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So, for you Folk has been terrible?If
that is the issue for me... lately our choice of kickers has been less than stellar
and that's a high cost for a kicker imo
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So, for you Folk has been terrible?If
that is the issue for me... lately our choice of kickers has been less than stellar
and that's a high cost for a kicker imo
Your opinion and mine are not very different. BB loves guys with experience. He also says and does "better to move on from a player a year early than a year too late".Let's try again.
1) We have Rham.
2) Belichick looked at the backups, and signed Robinson.
3) We have Strong under contract. He showed little in 2022.
4) Harris showed much less in 2022, as expected by most of us.
5) There will be many running backs available during camp and after.
MY CONCLUSIONS
A) Strong or Harris will be competing, with Strong as the favorite.
B) Montgomery is a utility player and special teamer who is much more favored than a #3 thumper. If healthy, he will make the 53.
C) If Montgomery can't play, I see us looking to the waiver wire for someone to compete with Strong and Harris, and at very worst end up on the Practice Squad. Montgomery is NOT part of the future. He is older, veteran special teamer, a type of player favored by Belichick.
BOTTOM LINE
I STRONGLY prefer Montogmery on the 53, and Harris on the Practice Squad.
has Folk been a terrible kicker? no, he hasn't... I like Nick Folk, despite his glaring shortcomings... a short coming that i believe lead to the aggravation of the injury our former pro bowl punter suffered from - Him not being able to make his kickoffs is not a good position for us to be in...So, for you Folk has been terrible?
I saw lists where Ryland was as high as two... never saw him in the pole position... there there were lists where he wasn't even mentioned among 7 or 8 guys... so who's to say if he is good or not ... please know, I will GLADLY eat crow over this if i am wrong... I want him to do well.I am confused, not trying to be a ****. They went out and got a good kicker, depending on who is ranking them, that was ranked 1-4th. Like you guys, I don't like the slot, but they liked him, a position of need, and had no dance partners to trade back (so the reports go), so they took him. The whole middle of the draft is low risk interior linemen. Tells me they hated this draft class in the middle rounds. Anyway.. I am off on a tangent. You guys both admit kicking is important, yet you give them an F here? Just because of the slot?
If
that is the issue for me... lately our choice of kickers has been less than stellar
and that's a high cost for a kicker imo
Based on one bad pick in 2020. Ok.If
that is the issue for me... lately our choice of kickers has been less than stellar
and that's a high cost for a kicker imo
He's been declining, is turning 39, is losing range and can no longer kick-off.So, for you Folk has been terrible?
I would have loved Mayer, but he went in R2, and I have zero issue with the White pick. There's no one in the 4th that sticks out to me that I say why couldn't we have that guy? I would have liked Mauch, Schoonmaker or Mims in R2 later than the White pick, so that's where they needed to move up to. The R3 Mapu pick is the one I scratch my head at. Feel like Bill being Bill again, showing us he's smarter than everyone by taking a small school guy, while Downs was still there, as was Washington and Jordan Battle. R4? Dawand Jones instead of Andrews, who likely would have been there at 112, and then ok with Sidy Sow where he was. Then Ryland in R5 instead of Mafi. All this is with the benefit of hindsight, so who the hell knows what goes on. I guess my beef with them was they didn't move up into the end of R2 to get another starter. I have to assume the price was too high to go up to the end of R2, so they end up with safe IOL picks in 4-5 with a kicker because there was no value in R4, and everyone in the NFL knew it, so the R4 picks were not of any value to trade up.I saw lists where Ryland was as high as two... never saw him in the pole position... there there were lists where he wasn't even mentioned among 7 or 8 guys... so who's to say if he is good or not ... please know, I will GLADLY eat crow over this if i am wrong... I want him to do well.
The issue i have with it is this... That fourth round pick could have been better spent... Why wasnt it used to move up to a higher round to get a better skill position player... I gladly would have sacrificed a 4th to move up (like Josh did) to snag Michael Mayer... or whoever tickled your fancy in the draft...
It’s all good. “Clown yourself” was maybe a bit harsh; apologies….it was aftermidnight for me posting.thanks for the reply... I saw the team needs as OT, WR, TE. DB, LB/E, DT, K/P
don't want a nem like exchange either... just wanted to know why...
i didn't do a ton of research, not like i used to... but then, hardly anyone does... Was I "clowning myself"? nah... that was me just being honest about it, unlike most who will try to pass themselves off as experts... bcg most here are not, so why pretend to be?
I did watch some of the guys after they were selected, but honestly, is ten minutes of watching youtube and twitter highlights really a good look at a player? No, its not, and thats what a lot of people use in their grading assessments... I tried to do something a bit different... guess it didnt work as well as i thought...
the break down was a generalized assessment of the overall draft versus what I thought our needs were and are... doesn't make me right, or wrong... I thought we needed an OT, we didn't get one... not one... That's a failure on our part... But I also thought we needed an edge, and/or a linebacker - Good picks imo, even without me knowing a ton (or anything) about each player... why would I know anything about Keion White? I've never watched a GT game in my life... and be honest how many times did you hear the name Keion White on the boards prior to the draft? Maybe once i'd be willing to wager... But I liked the addition of the positional player... Thats not a contradiction... and I thought we gave up way too much to move up and draft a kicker and that's a fail imo... chances are we could have gotten a kicker after the draft...
The post was a bit sloppyily written, i agree... really wasnt trying to do a this guy gets A that guy gets a B analysis... more of a general sense of how the draft went, and whether or not it met our needs as I saw them...
and for what a good draft is... it varies person to person... for me : D is jete level... C-, C is average... a C+ is a good draft... B- & B is good to very good, B+ is very good to excellent draft... A knocks it out of the park
Gronk, Hernandez off the top of my head that were sure fire and contributed from day 1..If you root for a sports team and don't have unfounded optimism, then you're doing it wrong. It's entertainment.
As for the rest above, when's the last time the Patriots drafted a player who seems as sure-fire (of course, there's always doubt) as Christian Gonzales? Wilfork?
I'll wait.
You could be right. I don't know what happened with Washington and Kraft, but the Pats were hardly the only ones to let them free-fall. The others? Meh.
I'm not sold on Mapu, but whatever.
It's the JOB of the Patriots marketing team to pump the team. Like, it's WHY they get paid.
As for the media, the network guys aren't paid to get clicks, but to talk to everyone. If you want misery, sports radio is right there waiting - the job of those guys is to be outrageous and angry, contrarian, and generally a-holes. The network media is for people who haven't fallen into misery.
Round 3 was a gamble.
Round 4/5 filled two huge needs - OL and K. I'm optimistic about Sidy Sow, and now I"m hearing many people saying that Mafi is even better, No idea on Andrews, but I'll trust Popovich here. And again, the idea that anyone picked after 3 will be truly meaningful on a team is a massive crapshoot - particularly in a draft that, yes, seemed really weak. My thoughts after reading everything here and elsewhere ar ethat the Pats got at least two guys with the physical attributes to be powerful OL maulers, and that at least one of these three is going to be a valuable contributor.
Draft grades are based on individual opinions - there's no magical metric, Heck, look at the mock simulators - Fanspeak has like 10 boards to choose from and your entire draft will be cornered by the board you choose.
Pats, with mediocre position, got their most promising pick since Wilfork at least, and didn't spend a ton of capital to move up - and STILL got another guy they were thinking about at 17. What the heck is wrong with that? And almost all draft outcomes (unless you've traded away players/picks to have lots of high picks) hinge on the first couple of picks.
The places where the Pats are rated C, or whatever, almost all hinge on the kicker (with never a mention that they used pick 117 (and a sixth), while having the pick 120 from trading down (before taking the best prospect they've had in more than a decade) right behind. Combine those two transactions and they got Ryland with a 6th and 3 slots in the fourth.
And I can't even believe some of the stupidity I'm reading about drafting kickers - one site tweaked the Pats and asked why anyone would draft a kicker, since it never works out - you'd think a site posing as football analysts might have heard of Stephen Gostowski. Kicking and punting cost the Pats at least two games last year. It matters now. A lot.
Your opinion and mine are not very different. BB loves guys with experience. He also says and does "better to move on from a player a year early than a year too late".
Damien Harris's rookie year was no more promising than Strongs.
The only issue I have is with Montgomery and Davis. They are both Belichick types and should make the 53 if they are not injured again. IMO, Montgomery's injury was a serious disappointment to the ST's last year. Davis is easily replaced, but Montgomery has several roles.Your opinion and mine are not very different. BB loves guys with experience. He also says and does "better to move on from a player a year early than a year too late".
Damien Harris's rookie year was no more promising than Strongs.
The ST was poor last year in part because of injury (Montgomery, Davis), and losses of key players not fully replaced (King, Bolden). Change is in the air. K & P almost for sure will be new, and others from this draft/UDFA/FA. Slater near the end - he seems like a guy that if he decides he can't do it, won't need a tap on the shoulder. I'd bet either Montgomery or Davis will be cut, or end up on IR/injury settlement this year. BB is mortified by the ST's performance last year, he won't be again.
Yup.Based on one bad pick in 2020. Ok.
thats part of the whole point... we had ammo to move up. didnt use itI would have loved Mayer, but he went in R2,
I saw lists where Ryland was as high as two... never saw him in the pole position... there there were lists where he wasn't even mentioned among 7 or 8 guys... so who's to say if he is good or not ... please know, I will GLADLY eat crow over this if i am wrong... I want him to do well.
The issue i have with it is this... That fourth round pick could have been better spent... Why wasnt it used to move up to a higher round to get a better skill position player... I gladly would have sacrificed a 4th to move up (like Josh did) to snag Michael Mayer... or whoever tickled your fancy in the draft...
never heard of bnb football, thanks for the tip, will read the siteTop Kicker Prospects in the 2023 NFL Draft | BNB Football
Find the top place kicker prospects in the 2023 NFL Draft. Our professional rankings are accurate, in-depth, and cover a wide range of prospects.bnbfootball.com
Did they have the ammo though? The Raiders moved up 3 spots, it cost them 38 and 141. I'm guessing, uneducatedly, that to get in the end of R2 probably would have cost the 3 and maybe a 4 and a pick next year? We are talking about moving up into the 50s from 76. That's big jump, when it seems the values in the 100-130 range was not as high as some other years. I can see a scenario where the Pats would make a call and get told that no one wants your R4s. I am not trying to make excuses or be a homer, just trying to grasp whey they didn't move up when it appeared the ammo was there.thats part of the whole point... we had ammo to move up. didnt use it