Sea Bass in line to See Cash?

[ATippett56]

I'm not really sure on the pats cap number as that pft number threw me for a loop. There may be some behind the scenes moves going on such as a grievance by a player but it may also just be the database. The day of the report was around a flurry of activity by the patriots. Sometimes they fail to take players off rosters until they clear waivers. In theory they could have had a 56 or 57 man roster that day. That is what happened with the bills earlier in the year when pft was way off based on the numbers they received. I'll try to get it worked out at some point.

Team-by-team cap space as of September 7 | ProFootballTalk

Team-by-team cap space as of September 7

[Editor's note: Once the regular season begins, the salary-cap calculation changes. Instead of factoring in the 51 highest-paid players, the in-season cap takes into account all 53 players, the practice squad, and players on reserve lists. Here's the league's official version of the list, as of Friday, September 7.]

Patriots: $8.4 million

 

[BradyFTW!]

I like Seabass a lot, but I could easily see a team like the Bears paying a market premium to make him their LT. It would be tough for the Pats to match that to keep him at RT, although they could probably do it if they really wanted to, since they have three more years of Nate Solder playing on a cheap rookie contract at LT.

 

[mayoclinic]

I like Seabass a lot, but I could easily see a team like the Bears paying a market premium to make him their LT. It would be tough for the Pats to match that to keep him at RT, although they could probably do it if they really wanted to, since they have three more years of Nate Solder playing on a cheap rookie contract at LT.

Possibly. I'm not sure what the Bear's cap situation and where they will stand in terms of splurging on the FA market. But there's a relative glut of OL FA's who could hit the market in 2013, in addition to Vollmer:

- Ryan Clady, Denver: taken #12 in the 2008 draft, 2 picks before Chicago took Chris Williams. Denver reportedly offered him a 5 year $50 million extension, which he turned down. Extension talks have reportedly broken off. He's having an All Pro season.
- Brandon Albert, Kansas City: taken #15 in the 2008 draft, 1 pick after Chicago took Chris Williams.
- Philip Loadholt. Purely a RT, but a good one, and he plays for division rival Minnesota.
- Andy Levitre, Buffalo. Obviously not a tackle, but he's been a solid 4 year starter at guard for the Bills, and has helped solidify what was once one of the worst offensive lines in the NFL.

There will be a number of guys who will be highly sought after, depending on whether their current teams let any of them reach the market, which is probably unlikely.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

On the 89% floor- remember that the league breaks it up into 4 year buckets not year by year spending. If teams don't see players worth paying in 2013 they won't screw up their cap. Better to waits until 2015 or 2016 and front load deals with bonus money. Remember all bonuses are cash payments in that year even if the cap doesn't account for it that way. The financial penalties are also not killer for failing to comply. Whatever the shortfall the team pays to the players under contract those years. It's probably better to pay older guys than screw your cap by overpaying a Mario Williams or pierre garçon just to reach the threshold.

I'm not really sure on the pats cap number as that pft number threw me for a loop. There may be some behind the scenes moves going on such as a grievance by a player but it may also just be the database. The day of the report was around a flurry of activity by the patriots. Sometimes they fail to take players off rosters until they clear waivers. In theory they could have had a 56 or 57 man roster that day. That is what happened with the bills earlier in the year when pft was way off based on the numbers they received. I'll try to get it worked out at some point.

My guess is Vollmer will get an incentive laden deal. They will tie the salary into games active as well as if he plays left or right tackle with salaries escalating if he plays the left side. That said I do think left tackle salaries will begin to drop soon. With teams featuring so many rushers the blindside has become less important. It's. Ether to invest in both sides than just the left.

Sorry for any bad spelling or anything else but I'm typing on my phone as wwe await the return of power in nj.

Thanks Jason, sorry your power is still out. The last time the league released figures you were within $200K so I'd bet there was some odd accounting afoot with any figures the NFLPA releases. I think it will be hard for NE to swallow a $30M OL in 2015. Which is what they would be facing if Mankins is still here and they have 2 tackles making anything approaching $18M between them...

 

[ATippett56]

I'm not really sure on the pats cap number as that pft number threw me for a loop. There may be some behind the scenes moves going on such as a grievance by a player but it may also just be the database. The day of the report was around a flurry of activity by the patriots. Sometimes they fail to take players off rosters until they clear waivers. In theory they could have had a 56 or 57 man roster that day. That is what happened with the bills earlier in the year when pft was way off based on the numbers they received. I'll try to get it worked out at some point.

Double check the salary cap values in the injured reserve category.

Brad Herman - New England Patriots - 2012 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com

4/30/2012: Signed a three-year, $1,442,500 contract. The deal included a $2,500 signing bonus. 2012: $390,000, 2013: $480,000, 2014: $570,000, 2015: Restricted Free Agent

Kyle Hix - New England Patriots - 2012 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com

7/28/2011: Signed a three-year, $1.404 million contract. The deal included a $9,000 signing bonus. 2012: $390,000, 2013: $480,000, 2014: Restricted Free Agent

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I like Seabass a lot, but I could easily see a team like the Bears paying a market premium to make him their LT. It would be tough for the Pats to match that to keep him at RT, although they could probably do it if they really wanted to, since they have three more years of Nate Solder playing on a cheap rookie contract at LT.

They have two more years of Solder on the cheap followed either by the AAV equivalent of the top 3-25 players at the position guaranteed for injury in year 5 (2015) on the day the tender is extended (March in 2014) and fully guaranteed (for injury, skill and cap) if the player is on the roster on the first day of that league year or an extension in year 4 (2014). Most teams will be trying to get extensions done with these post 4 year draftees who have lived up to their potential between the end of year 3 and the start of year 4 so they don't have to go there and set the AAV bar on any ensuing extension.

FWIW tagging Seabass would cost roughly $9.4M (based on the 2012 tag). I would imagine the average of LT's 3-25 in 2013 (what it would cost to lock Solder up for year 5) would be in the $7-8M range (or roughly 2.5-3 times his 2014 cap hit) since the top 5 make in the vacinity of $10M and the transition tag # in 2012 was $8.4M for all OLmen. We paid Light $7M for 2011.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

I think 4 years $28-32 million could get it done and he's well worth it. Health being the only question.

 

[Finnishfan]

On the 89% floor- remember that the league breaks it up into 4 year buckets not year by year spending. If teams don't see players worth paying in 2013 they won't screw up their cap. Better to waits until 2015 or 2016 and front load deals with bonus money. Remember all bonuses are cash payments in that year even if the cap doesn't account for it that way. The financial penalties are also not killer for failing to comply. Whatever the shortfall the team pays to the players under contract those years. It's probably better to pay older guys than screw your cap by overpaying a Mario Williams or pierre garçon just to reach the threshold.

I'm not really sure on the pats cap number as that pft number threw me for a loop. There may be some behind the scenes moves going on such as a grievance by a player but it may also just be the database. The day of the report was around a flurry of activity by the patriots. Sometimes they fail to take players off rosters until they clear waivers. In theory they could have had a 56 or 57 man roster that day. That is what happened with the bills earlier in the year when pft was way off based on the numbers they received. I'll try to get it worked out at some point.

My guess is Vollmer will get an incentive laden deal. They will tie the salary into games active as well as if he plays left or right tackle with salaries escalating if he plays the left side. That said I do think left tackle salaries will begin to drop soon. With teams featuring so many rushers the blindside has become less important. It's. Ether to invest in both sides than just the left.

Sorry for any bad spelling or anything else but I'm typing on my phone as wwe await the return of power in nj.

I salute you sir.

Despite everything you are going through there in NJ, you still come in here and typing with your phone provide us with comprehensive intel about these numbers.

Big time kudos.

 

[RobertWeathers]

They have two more years of Solder on the cheap followed either by the AAV equivalent of the top 3-25 players at the position guaranteed for injury in year 5 (2015) on the day the tender is extended (March in 2014) and fully guaranteed (for injury, skill and cap) if the player is on the roster on the first day of that league year or an extension in year 4 (2014). Most teams will be trying to get extensions done with these post 4 year draftees who have lived up to their potential between the end of year 3 and the start of year 4 so they don't have to go there and set the AAV bar on any ensuing extension.

FWIW tagging Seabass would cost roughly $9.4M (based on the 2012 tag). I would imagine the average of LT's 3-25 in 2013 (what it would cost to lock Solder up for year 5) would be in the $7-8M range (or roughly 2.5-3 times his 2014 cap hit) since the top 5 make in the vacinity of $10M and the transition tag # in 2012 was $8.4M for all OLmen. We paid Light $7M for 2011.

Solder is on record to make $1.15m next year and about $770k in 2014. If he keeps improving like he has been, he'll have a new deal going into the 2014 season.

 

[jason423]

Thanks Jason, sorry your power is still out. The last time the league released figures you were within $200K so I'd bet there was some odd accounting afoot with any figures the NFLPA releases. I think it will be hard for NE to swallow a $30M OL in 2015. Which is what they would be facing if Mankins is still here and they have 2 tackles making anything approaching $18M between them...

Bumping an old thread here but for the cap guys I think I found the error in the spreadsheets. Im not exactly sure what I did but somewhere in the last few weeks i mistakenly changed formulas for a number of players primarily on IR and PUP. The gist of it was that the Dowling and Ballard and Herman ended up with zero cap charges in the overall calculations that I use. I updated the page today through the activation of Talib and cutting of Tarpinian which puts my numbers at $6.6 million in cap room. PFT had it at $6.2 million before a 4 game credit for Boldens suspension, cutting of Tarp, trade of Talib, and a few PS moves. My guess is the real number is between $5.6 million and $5.8 million so I shouldnt be too far off right now. Most of the discrepancy at this point is from injury settlement money that I dont factor in.

Thanks for the help everyone.