Manning is more skilled than Brady? Please explain.

[jmt57]

Well, Brady and Manning are both excellent QBs. You can argue which one is better until the moon goes down.

Manning, however, calls his own plays and does audibles...actually calls the shots a LOT more than Brady.

In my opinion you're overstating this part of the debate. When I read that, it's as if Manning is the only QB who calls an audible - which is far from the truth. Manning is far more theatrical in this aspect - just like Brett Favre is far more theatrical when he fakes a pass after he has handed off - but I don't know that it makes him more effective or productive in this part of his game. Brady - and Manning - both do an excellent job of reading the defense and and calling pre-snap adjustments. In my opinion Manning is given more credit due to the time he takes and his gesticulations.

I'm guessing that when all is said and done Brady audibles in to just as many (if not more) of his own play calls as Manning. Brady and Moss have developed a chemistry that allows them to see the same thing and change a play with a slight nod of the head or other gesture; Manning had the same thing with Harrison and probably now has the same relationship with Wayne.

Point is this: Brady and Manning are both very adept at coming out of the huddle and making a pre-snap adjustment; they're the two best quarterbacks in the NFL in this department. This isn't a knock on Manning, but you can't say he is any better than Brady in this category.

 

[feldspar]

Pointing to a raw number when you're ignoring the discrepancies for turf/indoors v. outdoors is sloppy work, and you've been guilty of that on this thread. You shouldn't be denigrating someone else's credibility on this issue until you shore up your own.

First of all, half of a team's games are on the road, are they not? Second of all, games don't even get sloppy up North until later in the season, no? I'm from Buffalo, remember? I know about these things all too well. Lastly, I'd say that the weather is an equal factor for both teams, no matter where they are playing, right?

How many games do you see where the weather is the deciding factor on how well the QB can throw the ball at home? Four...tops? Four at the very most, since November or December don't mean blizzard on Sunday by definition.

Besides, number of touchdowns is not a skill set. Again, my question was about a skill set. It's not meant to bash anyone, including Manning. Your posts here have done nothing to answer my question.

The number of touchdowns is not a skill set? So you can throw 2 TDs and be as good as someone that throws 27? I'm sure that's not what you mean, and I'm sure I don't don't what you can possibly mean by that.

Brady throwing 50 TDs in a single year doesn't mean anything?

 

[Wildo7]

I did the same short-hand for Brady. Do some research yourself instead of making vague generalities based on personal bias. If you knew what happened in the first place, you wouldn't need me to tell you what the QB ratings were.

Did the way I went about it make you completely dismiss the totally fantastic playoff games that I showed Manning had, some of which his team lost? Did you dismiss the one where he had a perfect passer rating and 5 TDs and 0 INTs. If so, shame on you. My point was to show his great-to-good playoff games. yeah, they do exist. Probably outweigh his playoff failures by quite a bit, I'd say. Brady had some bad playoff performances where his team won, too, which gave him another chance at "coming through in the clutch."



Oh, I beg to differ. I'd say there are plenty of Patriot fans that downright hate Peyton Manning from a football perspective. And I certainly believe that there is a bias out there when comparing the two in Patriot-land, wherever the hell that is.

I'd just respect the opinion more if more people said that it's a close call rather than saying Brady is the hands-down winner. That's not the case by any standard.

I think it's a close call. Take a visit to the Colts fan sites to see if there's any bias btw (hint: it's 1000% worse than here).

 

[feldspar]

I think it's a close call. Take a visit to the Colts fan sites to see if there's any bias btw (hint: it's 1000% worse than here).

Guess what? Thanks for saying that, because it's 100% true. They'd probably say that your bias is 1000% worse, too. I'm 97.8% sure about that.

 

[feldspar]

I think Brady has a better team behind him, but Manning has a lot of skill

Brady certainly did have a better team behind him. Thanks for noticing that.

 

[feldspar]

Percentage, not absolute.

Regular season:
Brady: 87 wins in 111 starts (.784)
Manning: 117 wins in 176 starts (.664)

Post-season:
Brady: 14 wins in 17 starts (.823)
Manning: 7 wins in 15 starts (.467)

Overall:
Brady: 101 wins in 128 starts (.789)
Manning: 124 wins in 191 starts (.649)

To put this in perspective, for Manning to have the same win %age as Brady, he'd have to win 33 consecutive starts.

This would be the deciding factor on who is better is there were only one player on each team.

 

[eagle eye]

This would be the deciding factor on who is better is there were only one player on each team.

Postseason stats.

Tom Brady------------14-3 - 372-595, 3954 yards, 26 TD, 12 INT; 88.0 PR
Peyton Manning--------7-8 - 348-564 4208 yards, 26 TD 17 INT; 85.0 PR

What about them there stats?

 

[feldspar]

In my opinion you're overstating this part of the debate.

I'm overstating it by saying it once? Manning is the king of audibles. How's THAT for an overstatement? He also calls his own plays, something which shouldn't be overlooked.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

My analysis is excluding overall teams, coaches and records. In terms of skill sets, their pretty even. Both of them are pocket passers with very strong and accurate arms. Both are student of the games and are the best at reading defenses. But like most people say, Manning is notorious for waving his arms around the line of scrimmage while Brady likes to point bark stuff who the "mike" LB is. The only difference between the two is that Manning had a stronger arm coming out of college than Brady. It took awhile for Brady to get his arm strength where it is today. In fact, I'd say by 2003-2004 is where people starting noticing that Brady's arm strength was near the best. Lastly, I think that Manning is slightly faster than Brady.

 

[Wildo7]

Guess what? Thanks for saying that, because it's 100% true. They'd probably say that your bias is 1000% worse, too. I'm 97.8% sure about that.

Nobody in this thread goes as far as they do.

What a load of crap - Unofficial Indianapolis Colts Fan Forums

ESPN NFL fan vote for the player of the decade - Unofficial Indianapolis Colts Fan Forums

Manning most irreplaceable in the league - Unofficial Indianapolis Colts Fan Forums

 

[eagle eye]

On the road.

Career QB Rating

Brady 93.96
Manning 93.27

 

[feldspar]

Postseason stats.

Tom Brady------------14-3 - 372-595, 3954 yards, 26 TD, 12 INT; 88.0 PR
Peyton Manning--------7-8 - 348-564 4208 yards, 26 TD 17 INT; 85.0 PR

What about them there stats?

I'd say they are very close except for wins and, to a lesser degree, INTs...their post-season passer rating, if I can trust what you've posted, is equal enough to not fuss over... BUT if you want to compare the two QBs based only on their postseason performances, you'd have to factor in the other trillion variables. Rex Grossman brought his team to the Super Bowl, for crying out loud. It's a team sport, should I say that again?

If you have time, maybe you can come up with a mathematical equation proving Brady better. Until then, it's a debate...one that Manning won't lose, even based on the postseason alone IMO. Forget about the regular season...Manning wins that.

BTW, I have no vested interest in putting Manning above Brady. Not that I know him, but I don't particularly like Peyton as a person. He kind of annoys me, really. I'd probably get along better with Brady on the street from what I see, but that's pure speculation.

 

[eagle eye]

I'd say they are very close except for wins and, to a lesser degree, INTs...their post-season passer rating, if I can trust what you've posted, is equal enough to not fuss over... BUT if you want to compare the two QBs based only on their postseason performances, you'd have to factor in the other trillion variables. Rex Grossman brought his team to the Super Bowl, for crying out loud. It's a team sport, should I say that again?

If you have time, maybe you can come up with a mathematical equation proving Brady better. Until then, it's a debate...one that Manning won't lose, even based on the postseason alone IMO. Forget about the regular season...Manning wins that.

BTW, I have no vested interest in putting Manning above Brady. Not that I know him, but I don't particularly like Peyton as a person. He kind of annoys me, really. I'd probably get along better with Brady on the street from what I see, but that's pure speculation.

Oh no you don't. A qb rating is not a team rating. Brady is ahead, you might notice the other one I put up, nothing in it, but Brady is ahead again. Thats the one taking the dome and home field out of the equation its on the road stats. Nothing in it as I said but its Brady leading again.

 

[feldspar]

Oh no you don't. A qb rating is not a team rating. Brady is ahead, you might notice the other one I put up, nothing in it, but Brady is ahead again. Thats the one taking the dome and home field out of the equation its on the road stats. Nothing in it as I said but its Brady leading again.

The only way Brady is hands-down ahead of Manning is in the handsome category.

Manning looks like a dork, while Brady is very attractive. Manning rates a 4, while Brady rates a 9.5. I think that cute little dimple on his chin brought him over the top.

Put a goat in Mannings hands and see if he doesn't resemble a hillbilly. Put a goat in Brady's hands, and it somehow looks like you want to be a part of that scene...put your arm around him, help him milk the goat, or whatever.

Don't pretend that you don't know what I'm talkin' about.

 

[eagle eye]

The only way Brady is hands-down ahead of Manning is in the handsome category.

Manning looks like a dork, while Brady is very attractive. Manning rates a 4, while Brady rates a 9.5. I think that cute little dimple on his chin brought him over the top.

Put a goat in Mannings hands and see if he doesn't resemble a hillbilly. Put a goat in Brady's hands, and it somehow looks like you want to be a part of that scene...put your arm around him, help him milk the goat, or whatever.

Don't pretend that you don't know what I'm talkin' about.

So is that you finished now?

A couple of stats that you don't like and that certainly don't support your argument and now you go down a the silly route. Way, way off topic and more non-sensical bull.

BTW, I have no vested interest in putting Manning above Brady. Not that I know him, but I don't particularly like Peyton as a person. He kind of annoys me, really. I'd probably get along better with Brady on the street from what I see, but that's pure speculation.

Like this bull. This really irks me, really I mean you come on here and spout this stuff and won't address good posts that counter your arguments and then you expect us to believe this? Really come on.

 

[feldspar]

So is that you finished now?

A couple of stats that you don't like and that certainly don't support your argument and now you go down a the silly route. Way, way off topic and more non-sensical bull.

Hell, yeah, this is me finished now. I'm enjoying myself on this board, and, as I've seen in the past, I shouldn't pursue an unpopular opinion here or I'll get slammed.

I thought my last post was passably entertaining. You don't?

I've already established my opinion and backed it up as much as I could. I really don't have anything more to say about it at the moment, but that could change. I watch football all the time. I don't miss things. IMO, Peyton Manning is more valuable to his team than Tom Brady is to his team. I can argue that point until the goats crawl home, but that would be the silliest thing I could do on a Patriots board. Why don't we just say that Manning and Brady are the best two QBs in the league and leave it at that? Screw Roethlisberger...he ain't even close.

Like this bull. This really irks me, really I mean you come on here and spout this stuff and won't address good posts that counter your arguments and then you expect us to believe this? Really come on.

I feel that people didn't address my valid arguments at all and spent the whole time trying to punch holes in what they felt were the weaknesses in my argument, which I spent a hell of a lot more time establishing, by the way.

What else is new?

It irks me, too. Try being outnumbered, and it's worse.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

He's demonstrably better at waving his arms around at the line of scrimmage, so there is that.

First post i read, and now my pepsi is all over my monitor.. well done

 

[Deus Irae]

First of all, half of a team's games are on the road, are they not? Second of all, games don't even get sloppy up North until later in the season, no? I'm from Buffalo, remember? I know about these things all too well. Lastly, I'd say that the weather is an equal factor for both teams, no matter where they are playing, right?

How many games do you see where the weather is the deciding factor on how well the QB can throw the ball at home? Four...tops? Four at the very most, since November or December don't mean blizzard on Sunday by definition.

This is what's known as a cop out. There's a reason that numbers vary from indoors to outdoors. Of course, you know this, since anyone who knows football understands that it matters.

The number of touchdowns is not a skill set?

Of course it's not. It's a number.

So you can throw 2 TDs and be as good as someone that throws 27?

Obviously.

I'm sure that's not what you mean, and I'm sure I don't don't what you can possibly mean by that.

Brady throwing 50 TDs in a single year doesn't mean anything?

It means that he threw 50 TDs in a single year. That's what it means.

 

[ausbacker]

Hell, yeah, this is me finished now. I'm enjoying myself on this board, and, as I've seen in the past, I shouldn't pursue an unpopular opinion here or I'll get slammed.

I thought my last post was passably entertaining. You don't?

I've already established my opinion and backed it up as much as I could. I really don't have anything more to say about it at the moment, but that could change. I watch football all the time. I don't miss things. IMO, Peyton Manning is more valuable to his team than Tom Brady is to his team. I can argue that point until the goats crawl home, but that would be the silliest thing I could do on a Patriots board. Why don't we just say that Manning and Brady are the best two QBs in the league and leave it at that? Screw Roethlisberger...he ain't even close.




I feel that people didn't address my valid arguments at all and spent the whole time trying to punch holes in what they felt were the weaknesses in my argument, which I spent a hell of a lot more time establishing, by the way.

What else is new?

It irks me, too. Try being outnumbered, and it's worse.

It irks you that you provide a biased and unbalanced opinion to support only your argument, when you could equally write an argument in favour of Brady then compare major achievements or short comings of both?

IF and a big if, you were to write something balanced instead of picking and choosing what to include or omit, perhaps you wouldn't have the "problems" you speak of.

 

[feldspar]

This is what's known as a cop out. There's a reason that numbers vary from indoors to outdoors. Of course, you know this, since anyone who knows football understands that it matters.

Of course it's not. It's a number.

Obviously.

It means that he threw 50 TDs in a single year. That's what it means.

Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in...

you remind me a lot of myself, Deus Irae, to tell you the truth.