Tavon Wilson Era Possibly Over

[Off The Grid]

You have to figure draft position into the equation to have a more accurate reflection of what takes place. The Bills in particular have drafted in top top ten of each round repeatedly during the Belichick era and three Jets and fish weren't far behind them. Given their draft position its amazing that the Patriots have been able to stay on top so consistently for so long.

Yep.

Anyone who doesn't consider Bill The Mad (Genius) an absolutely brilliant General Manager has evidently been asleep for the last 15 Years. I may've considered the Tavon Wilson Pick stupid ~ I did ~ but I shouldn't have to point out to Adult Mammals that brilliant People sometimes do stupid things.

It doesn't render them suddenly stupid.

Just...Human.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Lowly human!

 

[PatsFan2]

Did the Tavon Wilson error ever started??never mind.

 

[Tunescribe]

I've long since understood, Scribe, old kid, that your Idea of "good writing" is defined not by Quality, but by Abject, Unquestioning Obedience to what you perceive to be "Good Grammar".

This, of course, is because you are utterly bereft of Talent or Skill, sense this to be the case, I think, and quite demonstrably seek to compensate by painting yourself as an Authority Figure in lieu of actual Accomplishment, this being a common Failing among The Helplessly Mediocre.

I, on the other hand, while honoring such GuideLines and generally adhering to them myself, feel no need to compensate such as you do, and take my Liberties where I like. I admire the Allemanian propensity to capitalize Nouns, and have integrated that into my Writing, which pleases me.

But, hey: If I ever find myself giving a Rat's Ass what a pathetic and infantile No Talent Hack such as yourself thinks about my Writing Style, I'll be sure to send you a Memo.

Grammar ... punctuation ... common respect for others ... rudimentary football knowledge -- what else do you not give a "rat's ass" about? You are in dire need of remedial assistance. I'm only trying to help here, as a service to yourself and others faced with wading through your haughty meanderings.

 

[Froob]

Disagree completely. Richards is a really smart and instinctive young player and I think he'd going to turn into a really good player for them.

Agreed. That play where he pushed the Jags' wide out out of bounds gives me confidence he can be a good player.

 

[captain stone]

I don't care what anybody says. It was all worth it for this.

Baltimore Ravens quarterback Tyrod Taylor throws pick six

Nice pick-6, but no, it wasn't all worth it just for that.

 

[Froob]

Nice pick-6, but no, it wasn't all worth it just for that.

A douchey pick six return for like 70 yards in garbage time vs those dbags in their own house wasn't worth a second round pick? That's capital well spent in my book.

 

[captain stone]

But the fact is. If Belichick is drafting successfully in the 2nd round more than 60% of the time, we should be singing his praises, not condemning him for failing to do the impossible.

And we would indeed be singing his praises had he drafted successfully in the 2nd round more than 60% of the time…which he hasn't.

 

[captain stone]

True, but there is still a difference between drafting a player that is projected to be a second or third round player that doesn't live up to the expectations and trying to be extra smart and drafting a 5+ round talent in the second round.

Bingo.

This is the point that many people have failed to grasp: had Bill simply played the chalk with his
2nd-round picks, his success rate would be greater - far greater - than it currently is.
But he has constantly busted on guys whom he drafted ahead - in too many cases, way ahead -
of their projected slots, because Bill either fancies himself the smartest man in the room, or has a
room full of incompetent talent evaluators.

 

[Deus Irae]

If you don't like the Wilson pick, you can't also like the Jamie Collins pick. Both were "reaches" and widely panned.

Your argument doesn't hold water. The issue with Collins was need at other positions (such as the need for a safety due to the blown pick that was Tavon Wilson). The issue with Wilson was his ability to play his position.

 

[Danger Zone]

And we would indeed be singing his praises had he drafted successfully in the 2nd round more than 60% of the time…which he hasn't.

1 Rob Gronkowski
1 Eugene Wilson
1 Jaime Collins
1 Deion Branch
1 Matt Light
1 Shane Vereen
1 Patrick Chung
1 Brandon Spikes
1 Sebastian Vollmer
1 Darius Butler
+9

0 Aaron Dobson
0 Jordan Richards
0 Jimmy Garappolo

-1 Tavon Wilson
-1 Ras-I-Dowling
-1 Ron Brace
-1 Marquise Hill
-1 Adrian Klemm
-1 Jermaine Cunningham
-1 Terrence Wheatley
-1 Chad Jackson
-1 Bethel Johnson
-9

Over 17 years, the Patriots draft on average at the 52nd spot in the second. That number climbs to the 56th spot if you drop 2000 and 2001.

From how I grade it (bust/not a bust/to be determined) Belichick is still above average (60% bust rate) for what is probably his worst round. If 3 of the "to be determined" end up out of the league and rated as "busts" he would still be hitting league average.

You are undoubtedly much more knowledgeable about NFL players than I am. However, it is my understanding that there is huge gap between the NFL professionals and the media/football enthusiast analysts. I think you are putting too much weight on what the latter are "projecting".

 

[IllegalContact]

1 Rob Gronkowski
1 Eugene Wilson
1 Jaime Collins
1 Deion Branch
1 Matt Light
1 Shane Vereen
1 Patrick Chung
1 Brandon Spikes
1 Sebastian Vollmer
1 Darius Butler
+9

0 Aaron Dobson
0 Jordan Richards
0 Jimmy Garappolo

-1 Tavon Wilson
-1 Ras-I-Dowling
-1 Ron Brace
-1 Marquise Hill
-1 Adrian Klemm
-1 Jermaine Cunningham
-1 Terrence Wheatley
-1 Chad Jackson
-1 Bethel Johnson
-9

Over 17 years, the Patriots draft on average at the 52nd spot in the second. That number climbs to the 56th spot if you drop 2000 and 2001.

From how I grade it (bust/not a bust/to be determined) Belichick is still above average (60% bust rate) for what is probably his worst round. If 3 of the "to be determined" end up out of the league and rated as "busts" he would still be hitting league average.

You are undoubtedly much more knowledgeable about NFL players than I am. However, it is my understanding that there is huge gap between the NFL professionals and the media/football enthusiast analysts. I think you are putting too much weight on what the latter are "projecting".

connor barwin

 

[TheFlyingWedge]

I been meaning to ask: What made you pick that UserName?? I, for one, find it awesome...And I'm shocked that anyone would not only know the term but employ it as a Moniker!!

Thanks m8!! - I had a crusty old high school football coach (who could barely walk) that told us about running "The Flying Wedge" play up the middle as a college fullback in his glory days. In addition to having an awesome name (with its double-meaning), it was just old school nasty smash-mouth at its finest. I found this link that breaks down The Greatest Play in Football.

I made the avatar in Photoshop a while back and not sure who the guy is (Knute Rockne?), but wanted an old school leather helmet-wearing character with wings.

 

[jmt57]

In a comparison to the other AFCE teams during BB's tenure, the Pats have had more picks but a smaller % of them are still in the NFL. These numbers are from the last time I checked, which was before the last season.

Buff
Total players drafted 132 - %
Still on team 29 - 0.22
Playing on other teams 26 - 0.20
Out of football 77 - 0.58

Mia
Total players drafted 121 - %
Still on team 26 - 0.21
Playing on other teams 39 - 0.32
Out of football 56 - 0.46

NE
Total players drafted 144 - %
Still on team 35 - 0.24
Playing on other teams 23 - 0.16
Out of football 86 - 0.60

NYJ
Total players drafted 110 - %
Still on team 27 - 0.25
Playing on other teams 27 - 0.25
Out of football 56 - 0.51

So despite being allotted a later starting position (draft slot) than the three other teams (and having a first round pick stolen for filming from the wrong location) - as well as fielding a roster with fewer holes and openings year after year - the Patriots have still performed better than the three other clubs (35 players still on team versus 29, 27 and 26).

At the end of the day the percentage is meaningless; the important number is the number of contributors a team nets, not the percentage. Going 3/3, 3/7 or 3/10 yields varying percentages, but in that scenario all three teams end up retaining the same exact number of players.

 

[Joker]

Thanks m8!! - I had a crusty old high school football coach (who could barely walk) that told us about running "The Flying Wedge" play up the middle as a college fullback in his glory days. In addition to having an awesome name (with its double-meaning), it was just old school nasty smash-mouth at its finest. I found this link that breaks down The Greatest Play in Football.

I made the avatar in Photoshop a while back and not sure who the guy is (Knute Rockne?), but wanted an old school leather helmet-wearing character with wings.

Your avatar is a pic of Knute Rockne, famous Notre Dame footballer...

 

[Deus Irae]

At the end of the day the percentage means is meaningless; the important number is the number of contributors a team nets, not the percentage.

Both matter, as does level of play of those on the team. If there was some simple formula based only upon raw retention and/or retention percentage, rating GMs would be as easy as pie.

 

[Off The Grid]

Did the Tavon Wilson error ever started??

 

[1960Pats]

You have to figure draft position into the equation to have a more accurate reflection of what takes place. The Bills in particular have drafted in top top ten of each round repeatedly during the Belichick era and three Jets and fish weren't far behind them. Given their draft position its amazing that the Patriots have been able to stay on top so consistently for so long.

I'm not trying to say that Belichick is bad at drafting, but I think the main reason for their success since BB arrived has been his coaching and TB.

 

[1960Pats]

So despite being allotted a later starting position (draft slot) than the three other teams (and having a first round pick stolen for filming from the wrong location) - as well as fielding a roster with fewer holes and openings year after year - the Patriots have still performed better than the three other clubs (35 players still on team versus 29, 27 and 26).

At the end of the day the percentage means is meaningless; the important number is the number of contributors a team nets, not the percentage. Going 3/3, 3/7 or 3/10 yields varying percentages, but in that scenario all three teams end up retaining the same exact number of players.

I didn't mean to be critical of the Pats. I was only providing the numbers that I have for the AFCE in answer to Darryl's question about the drafting of players. I'm perfectly happy with the results, as all Pats fans should be also.

I don't agree though that going 3/3, 3/7 or 3/10 is the same. If the Pats are trading down to acquire more picks they are technically leaving better players on the table.

 

[DarrylS]

I'm not trying to say that Belichick is bad at drafting, but I think the main reason for their success since BB arrived has been his coaching and TB.

There are also 52 other guys on this team who might have something to say about all of this.. no doubt that #12 and BB are geniuses in their own right, however there are a lot of complimentary pieces to enhance their greatness.

This thread falls into the predictable abyss of how poorly BB drafts(rinse, repeat ad infinitum)and has been mentioned all the other AFC teams draft at much higher positions yet remain mediocre.. somehow we excel, why is that BB & #12?? Doubt that. It is finding the right guys and playing to their strengths..