Moss's Chase of the Checkbook indicates he's reverted to "Raider Randy"

[Disco Volante]

Dallas = $ + Winning
Jax = $ + Winning
San Diego = $ + Winning

etc.

 

[dhamz]

It is amazing that people seem to think this is the only place a player can go if he wants to win a ring. How has coming to NE worked out for Junior Seau getting his ring?

If Moss goes to Atlanta, then sure he is all about the $ but there are more places he can go besides NE and play for a contender. No team can assure him a ring - a point that he probably understands very clearly after 4 Sundays ago.

 

[Xzibit23]

It is amazing that people seem to think this is the only place a player can go if he wants to win a ring. How has coming to NE worked out for Junior Seau getting his ring?

If Moss goes to Atlanta, then sure he is all about the $ but there are more places he can go besides NE and play for a contender. No team can assure him a ring - a point that he probably understands very clearly after 4 Sundays ago.

Moss more than anyone understands that...he was part of the 15-1 '98 Vikings as well.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Are you kidding me, he's just like any other player.... wants to maximize his profits and who can blame him.

That'd be fine - except for the fact that he said otherwise... that money wasn't the important thing and that he wanted to win more than anything else and remain with the Patriots more than anything else.

The fact that he's decided to shop himself to other teams indicates he wasn't being truthful when he said that.

 

[dhamz]

That'd be fine - except for the fact that he said otherwise... that money wasn't the important thing and that he wanted to win more than anything else and remain with the Patriots more than anything else.

The fact that he's decided to shop himself to other teams indicates he wasn't being truthful when he said that.

So are you saying he should simply have signed whatever deal the Patriots offerred?

 

[JoeSixPat]

This is what will we find out about Randy Moss this off-season. Money or winning?

The fact that with nearly a month to negotiate and no deal with the Patriots indicates that his statement that THIS is where he wants to be and that money is not the most important thing was BS... i.e. that money IS the most important thing.

"Mr. Kraft, I have made a lot of money, more money probably than I need. This is about winning. They have everything that you want in a football organization," said Moss, who turns 31 next month. "For me to be able to say I would love to become a New England Patriot and finish my career there, that's something that I can really believe in."

And that gives me great pause should he come back to the negotiating table with the Pats.

 

[festy1986]

why does it matter?

he should get paid like the best, period.

wether or not he and NE can come to some sort of home town deal is what were looking for.

if he is looking for 10, and people are throwing 10, we should atleast give 8.

We got him on a steal, one that he allowed, if he leaves I have no hard feelings, he was a gift to us in the first place, he showed what he can do and now BB and and company have to decide if what he brings is worth the money he demands.

The answer is obviously yes but lets see.

 

[JoeSixPat]

So are you saying he should simply have signed whatever deal the Patriots offerred?

Assuming they offered him a fair deal - though likely not the higest deal in the NFL? Yes.

And that's not me saying that - its Randy Moss - when he stated emphatically there was no where else he wanted to play but on the Patriots... and that money was not the most important thing to him.

So don't worry about what I'm saying.

Worry about what Moss said

"Mr. Kraft, I have made a lot of money, more money probably than I need. This is about winning. They have everything that you want in a football organization," said Moss, who turns 31 next month. "For me to be able to say I would love to become a New England Patriot and finish my career there, that's something that I can really believe in."

....and the fact that by all indications he was lying.

 

[ATippett56]

But if the Pats are offering an average of 7.5 when he could get 10+, him leaving the team is understandable.

The New England Patriots organization normally don't back down in their recent negotiations with former Patriots wide receivers, especially Deion Branch and David Givens.

 

[Xzibit23]

Assuming they offered him a fair deal - though likely not the higest deal in the NFL? Yes.

And that's not me saying that - its Randy Moss - when he stated emphatically there was no where else he wanted to play but on the Patriots... and that money was not the most important thing to him.

So don't worry about what I'm saying.

Worry about what Moss said

....and the fact that by all indications he was lying.

You see, thats the problem with your whole argument, its based on an assumption.

 

[JoeSixPat]

You see, thats the problem with your whole argument, its based on an assumption.

Why would I assume otherwise?

Everyone knows the Patriots aren't cheap. Are you assuming they are?

Moss himself made clear he wasn't looking to shop himself to the highest bidder just a few weeks ago. Now that's clearly not be the case.

 

[Xzibit23]

The New England Patriots organization normally don't back down in their recent negotiations with former Patriots wide receivers, especially Deion Branch and David Givens.

This isnt Deion Branch or David Givens, thats the problem. There is a much bigger risk and cost to this guy leaving, so maybe the line should not be drawn as hard. And the Pats have shown with top level talent, like Brady and Seymour, that there is more willingness to be flexible, so they do understand this.

 

[dhamz]

Assuming they offered him a fair deal - though likely not the higest deal in the NFL? Yes.

And since none of us know what they offerred, can you be sure it is a fair deal? I don't see how you can but your entire premise appears to be based on it.

Worry about what Moss said....and the fact that by all indications he was lying.

I don't think you can ever have facts based on indiciations. In this case, we have no facts, just speculation.

 

[Xzibit23]

Why would I assume otherwise?

Everyone knows the Patriots aren't cheap. Are you assuming they are?

Moss himself made clear he wasn't looking to shop himself to the highest bidder just a few weeks ago. Now that doesn't appear to be the case.

I'm not asking you to assume they're being cheap, i'm asking you to hold out on any assumptions until we actually have an idea of the numbers in play. And the Patriots may not be cheap, but they routinely offer below market value for players, the only question with Moss is just how below market value their offer is.

 

[PatriotsReign]

Joe, Joe, Joe....over 8,000 posts and you come up with this? When are fans like you going to learn to wait until you see the verdict before you make assumptions?

I mean what the hell is this, a guessing game? We don't know what we don't know and you don't know any more than anyone else. So every single little "Randy Moss" post & thread is just a guess or a theory, right? Can someone please, please tell us why people have to come up with theories? It's just so stupid and time wasting.

The bottom line is I don't know, Joesixpack doesn't know and no else on this board knows what's up with signing Randy Moss. Sometimes I get the feeling people want to take a stab in the dark with their theories in hope they look "wicked smart" if their guess is right.

That's really sad

 

[Keep Up With The Joneses]

Is it possible Randy looked at last season and sees a year that he took a major discount, played his *ss off while towing th company line and STILL ended up without a ring amidst the criticisms throughout the media and fans that he disappeared in the playoffs?

Now he looks at a team that seems to be dismantling itself through cuts and FA losses (I know the sky isn't falling, but he may not carry the same "in BB and Pioli we trust" mentality). He also knows this is probably his last chance at a big payday before hanging it up.

No way I can possibly know what he's thinking, but after all that's happened this year, he may just know he WILL get more money somewhere else and still have a chance to win it all, maybe a better chance than he does with the Pats.

I don't blame him for taking his time and exploring all his options. I really believe if the Pats won the SB he would have resigned ASAP at a discount.

 

[jmt57]

None of us can say for sure what is going on with either Moss or the Pats FO since there has not been one single comment from either side. All we have is pure speculation being turned into proven fact in the minds of some people here - does that sound familiar, like a certain story that dominated the entire 2007 season?

For all we know a contract has already been agrred upon or even signed, but both sides agreed to not announcing it yet. Why do that? If other teams are looking at a free agent WR and they think they are competing with the Pats, that WR's price goes up. That other team signs him to a ridiculous deal (like the one Berrian got) and now they have less money to spend on other positions (and perhaps compete with the Pats for another player at a different position).

Secondly, another WR may come here with the idea that Moss may not be back and he has a shot at being Brady's #1 target. Do you think Stallworth would have been as eager to come here last year if the Pats had already signed Moss at that point in time?

Third, it makes it tougher on other teams competing with the Pats when they look at who to go after as free agents. A team may try to construct their team through free agency to be effective against the Pats and advance in the playoffs. Just like game planning against the Pats is entirely different whether or not Moss is part of the team and in the lineup, those teams may target players depending on whether or not Moss is still a Patriot.

Everything I said above is pure speculation on my part too, but it has at least as much chance of being correct as "Moss is a greedy liar" or "BB and Pioli have suddenly become incompetent" arguments.

 

[Zeke_Mowatt]

I honestly don't know the answer so I ask it earnestly...has this ever happened in the history of FA? I truly don't know, it may be common, it may never have happened before, but enough questions have been raised about it that I thought it worth checking...I wouldn't put it past the FO, just curious if it's ever happened before to anyone?

For all we know a contract has already been agrred upon or even signed, but both sides agreed to not announcing it yet. Why do that? If other teams are looking at a free agent WR and they think they are competing with the Pats, that WR's price goes up. That other team signs him to a ridiculous deal (like the one Berrian got) and now they have less money to spend on other positions (and perhaps compete with the Pats for another player at a different position).

 

[dhamz]

Everyone knows the Patriots aren't cheap. Are you assuming they are?

Cheap has nothing to do with it. The pats aren't cheap but there is no denying they are very cautious with how they spend their $.

I can see a scenario where the Pats are unwilling to make a long term committment to him based on something that concerns them (age, past off the field issues, etc). This could very well be about years, not average salary per season.

 

[wiggins!]

Whoever said it earlier is dead on: Wait til we see what the dollars / years being exchange were before we either Villify Moss or the Pats. I didn't my copy of the contract proposal either. You can't say Moss is being the bad apple but not wanting to stay.

What if NE offered him he same deal as last year? I think he's worth more than that.

BTW....whoever said don't read anything into John Clayton's story about Moss "listening other offers" because he works for ESPN - whatever. That's fine.

Can I listen to Adam Schefter of the NFL Network say the same thing though and start to get worried? He is afterall the mouthpiece for the league. Just a thought!