. The Brian Waters fiasco - I don't know how much better the OL might have been with Waters on board and how all the rest of pieces fit, but, but it couldn't have hurt to know earlier how it would end. My guess is the blame is more on Waters than the Pats for his indecision, but in this perfect off season, you'd like to think something could have been done.

    3. The long list of FA signees (( think we had the most in the league by far), and the long list of those signees who got cut

    4. The number of FA signees who have actually had an impact.

    DFells - no
    M Hoo hoo - no
    VShianco - no
    Bobby Carpenter - no
    Ballard - no
    M Cole - No (but on the rise)
    SGregory - Yes (but not in the last 4 games due to injury)
    BLloyd - Yes

    So we signed 13 FA's this off season IIRC, and right now only 1 and a half have had any impact. That's not exactly stellar......so far. Especially when you consider the season before we signed 2 FA's that turned out to be first team all pros and another who got 10 sacks and a big contract elsewhere.

    5. I'm OK we didn't sign Wekler to a long term deal worth in excess of $8MM/yr, though in an ideal world they could have gotten something done in the $6MM/yr area.

    So whlie this was a great off season. Better than most. It wasn't perfect and we can strive to be better :D
  16. cmasspatsfan

    cmasspatsfan Rookie

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    Donald Thomas has been a solid player also, I thought he had a good game yesterday.
  17. The Gr8est

    The Gr8est Rookie

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    Ebert was signed to the Eagles PS. I don't know his current status.
  18. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    I give the FO an A-, the problem is they have to face reality regarding the CB position:

    1) If you want a top 20 CB that can actually cover, you're going to have to overpay. Brandon Carr and Cortland Finnegan for example, would be helping this team big time right now, but they were too expensive.

    2.) Stop drafting these shoulda coulda woulda 2nd round CBs. Butler played at UConn but he must be nasty, Wheatley was injury prone in college but he must be nasty, ditto Dowling.

    I just never see the CB situation fixed if they dont dish out money.
  19. The Gr8est

    The Gr8est Rookie

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    So were Finnegan and Carr undrafted?
  20. MUFC7

    MUFC7 Rookie

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    Agree with almost everything you said except the FA 3-4 part. It was clear that alot of those FA signings were gambles. We had so many WRs on this roster that I would give the FO even credit for getting so many good WRs on paper. I mean it's their job and they could have had a way easier competition for a WR spot and still choose the Pats. Shiancoe and Ballard were always projected to be healthy at the end of the season or next season. Fells and Hoohoo made a few plays but yeah not nearly enough. Llyod was a great deal. 3 years and 12m$ only in New England. Jury is still out on Gregory.

    There is always room for improvement, but if you'd ask any Pats fan how he would feel about getting both Gronk and Hernandez to a long term contract they would celebrate Yo soy fiesta style :D
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