How much is it going to cost us to keep Talib?

[Ivan]

I think something like 4 years $38mil would be fair for both sides. I might go as high as 4 years $42mil if its low guaranteed money and made up of incentives.

You might, they won't. I don't see NE going beyond 4-26 or 5-32 and I doubt they offer him 5. They will come in around 6-7 with clauses, he will never see 8-9 million a year from the Patriots.

 

[Brady6]

You might, they won't. I don't see NE going beyond 4-26 or 5-32 and I doubt they offer him 5. They will come in around 6-7 with clauses, he will never see 8-9 million a year from the Patriots.

Talib is obviously who I would want but there are other CB’s who will be on the market so I am not sure if he will command the attention some believe on the open market.

These are some other bigger names along with Talib:

Charles Tillman
Brent Grimes
Tim Jennings
Vontae Davis
Sam Shields
Alterraun Verner
Brandon Browner

» Over the Cap- 2014 NFL Free Agent Cornerbacks

Personally I would go with Verner if we weren't able to retain Talib.

Here is Herm Edwards ranks from a few days ago on ESPN. Good to see Talib getting some love.

Herm Edwards ranks Peterson 2nd-best CB - Arizona Cardinals Blog - ESPN

 

[Ivan]

What is his cap # for year 5? I cannot find what the option is on the internet.

» Over the Cap- Nate Solder Salary Cap and Contract Page

The thing about Solder is they may want to try and do it this offseason because he is quickly developing into the top LT in the game so if they can save a few bucks it could be a good move.

I agree they did a great job with their cap management and they carried over a good amount this season too. I am with you on the reworking of Wilfork I think they’ll turn it into a 3 year deal at a lower cost, Vince seems like a guy who is happy where he is. Mankins also carries a big number I don’t have the same confidence in his willingness to rework the deal but I think they will cut him outright if he refuses. Wendell should also be an interesting decision.

I would love to see Spikes back and I for one feel he is worth more on this team than anyplace else so I see it being a possibility, especially as teams spend more time in sub packages his value is not nearly as high on the open market.

Do you think they’ll see any relief for Hernandez? I am not that great at understanding the cap (dead money, etc.) I usually use Miguel’s page.

I don't bother with the numbers anymore, i used to but eventually realized it was a waste of my time. Miguel has the best site there is for those who want to crunch them. They should get Hernandez relief at some point, and overall they are so far ahead of the game in considering their internal salary structure that as long as they are staying in good shape they can manipulate it to whatever they feel they need to. I can remember many times when they didn't pay what I would have hoped for players but never a time when they didn't have the money to if they chose to.

I like Spikes, i think he is an intimidating force who could be an unbelievable role player for them, but he shouldn't be out there on passing downs unless he is going after the QB. Unfortunately i think he sees himself as a 3 down player and a star, and he will go elsewhere for either the money, the opportunity, or both. They won't use a tag on him and I just think that when all is said and done he walks. I won't be surprised to see him end up on either NJ team.

I think they redo Wilfork to let him end his career here, 3-4 years at a reduced hit.

Solder is too early, there is a well known piece about Belichick and Jimmy Johnson where he recounts Johnson telling him to never pay early, and while he has tweaked that in recent years there is no need to do so with Solder for at least another season. He will deal with the more pressing issues and create room to deal with those that come after that, and worry about 3 years down the road. I don't expect a big foray into free agency but would love the A. Jones signing, and i think more of their focus will be on restructuring to deal with the impending issues for 2014, which will be extensive.

 

[ausbacker]

Talib is obviously who I would want but there are other CB’s who will be on the market so I am not sure if he will command the attention some believe on the open market.

These are some other bigger names along with Talib:

Charles Tillman
Brent Grimes
Tim Jennings
Vontae Davis
Sam Shields
Alterraun Verner
Brandon Browner

» Over the Cap- 2014 NFL Free Agent Cornerbacks

Personally I would go with Verner if we weren't able to retain Talib.

Here is Herm Edwards ranks from a few days ago on ESPN. Good to see Talib getting some love.

Herm Edwards ranks Peterson 2nd-best CB - Arizona Cardinals Blog - ESPN

Talib is better than all of those "bigger names" save perhaps Tillman Brady6.

 

[Brady6]

Talib is better than all of those "bigger names" save perhaps Tillman Brady6.

Oh I absolutely agree, all I'm saying is teams will have options. Talib does come baring some baggage which could scare some teams. I think Verner will be the most sought after because he turns 25 years old and is really starting to come into his own.

Some teams will also looking to make a run a Richard Sherman who could be a UFA in 2015.

 

[mgteich]

The question is how much is Talib for a half a year worth. Of course, the answer depends on which half you get.

Talib is better than all of those "bigger names" save perhaps Tillman Brady6.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

simple answer...too much

 

[supafly]

The question is how much is Talib for a half a year worth. Of course, the answer depends on which half you get.

I've started to wonder if his chronic hip issues may provide an additional obstacle to being retained next season, from the team's point of view.

It may be possible that they want him to have surgery if they're going to offer a bigger multi year deal, although that could always end up making it worse too. Since I have no idea about the injury significance of the hip, it's hard to comment. I'm just sharing something that has crossed my mind.

 

[supafly]

This question is virtually impossible to answer due to either team nor player knowing how the market for CB's will play out.

It's also the main reason why I can't envision a deal being reached before free agency opens.

 

[supafly]

Talib is obviously who I would want but there are other CB’s who will be on the market so I am not sure if he will command the attention some believe on the open market.

These are some other bigger names along with Talib:

Charles Tillman
Brent Grimes
Tim Jennings
Vontae Davis
Sam Shields
Alterraun Verner
Brandon Browner

» Over the Cap- 2014 NFL Free Agent Cornerbacks

Personally I would go with Verner if we weren't able to retain Talib.

Here is Herm Edwards ranks from a few days ago on ESPN. Good to see Talib getting some love.

Herm Edwards ranks Peterson 2nd-best CB - Arizona Cardinals Blog - ESPN

What's up with your boy, Verner? He's having one hell of a year.

Currently on pace for close to double digit INT's and passes defended in the high 20's. Add in another 3-4 fumbles that are recovered, and he's been one of the best CB's in the game, at least production-wise. The Titans would have to be idiots to let him walk.

 

[Fencer]

Notwithstanding the likelihood of a bidding war, I have a hunch Talib will wind up staying with the Pats. Why? Because I have a hunch he buys into the idea "I seem to be a better person now that I'm with this team."

Also, while he surely wants to cash in, he hasn't been hungry for money either, since he was a first-round pick. That doesn't prove he won't go crazy for maximum bucks ala' Ty Law, but there's at least a chance that he won't.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Talib is at the very LEAST a top 10 corner in the NFL when healthy. And you think the Pats are going to offer him 5.2 million per season? WTF are you smoking, cos that must be really good $!#&!!!

You might, they won't. I don't see NE going beyond 4-26 or 5-32 and I doubt they offer him 5. They will come in around 6-7 with clauses, he will never see 8-9 million a year from the Patriots.

I think to keep Talib you've got to give him a long term deal, and tie a lot of it into incentives. If the agent can claim he got 5/45m for his client, then everyone can be happy, even when in reality maybe he's only likely to achieve 8m of it per season and that only if he stays healthy at least 85% of the time.

In actuality a 5 year deal isn't a bad idea, because it allows you to spread out the cap hit n the bonus money/signing bonus which would need to be at least double digits. Or if you want to keep the deal shorter and frontload it, you give him like a Randy Moss contract - 3/27 with about half up front.

The question is how much is Talib for a half a year worth. Of course, the answer depends on which half you get.

These are the same people who negotiated the Amendola deal. I think they KNOW how to structure contracts for injury risk players by now!! Talib's deal would be like Amendola's but plus sized to reflect the higher market demand for corners.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

The question is how much is Talib for a half a year worth. Of course, the answer depends on which half you get.

Your point is salient and frequently a bit glossed over in order to crown Talib one of the best CBs in the game. But consider if Talib was a WR who was averaging 7 catches per game and 12 yards per catch for the first 8 games of the season. That would make him a 1000+ yard, 100+ catch per season player and one of the premier WR's in the game. But is he one of the most premier WR in the game if he typically misses 8 games a season?? In real terms that would make him a 500 yard, 50 catch per season WR (not premier). I would further argue the real value is even a bit more than halved because a player who is frequently missing makes 'consistency in team play' a bit harder to achieve as the season progresses.

If BB believes that Talib's 'missed game frequency' has a noticeably higher than average probability to pop up every season for 4 to 6 to 8 games, signing him to a multi year deal with a big signing bonus and 10+ million per year is simply not wise. You don't commit huge-top money for that. And as much as it has been great! to see what top level CB play can do for the Patriots' defense, playing the cap value game smarter than most other teams has been, arguably, one of the main components of the Patriots remaining competitive over such a long stretch of time. IMHO signing an average CB at average CB pricing who will provide average play over 16, or close to 16, games a season -- then using the cap savings for other signings/re-signings -- will result in more victories over the long term. And while it almost certainly will also result in seeing more instances of ugly and frustrating pass completions by opposing teams, isn't the ultimate goal to field a team that will achieve the most victories?

 

[Miguel]

They don't have to do anything about Jones, Solder, or Hightower for 2 years and Dennard will be restricted when he comes ups.

Dennard will NOT be a restricted free agent when his rookie contract ends after the 2015 season. He will have played 4 seasons by then.

 

[Miguel]

What is his cap # for year 5? I cannot find what the option is on the internet.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...ing-assets-next-season-page2.html#post3545560

I project it to be $7.6 million.

 

[coolguy]

Couldn't the patriots just franchise tag him?

 

[grux]

I wouldn't break the bank for a player who has a chronic hip problem and will most likely miss games every season. I would offer him a 1 or 2 year team friendly contract.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I wouldn't break the bank for a player who has a chronic hip problem and will most likely miss games every season. I would offer him a 1 or 2 year team friendly contract.

1. How do you know he has a chronic hip problem? Have you seen his x-rays?
2. LOL, 1-2 years would not get Talib signed or ANY other of the top free agent CBs for the 2014 season.
3. The difference between Talib and the other upcoming free agent corners is that we KNOW he EXCELS in our system! The devil you know vs the devil you don't.
4. Pats can build in injury-protection to the contract, the same way they did with Amendola. If Talib is fully healthy he will make the max value of the contract, if not, he makes less. Sounds fair to me.

Couldn't the patriots just franchise tag him?

It's an option, but it might not be necessary if they can come to some kind of deal with him. Negotiations haven't even started yet, this is all just speculation by the fans.

 

[Archeryaddict12]

1. How do you know he has a chronic hip problem? Have you seen his x-rays?
2. LOL, 1-2 years would not get Talib signed or ANY other of the top free agent CBs for the 2014 season.
3. The difference between Talib and the other upcoming free agent corners is that we KNOW he EXCELS in our system! The devil you know vs the devil you don't.
4. Pats can build in injury-protection to the contract, the same way they did with Amendola. If Talib is fully healthy he will make the max value of the contract, if not, he makes less. Sounds fair to me.



It's an option, but it might not be necessary if they can come to some kind of deal with him. Negotiations haven't even started yet, this is all just speculation by the fans.

Its chronic. Look at all his seasons. He hasn't finished a season and it was because of his hammy and hip. It's ended him on IR twice. He went out last year against Baltimore: hip. Same in the texans I think also. He is injury prone (que to amendola haters, talib defines injury prone). I love talib, but he has to get this injury fixed if he wants top $.

 

[chasa]

considering his injury history, I'd say 6.5 million a year