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BB-Broncos not the better team

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by R_T26, Jan 16, 2006.

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  1. R_T26

    R_T26 Banned

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    Very interesting and surprising. When he was on EEI they were talking about the game and he goes-" The better team...(pause), Denver played better then us Saturday" and then something to the effect "i dont think Denvers the better team".
     
  2. TruthSeeker

    TruthSeeker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't think the better team coughs up the ball 5 times. BB is a deity to me, but I disagree with hime. The better team won, period. So many people are saying "Other than the 5 turnovers" and "We outgained them 420-286", big deal, The 5 turnovers were the reason for the loss, and unfortunately, they did happen, so we can't say "Other Than". The better team had 1 turnover.
     
  3. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Its a tough pill to swallow when a team gets 21 points by having their offense move the ball 24 yards total

    The statement that Denver played better than us on Saturday is all that is really relevant though

    Denver took care of the ball - we did not.
     
  4. bball831

    bball831 On the Roster

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    the better team that night one yes. But I think we are the better team still. Not that night, even though that's all that matters.
     
  5. sieglo

    sieglo In the Starting Line-Up

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    Denver is in for a rude awakening when they come to the Razor next year.

    In fact, I think that the entire league is in for a rude awakening. Given the Pats talent, schedule, and the fact that after this debacle they will have a MAJOR CHIP ON THEIR SHOULDER, I think they may even find themselves contending for a perfect season.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2006
  6. broncoted

    broncoted Banned

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    If you call one pass interference a debacle, be my guest....Denver had 280 yards because you gave them the short field....in which...we thank you =)
     
  7. drewdagreat

    drewdagreat On the Game Day Roster

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    Does it even matter who the better team was? They won. They're moving on. End of story.
     
  8. ClosingTime

    ClosingTime On the Game Day Roster

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    What freaking crybaby.
    Pats have won those types of games for four years now and now he's going to say that?
    Call me a troll, ban me, whatever, what a classless hypocrite.
     
  9. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    It depends how you define the better team.

    If you define it as the one who made the good plays and/or didn't make the bad plays to win then, yes, the Broncos were the better team.

    If you define it as the team that won the majority of the plays and would win more often than not if the game were played 100 times then the Patriots were the better team.

    We were the better team IMO. But like other teams have done against us, we blew it. Big time. Belichick can be a hard ass and hold a grudge so I'm not surprised he can't get the words "the Broncos were the better team" out . . . and I don't blame him. The better team doesn't always win. But the Patriots have only themselves to blame :mad:
     
  10. Willie55

    Willie55 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Would've, could've, should've. It is what it is. The Broncos won and the Pats didn't.
     
  11. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I'm fairly sure no-one has disputed that.
     
  12. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I believe if these same 2 teams play, the patriots win 7 or 8 times out of 10. Denver was the better team on Saturday night, they are not the better team though IMO.

    It's not even as if our turnovers were forced by great plays from the broncos. Faulk's fumble was from a weak outstretched arm, not a huge hit or big rip on the ball. We know faulk has the fumble problem and it showed at the wrong time. Brown muffed the punt that was right in his hands. Brady made a bad decision and unless bailey has butter fingers it's his ball to catch.

    The broncos scored 24 points only having to drive 24 yards. The other times we didn't turn the ball over or have a horrible PI call and they actually had to put together sustaned drives, they got 260 yards and only 3 points.


    But oh well, it's the playoffs, win or go home. Just a reminder of how special what they have been able to do over the past 4 years really was. And it's not even close to being done IMO. Kraft wanted to be like the 9ers, with over a decade of at least being a serious competitor and I think that's what we'll get.
     
  13. PYPER

    PYPER Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    So you think that Denver is a better team than New England??? Is that really what you think??? I can understand you saying that we didn't deserve to win but I don't understand, based on what we all saw Saturday Night, what impressed you about Denver.

    Our defense was the best unit on the field.

    Let me break it down like this. If the refs don't blow all those calls, what's the score look like then. Remember, the defense was playing amazing.

    The fifth turnover was a desperate heave at the end. That doesn't happen unless they're in a desperate situation so let's set it aside for the moment. So now we're basically working with 4 turnovers. Of those 4 turnovers, all but Troy Brown's fumble were forced. So let's throw that one out.

    What does the game look like minus the bad officiating and minus Troy Brown's fumble?

    We were leading 3-0 when Faulk fumbled to setup the outragious pass interference call. Based on the way our defense was playing, I find it unlikely that they would have scored a TD without that call. It's quite possible we would have stopped them outright but for arguments sake let's say they got a FG.

    SCORE: NE 3 - DEN 3


    Hobbs' fumble then set up their 50 yard FG. But wait!!! We're assuming that the officiating was good and Denver actually had an uncalled false start on the 50 yard FG attempt, we're going to wipe it off the board.

    HALFTIME SCORE: NE 3 - DEN 3


    That means that on that pivotal 3rd down where Brady was picked, the score should have been 6-3 in our favor instead of 6-10 against us. It's quite possible that with a 3 point lead, Brady doesn't feel the need to force that ball in there and is willing to settle for a FG and a 9-3 lead.

    But let's give Denver that interception anyway. But instead of getting run down at the 1, this time the officials call a touchback. So instead of trailing 17-6, we still lead 6-3.

    Who knows what the final score would've been but the entire game looks very different just buy eliminating the officiating errors.

    Even if we add in our 4th turnover (Brown's muff) we likely win this game.

    In other words, we had enough to overcome our own mistakes. What we couldn't do was overcome our own mistakes PLUS the mistakes of the refs. Combined together, those mistakes allowed an inferior team to claim the victory. In other words, the entire game was a mistake.

    The best team really didn't win. The best team in the league will be sitting at home during the Super Bowl.
     
  14. SoonerPatriot

    SoonerPatriot In the Starting Line-Up

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    I don't have a problem with what BB said. The Patriots turn the ball over once they win. They turn it over twice they probably win. Turn it over five times and you can expect to lose -- every time. And that's the breaks. You take the good with the bad.

    But pardon me if I'm not in awe of Denver. They had little to do with forcing most of those TO's and didn't really show any signs they could have driven the length of the field to score touchdowns on offense. The Texans or Packers could have done what Denver did Saturday night given the same opportunities in the exact same spots. Is that supposed to be impressive? Is that the mark of greatness?
     
  15. CheerforTom

    CheerforTom Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    I just don't understand how anyone (let alone dedicated Patriots fans) could think that 3 HUGE fumbles plus ONE huge pick leads to the winning team being superior... it's 4 plays people, even if they were 4 huge ones which decided the game. There's the whole rest of the game out there which had a relatively low effect on the score, especially in the first 3 quarters! How are those first 3 quarters not relevant to this discussion??

    A good example of what I'm saying is this: Brady threw 2 picks, one of which was returned for a TD (in essence). Does that make Plummer the "better" quarterback? Maybe he played better in some aspects, but he also had to deal with a lot less. Anyone in their right mind knows that Brady is better. It's the same situation here when you compare Denver and New England on Saturday.

    That's not sour grapes, whining, whatever. It's the truth.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2006
  16. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Because we as dedicated Patriots fans have watched as other teams have tried to convince themselves year after year that they were better teams than the Super Bowl Champions - and we're not about to do the same thing.

    Were the 2001 Patriots the best team in football? Apparently not by your reasoning. They had quite a few balls bounce their way and recovered loose balls that could have just as easilly been recovered by the other team.

    We're not playing best out of 3 here - its one and done and if you don't control the football and the other team does, its pretty tough to say you are the better team.
     
  17. CheerforTom

    CheerforTom Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    If teams outgained them in yardage and dominated them on defense, but surrendered the ball a lot which lead to Pats wins, then yeah, they WOULD be better teams. I don't agree at all that this was the case. It's reaching just as much as anyone to say that turnovers won the Patriots their first Super Bowl (which IS what you're implying).

    It's true we're not playing the best of 3, and the Broncos are indisputably the ones moving on. What were debating here is that the Patriots are the better team despite losing the game to them. It's a question of it you even believe that's possible (as the original poster suggested). I certainly do, and this would be the textbook case of it: like I've already said, the Patriots lost this game on 3 plays. Why is what they did for the rest of the game irrelevant?

    Also, what do you think of what I said about Brady and Plummer as example? Seriously, I'd like to know. According to my reasoning, you SHOULD think that Plummer is better...
     
  18. ClosingTime

    ClosingTime On the Game Day Roster

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    2001 AFCC game. Steelers dominated the Pats in offensive an defensive categories.


    Pats fans hated hearing this from Steeler fans in 2001.
    Oh and almost every game comes down to three or four plays.

    He most certainly was on Saturday. He scored TDs and didn't throw an INT for a 100 yard return.

    Now, it's fine for fans to get wrapped up in this "we're better, just unlucky, bad bounces, bad calls etc,...but we;re still the better team"
    It's entirely different for a head coach of an NFL team to say this. Just say they played better than us, they deserve it, we should have played better and go play golf. But no, BB can't be a stand up guy. What a classless, disrespectful statement.
     
  19. CheerforTom

    CheerforTom Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    And I don't know if you're a Broncos fan or not, but if so, I wouldn't be tossing around the term 'classless'.
     
  20. SoonerPatriot

    SoonerPatriot In the Starting Line-Up

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    No he's a Steelers fan who posts on a Patriots board.
     
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