NFLN: Jason Taylor doesn't envision being a Dolphin

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

I predict, accurately, that threads like this and posts like this exemplify how far patsfans.com has fallen. A 3rd and a 5th? Come on, people, please. This is asinine.

Randy Moss for a 4th was asinine. Us owning the Niners 7th overall pick was asinine. Drafting a HOF QB with pick 199 was asinine. Turning Wes Welker into the league's leading receiver. Asinine. We can keep going....

 

[patsox23]

Re: Jason Taylor

Randy Moss for a 4th was asinine. Us owning the Niners 7th overall pick was asinine. Drafting a HOF QB with pick 199 was asinine. Turning Wes Welker into the league's leading receiver. Asinine. We can keep going....

Oh for the love of God. Jason Taylor is, while aging, one year removed from being defensive POY. He plays on an intra-division rival who just looked AWFUL by trading Wes Welker to us for a 2nd and a 7th. They WON'T trade him here. EVER.

We should just be glad to have the guy dealt out of our division.

 

[patsox23]

Re: Jason Taylor

Turning Wes Welker into the league's leading receiver. Asinine.

You mean your contention that Wes Welker in "the league's leading receiver?" Yes. That is indeed asinine. Come on, man. Get real. I love the guy, but Welker's not even in the top 10 of best receivers.

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

You mean your contention that Wes Welker in "the league's leading receiver?" Yes. That is indeed asinine. Come on, man. Get real. I love the guy, but Welker's not even in the top 10 of best receivers.

RECEPTIONS. having to explain that was asinine.

 

[patsox23]

Re: Jason Taylor

RECEPTIONS. having to explain that was asinine.

"league's leading receiver" is stupidly vague.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Jason Taylor

Randy Moss for a 4th was asinine. Us owning the Niners 7th overall pick was asinine. Drafting a HOF QB with pick 199 was asinine. Turning Wes Welker into the league's leading receiver. Asinine. We can keep going....

Tou...freaken'.che!!!!!!!!!!!!

How far patsfans has really fallen is we can't have intelligent discussions about almost anything any more without some a-hole or other insinuatuing that half the people in a thread they probably shouldn't have opened to begin with are idiots.

Really stupid threads would actually go away if people didn't feel the need to reply to them or keep posting in them.

The last guy who begged anyone who would listen to get him to NE got here. Reason enough whether you like the idea or not to entertain it's discussion.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Jason Taylor

Randy Moss. Junior Seau. Rodney Harrison. Corey Dillon.


These guys were all great players before they came to New England. And there are others to a lesser degree. These 4 stand out. Jason Taylor is a player of this caliber. He was voted the league's best defensive player just one year ago. And we all know he has NOTHING to do with that team sucking. This is a guy NOT on the downside of a career. Its a great player on a bad team that will be looking to play for a winner. And he'll probably break his back for his new team trying to get that ring. Now, if his best years were 6 or 7 years ago, Id agree with you. He had his best year 1 year ago. He fits the mold. Believe me.

And again. I keep hearing this talk that Thomas cant play the inside. This team was beating teams by 20 and 39 every week with him on the inside. The depth was unbelievable. How could the team possibly suffer by moving such an incredibly talented and athletic player on the inside, an obvious upgrade, while also upgrading the OLB position? And its just my humble opinion, but Taylor at the OLB would be an upgrade. If its about the money, I understand. But Im sure if this thing develops, Taylor will be full aware of a financial sacrifice he'd have to make. And Id bet every toe on each foot that he'd do that.

None of those players were signed at a position where we had an already good player and had to move him out of position.
You seem to act like he will be cheap because you want him to be. He is already under contract. Do you think he is going to take a 5 mill paycut to get traded? Sure, if he cost nothing, I'd take him, but thats not reality.
The value of Taylor needs to be weighed against the cost.
If you take the team the Patriots have today, and have $6,000,000 to spend, are you really saying that the best use of it is to trade draft picks, give the 6mill to Taylor, resulting in shifting Thomas to the position he is not best at, i.e. taking what is already a strength and moving that strength to a position he does not play as well, and getting nothing else.
Sure, if Taylor fell out of the sky for free, he could help us. But thats not what the decision is. Jason Taylor is not a good use of 6 mill of cap space given our current roster.

No one is saying Thomas cannot play ILB. But his best position is OLB. Why would you spent that much money to add a player that causes you to DETRACT from the value you get from another player?

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

"league's leading receiver" is stupidly vague.

Look. With all due respect here, I realize I dont have over 7000 posts, but I love the Pats. And I think we can both recognize that I wasnt trying to make some suggestion that Welker was the new Jerry Rice. But did anyone think the guy was gonna have 112 catches and become the impact player he is when we gave up a 2nd rounder?, was really more of the point I was aiming at. Now, just chill with the insults. Nothing here is stupid or asinine. Its just football discussion amongst fellow fans. I appreciate your tenure here and respect it.

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

None of those players were signed at a position where we had an already good player and had to move him out of position.
You seem to act like he will be cheap because you want him to be. He is already under contract. Do you think he is going to take a 5 mill paycut to get traded? Sure, if he cost nothing, I'd take him, but thats not reality.
The value of Taylor needs to be weighed against the cost.
If you take the team the Patriots have today, and have $6,000,000 to spend, are you really saying that the best use of it is to trade draft picks, give the 6mill to Taylor, resulting in shifting Thomas to the position he is not best at, i.e. taking what is already a strength and moving that strength to a position he does not play as well, and getting nothing else.
Sure, if Taylor fell out of the sky for free, he could help us. But thats not what the decision is. Jason Taylor is not a good use of 6 mill of cap space given our current roster.

No one is saying Thomas cannot play ILB. But his best position is OLB. Why would you spent that much money to add a player that causes you to DETRACT from the value you get from another player?

We moved Lawyer Milloy right off the friggin' team. A Pro Bowler and team captain. Back to back SBs titles were the result. Its not unprecedented. Though I wouldnt look for anyone to get cut if Taylor were to join this team.

Taylor playing for this team for less than he'd get other places wouldnt shock anyone. Ive said all along this thing hinges on the money, and I have no idea what it would take on the part of both the Pats and Taylor to make that happen. So, yes of course, if the man wants to come here and play for signicantly less than other teams, Im all for it. Will he? Who knows? Do I think he would? Without a doubt.

 

[GPR11788]

Re: Jason Taylor

Jason Taylor is a great player, but I just don't see this deal happening. Although I wouldn't mind seeing him play OLB and move in Thomas as ILB.
When Ray Lewis got injured a few years back, Thomas played ILB and he was very effective, even though it is not his primary position. I believe he played ILB when Colvin was still in the lineup, I think he has enough flexibility to play both positions.

But Jason Taylor would be expensive to get, not only losing draft picks but the salary would be pretty high. It's going to be interesting to see what BB does with the linebacker position, since he prefers veterans.

 

[ALP]

Re: Jason Taylor

he would have to take a serious pay cut if he were released and wanted to become a PAT....like 3mil a year type of paycut

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Re: Jason Taylor

Parcells is too smart to deal a future HOFer to a division opponent even though its in Taylor's twilight years so lets just can the dumb talk about a trade for him,Its NEVER going to happen with Parcells in charge now.

 

[SteveKiner]

Re: Jason Taylor

I realize that there is VERY little chance of the Pats getting Jason Taylor this year. But, I also think that they would have to offer more than a third and fifth rounder to even begin to get Tuna's interest. That being said, how does this sound. Pats trade their number 1, 7th overall for Taylor and Miami's number 2, 32nd overall. Pats avoid shelling out huge $ on unproven rookie draft pick. Supposedly the Pats like the value they get in 20-40 range. The Pats fill a hole with a still great defensive presence and the Dolphins end up with 2 of the top 7 picks to help the rebuilding effort. Fire away.

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

Parcells is too smart to deal a future HOFer to a division opponent even though its in Taylor's twilight years so lets just can the dumb talk about a trade for him,Its NEVER going to happen with Parcells in charge now.

Parcells being there is exactly the reason I think its possible. That's the point there to be made. He's an NFLer. He's not a Dolphins lifer. He's trying to help that team, not preserve their fragile ego by trading away a good player to a rival team because it may hurt the fan's feelings. That's not how he thinks, imo. He's above that. Do I think NE is the first place he'd choose to trade him? Of course not. But I certainly dont think he'd rule out a sensible trade that benefitted that team if Taylor made the case to him that he doesnt want to be part of a re-building process.

Taylor's always been an amazing player. The guy's 6'6 and only weighs 250. But its been his job for years to match up with typically the biggest guy on the field. Of course he's an edge rusher, so he uses his speed in most passing situations. But for the 30 or so plays a game where the guy has to stand up to a 320lber and hold the point, and play the run, its really pretty amazing that at his size he hasnt missed a game in 8 years. And that team gets run on like no other. Their D had more rushes attempted than any other team. But you can still see he still has the speed. And playing as a backer, and not having to contend with a tackle the entire game would make that man more dangerous than he's been as an end, imo. Outside of Thomas, who he'd probably be close to, I guarantee he'd crush any of our backers in either a 40yd dash or coverage drills. No question in my book he'd make a move to that position seamlessly.

But back to the point of Parcells NOT wanting to deal with New England. This is Parcells' 5th stop in the NFL. He's got no loyalty to any of these teams. He's all about making teams better. Its nothing personal with him. He's not in Miami to worry about what New England's doing. he's there to turn that franchise around. He'll do that in whatever way it takes, no matter what anyone else thinks. jmho.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Jason Taylor

Parcells being there is exactly the reason I think its possible. That's the point there to be made. He's an NFLer. He's not a Dolphins lifer. He's trying to help that team, not preserve their fragile ego by trading away a good player to a rival team because it may hurt the fan's feelings. That's not how he thinks, imo. He's above that. Do I think NE is the first place he'd choose to trade him? Of course not. But I certainly dont think he'd rule out a sensible trade that benefitted that team if Taylor made the case to him that he doesnt want to be part of a re-building process.

Taylor's always been an amazing player. The guy's 6'6 and only weighs 250. But its been his job for years to match up with typically the biggest guy on the field. Of course he's an edge rusher, so he uses his speed in most passing situations. But for the 30 or so plays a game where the guy has to stand up to a 320lber and hold the point, and play the run, its really pretty amazing that at his size he hasnt missed a game in 8 years. And that team gets run on like no other. Their D had more rushes attempted than any other team. But you can still see he still has the speed. And playing as a backer, and not having to contend with a tackle the entire game would make that man more dangerous than he's been as an end, imo. Outside of Thomas, who he'd probably be close to, I guarantee he'd crush any of our backers in either a 40yd dash or coverage drills. No question in my book he'd make a move to that position seamlessly.

But back to the point of Parcells NOT wanting to deal with New England. This is Parcells' 5th stop in the NFL. He's got no loyalty to any of these teams. He's all about making teams better. Its nothing personal with him. He's not in Miami to worry about what New England's doing. he's there to turn that franchise around. He'll do that in whatever way it takes, no matter what anyone else thinks. jmho.

If Parcells isn't a Dolphin lifer, doesn't that mean he wants to win quickly? If he is looking to win quickly, how is it productive to do so by making the best team in the division even stronger for the short term?

It seems to make sense that if Parcells is in it for the long haul, he would be willing to trade Jason Taylor to the Pats because his team would benefit in the long term while the Pats benefit in the short term.

Parcells doesn't like to stay in one place too long. He doesn't want to make the Pats stronger for the next two to three years since he is going to want his team to be a legitimate playoff contender by the 2009 season. That makes it two games a year he can easily lose and a division tough to take over.

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

I realize that there is VERY little chance of the Pats getting Jason Taylor this year. But, I also think that they would have to offer more than a third and fifth rounder to even begin to get Tuna's interest. That being said, how does this sound. Pats trade their number 1, 7th overall for Taylor and Miami's number 2, 32nd overall. Pats avoid shelling out huge $ on unproven rookie draft pick. Supposedly the Pats like the value they get in 20-40 range. The Pats fill a hole with a still great defensive presence and the Dolphins end up with 2 of the top 7 picks to help the rebuilding effort. Fire away.

I dont want to see that happen. New England rarely has to pay the big bucks for these high picks, so once every several years isnt a bad burden. But its nice to add a top 7 stud when you get the chance. This is a good draft. There's some talent in that top 10. But if they do decide to move the pick, I do hope they move it for multiple picks to bring in other younger players. I dont think it'll come to that. Taylor is a 33year old player, who in a couple of months will probably be making it clear that he wants off that team. He's great, but there are limits you'd give up for a guy entering his 12th season.

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

If Parcells isn't a Dolphin lifer, doesn't that mean he wants to win quickly? If he is looking to win quickly, how is it productive to do so by making the best team in the division even stronger for the short term?

It seems to make sense that if Parcells is in it for the long haul, he would be willing to trade Jason Taylor to the Pats because his team would benefit in the long term while the Pats benefit in the short term.

Parcells doesn't like to stay in one place too long. He doesn't want to make the Pats stronger for the next two to three years since he is going to want his team to be a legitimate playoff contender by the 2009 season. That makes it two games a year he can easily lose and a division tough to take over.

This is a 1 win team. I think no matter how short his stay there may be, he's more concerned with contributing to sustained success. This team will be a part of his legacy long after he leaves. If theyre contenders in year 3, but suck again in 5 years, what good will it have done? This team has nowhere to go BUT up. So, he'll be a success in year 1, 2 and 3 no matter what.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Re: Jason Taylor

Parcells being there is exactly the reason I think its possible. That's the point there to be made. He's an NFLer. He's not a Dolphins lifer. He's trying to help that team, not preserve their fragile ego by trading away a good player to a rival team because it may hurt the fan's feelings. That's not how he thinks, imo. He's above that. Do I think NE is the first place he'd choose to trade him? Of course not. But I certainly dont think he'd rule out a sensible trade that benefitted that team if Taylor made the case to him that he doesnt want to be part of a re-building process.

Taylor's always been an amazing player. The guy's 6'6 and only weighs 250. But its been his job for years to match up with typically the biggest guy on the field. Of course he's an edge rusher, so he uses his speed in most passing situations. But for the 30 or so plays a game where the guy has to stand up to a 320lber and hold the point, and play the run, its really pretty amazing that at his size he hasnt missed a game in 8 years. And that team gets run on like no other. Their D had more rushes attempted than any other team. But you can still see he still has the speed. And playing as a backer, and not having to contend with a tackle the entire game would make that man more dangerous than he's been as an end, imo. Outside of Thomas, who he'd probably be close to, I guarantee he'd crush any of our backers in either a 40yd dash or coverage drills. No question in my book he'd make a move to that position seamlessly.

But back to the point of Parcells NOT wanting to deal with New England. This is Parcells' 5th stop in the NFL. He's got no loyalty to any of these teams. He's all about making teams better. Its nothing personal with him. He's not in Miami to worry about what New England's doing. he's there to turn that franchise around. He'll do that in whatever way it takes, no matter what anyone else thinks. jmho.

Well the way I look at it is this,Even though Parcells is now a GM and FO guy and not the coach it still does not dismiss the fact that its a fact that Parcells has NEVER had a team that did not become contenders within a few years and that is exactly what I expect of him in Miami,If the Dolphins are not a contender by 2010 I will be somewhat surprised.

Parcells is a genius when it comes to taking crap teams and putting them up to elite or near elite status - Look at the 80s Giants,90s Patriots and Jets and 2000s Cowboys all of which were pathetic pre-parcells and for that very reason I cannot see Parcells taking one of his better players who can help his team get better and trade him away for rookies who may take time to develop,Parcells likes to get bad teams good fast as seen in his career.

 

[patsox23]

Re: Jason Taylor

Listen, folks, I apologize if I'm somehow crossing a line, but pretty much ALL of this thread is ridiculous. We're not getting Jason Taylor. If we do, I'll be thrilled. It just seems like a crazy idea. The dolphins are coming off having just traded us Welker and having it BLOW UP IN THEIR FACE.

Now they're going to deal us Jason Taylor, an even more dominant player - and for a 3rd and a 5th? Pardon the Hell out of me if I think this is NUTS to even be discussing.

 

[RussFrancis]

Re: Jason Taylor

Well the way I look at it is this,Even though Parcells is now a GM and FO guy and not the coach it still does not dismiss the fact that its a fact that Parcells has NEVER had a team that did not become contenders within a few years and that is exactly what I expect of him in Miami,If the Dolphins are not a contender by 2010 I will be somewhat surprised.

Parcells is a genius when it comes to taking crap teams and putting them up to elite or near elite status - Look at the 80s Giants,90s Patriots and Jets and 2000s Cowboys all of which were pathetic pre-parcells and for that very reason I cannot see Parcells taking one of his better players who can help his team get better and trade him away for rookies who may take time to develop,Parcells likes to get bad teams good fast as seen in his career.

Parcells also knows that young DE/OLBs can come into this league and make an immediate impact on playoff teams. Two obvious example would be DeMarcus Ware and Shawne Merriman. Parcells knows he can draft a young player like Chris Long and get similar results that he'd been getting out of Jason Taylor. IF of course he drafts him. But Long and Taylor would play the same position on that team. And I guarantee if there were some way NE could get ahold of Long instead of Taylor, they'd do the same.