From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up [merged]

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Unlike most sports franchises, the Pats are an extremely tight lipped operation as we all well know. We also know that this really upsets many media types as that lack of accessibility cuts into their bread and butter...hardcore insider information.

So if you're the media, ho do you counteract this?

You throw a bunch of junk against the wall and hope something sticks or hope it draws somekind of reaction from the team.

Totally plausible.

It doesn't sound like it in this case. What you are failing to realize is that these rumors started two days before they were reported by anyone in the media. If it was the case that someone in the media was just throwing "a bunch of junk against the wall", why did this rumor hang around for two days with not one media person even mentioning in passing? It makes no sense.

It could be a bogus rumor, but there is absolutely no evidence that it was created or perpetuated by anyone in the media. It is just easier to blame Felger, Tomase, Florio for perpetuating a bogus rumor than accept the fact that it could be coming from legitimate sources and that it could be true.

It may not be true, but I have seen absolutely nothing that shows me that Felger, Tomase, or Florio are the ones spreading the rumor other than what they are posting on their sites.

PFT hasn't changed in the last 24 hours. The only difference is rather than putting out rumors of Michael Vick, Florio has a rumor of Randy Moss which isn't too appealing to Patriots fans.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Hi. I'm an ass. Sorry about that! It's early here! (L.A.)

I fell for it too. I guess because there are so many people who actually are posting wacky theories like this, I guess it is hard to determine who is actually conspiracy theorist or not. I am sorry too for my reaction.

 

[Slagathor]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

I fell for it too. I guess because there are so many people who actually are posting wacky theories like this, I guess it is hard to determine who is actually conspiracy theorist or not. I am sorry too for my reaction.

The media putting out bad or biased information???

Perish the thought!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why is that such a wacky theory?

 

[Slagathor]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

It doesn't sound like it in this case. What you are failing to realize is that these rumors started two days before they were reported by anyone in the media. If it was the case that someone in the media was just throwing "a bunch of junk against the wall", why did this rumor hang around for two days with not one media person even mentioning in passing? It makes no sense.

It could be a bogus rumor, but there is absolutely no evidence that it was created or perpetuated by anyone in the media. It is just easier to blame Felger, Tomase, Florio for perpetuating a bogus rumor than accept the fact that it could be coming from legitimate sources and that it could be true.

It may not be true, but I have seen absolutely nothing that shows me that Felger, Tomase, or Florio are the ones spreading the rumor other than what they are posting on their sites.

PFT hasn't changed in the last 24 hours. The only difference is rather than putting out rumors of Michael Vick, Florio has a rumor of Randy Moss which isn't too appealing to Patriots fans.

Two days prior to cut down day, I heard no rumors that the Pats were contemplating cutting Moss.

I heard a few media types conjecturing that there must be something bad going on between Moss and the Pats. I went to Thursday's last pre-season game and was all over listening to the radio and searching the net for Pats info prior to the game.

I neither heard nor saw anything mentioning the Pat's considering cutting Moss until yesterday on PFT.

I would love to see any earlier reports.

 

[DynastyDriven]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

PFT claims to have so many sources, I would just like to see one other outlet reporting this. Just one! I've searched high and low and haven't seen one mention of this elsewhere.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Two days prior to cut down day, I heard no rumors that the Pats were contemplating cutting Moss.

I heard a few media types conjecturing that there must be something bad going on between Moss and the Pats. I went to Thursday's last pre-season game and was all over listening to the radio and searching the net for Pats info prior to the game.

I neither heard nor saw anything mentioning the Pat's considering cutting Moss until yesterday on PFT.

I would love to see any earlier reports.

You missed my point. You didn't hear about a rumor about Moss getting cut two days before cut down day, but according to Tomase people in the media were. So there rumor was out there and at least some in the media were hearing it and none of them were talking for two days.

Here is what Tomase wrote on his blog last night:

However, a rumor gaining momentum over the last three days is that they’re planning to drop Randy Moss, which would be a shocker to end all shockers.

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/patriots/

So there rumor was actually there since Thursday, but no one reported it until PFT reported it on Saturday. I don't know how that is media trying create a story if it is already there and no one is reporting it.

 

[Slagathor]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

PFT claims to have so many sources, I would just like to see one other outlet reporting this. Just one! I've searched high and low and haven't seen one mention of this elsewhere.

Take a look a what an "investigative reporter" like Cimini did yesterday.

He totally mis-read King's story and created an uproar.

I have no doubt lots of people listen to someone "theorizing" on the Moss situation and interpret it as gospel truth.

 

[Slagathor]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

You missed my point. You didn't hear about a rumor about Moss getting cut three days before cut down day, but according to Tomase people in the media were. So there rumor was out there and at least some in the media were hearing it and none of them were talking for two days.

Here is what Tomase wrote on his blog last night:



http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/patriots/

So there rumor was actually there since Thursday, but no one reported it until PFT reported it on Saturday. I don't know how that is media trying create a story if it is already there and no one is reporting it.

I understand.

But where do you think Tomase took that from?

Same place we did. PFT. He just spruced it up a bit. I don't recall any rumors or rumblings the prior three days. Are you gonna tell me the media conscienciously sat on these rumors for 3 days!!!!!!

Bill Belichick farts and there's a 5 page expose' about it on the internet 15 minutes later!

 

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

I understand.

But where do you think Tomase took that from?

Same place we did. PFT. He just spruced it up a bit. I don't recall any rumors or rumblings the prior three days. Are you gonna tell me the media conscienciously sat on these rumor for 3 days!!!!!!

Huh? Tomase heard the rumor on Thursday and PFT reported it on Saturday. How did Tomase get it from PFT?

As for the media not reporting a rumor, why would they. Journalists live by a code of reporting information given to them by a source close to the situation and can be independently verified. They don't report rumors. I'm sure Tomase, Guergian, Reiss, etc. hear rumors all the time and many of them come true. But since they cannot get anyone to verify the rumor they cannot report it.

Florio runs a rumor site. He does not need to live by that rule of journalism. He hears a rumor and it comes from a source he trusts (and sometimes isn't a source that he has ever gotten any information from before), he can run with it.

Florio didn't create the rumor. The rumor appeared to be there for days, but since Florio doesn't have get independent verification he ran with it. In fact, since it took Florio until Saturday to report it, it sounds like he heard the rumor after Tomase, not before him.

You are just rationalizing now.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Huh? Tomase heard the rumor on Thursday and PFT reported it on Saturday. How did Tomase get it from PFT?

As for the media not reporting a rumor, why would they. Journalists live by a code of reporting information given to them by a source close to the situation and can be independently verified. They don't report rumors. I'm sure Tomase, Guergian, Reiss, etc. hear rumors all the time and many of them come true. But since they cannot get anyone to verify the rumor they cannot report it.

Florio runs a rumor site. He does not need to live by that rule of journalism. He hears a rumor and it comes from a source he trusts (and sometimes isn't a source that he has ever gotten any information from before), he can run with it.

Florio didn't create the rumor. The rumor appeared to be there for days, but since Florio doesn't have get independent verification he ran with it. In fact, since it took Florio until Saturday to report it, it sounds like he heard the rumor after Tomase, not before him.

You are just rationalizing now.

Rationalizing? That's the same thing you're doing.

 

[patsox23]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

I think Felger is one of the few media guys who:

1) would start that rumor - or push conjecture that would lead to the misinterpretation

2) has a close connection to Florio and PFT

3) is shamelessly shilling for attention - the Moss rumor fits in nicely with his own clearly stated agenda

4) has a trumpeted-to-the-world problem with Moss

I don't see Tomase as the same. At ALL.

 

[Slagathor]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Huh? Tomase heard the rumor on Thursday and PFT reported it on Saturday. How did Tomase get it from PFT?

As for the media not reporting a rumor, why would they. Journalists live by a code of reporting information given to them by a source close to the situation and can be independently verified. They don't report rumors. I'm sure Tomase, Guergian, Reiss, etc. hear rumors all the time and many of them come true. But since they cannot get anyone to verify the rumor they cannot report it.

Florio runs a rumor site. He does not need to live by that rule of journalism. He hears a rumor and it comes from a source he trusts (and sometimes isn't a source that he has ever gotten any information from before), he can run with it.

Florio didn't create the rumor. The rumor appeared to be there for days, but since Florio doesn't have get independent verification he ran with it. In fact, since it took Florio until Saturday to report it, it sounds like he heard the rumor after Tomase, not before him.

You are just rationalizing now.

The news media won't run with a rumor if they can't verify it????? LOL!!!

I think I see why we're in disagreement here. There is very little difference between Florio and Tomase. That's what Tomase's blog is for. He can add and retract anything he wants without accountabilty to editors.

 

[patsox23]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Based on WHAT? You guys still haven't explained what FACT Tomase got wrong yesterday, except the Cimini thing. As far as Moss, he got the report EXACTLY right.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Rationalizing? That's the same thing you're doing.

Not at all. I have said over and over again that I don't know if this rumor is true or not. I just don't think it is some media conspiracy. Rumors about players are out there all the time. Some come true and some don't. To think this is some kind of media conspiracy and either Michael Felger, Mike Florio, or John Tomase created this rumor for their own biases towards Moss or need to be right is crazy though.

I think Moss will more likely than not be on the September 9th roster, but I do believe that these rumors came from someone outside the media. I don't think the media gains anything no matter their biases by this rumor and if this rumor doesn't come true, it only hurts PFT's credibility. Why would Florio want to hurt his credibility by manufacturing a rumor and then continue to run with it after roster cuts?

 

[patsox23]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

Rumors, rumors, rumors
Posted by John Tomase at 7:01 pm

It’s 7 p.m. and the Patriots still haven’t released their list of cuts. However, a rumor gaining momentum over the last three days is that they’re planning to drop Randy Moss, which would be a shocker to end all shockers. However, we must stress that in conversations with other league executives we’ve been unable to confirm this as anything more than hearsay.

A league source with knowledge of the Patriots’ moves said there’s a surprise on the cut list, but declined to elaborate. That could mean Moss. It could mean Reche Caldwell. Right now no one knows.

The Moss stuff began percolating on Thursday and really gained steam when Pro Football Talk included it in its rumor mill this morning. The theory seems to be the that the Pats aren’t sure he’ll embrace a role as a decoy. Reached today by colleague Karen Guregian, Moss’s agent, Tim DiPiero, said he hadn’t heard anything and that he was planning to be in the Meadowlands for Sunday’s opener, presumably to watch his client.

Maybe it’s nothing. Maybe Moss will be in uniform a week from tomorrow. We’ll keep you posted.


Okay, everyone - have a look. Which of Tomase's FACTS are inaccurate here?

 

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

I think Felger is one of the few media guys who:

1) would start that rumor - or push conjecture that would lead to the misinterpretation

2) has a close connection to Florio and PFT

3) is shamelessly shilling for attention - the Moss rumor fits in nicely with his own clearly stated agenda

4) has a trumpeted-to-the-world problem with Moss

I don't see Tomase as the same. At ALL.

Felger would start the rumor on his own show. Not give it to Florio. Felger is a shameless media whore now. Why would he give it to Florio to report on a Saturday when it won't have legs by his next show on Monday because cuts were already made? If Felger started this, he would have given it to Florio in enough time for Felger make it a topic of his show last week. Florio runs with stories as fast as they come in. Felger leaking this story makes no sense.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

Moss and PFT...wtf?????

What's going on here and what's the deal with this persistent rumor. I personally think it's crap, but PTF won't STFU about it. It's like if they print it long enough, it might come true.

Not sure if this has been posted already but there's another story from this AM.

--------------------------------

POSTED 10:15 a.m. EDT, September 2, 2007

MOSS RUMORS DON'T DIE

We are hearing more -- not less -- of those rumors that the Patriots might pull the plug prematurely on the Randy Moss experiment.

The talk is intensifying in the media, and among league insiders. One league source tells us that Moss is "b*itching quietly" about his perceived role in the offense. A media source says that "where there's smoke there's fire" on this story.

Karen Guregian of the Boston Herald mentions the rumors, and reports that Tim DiPiero, who represents Moss, had not heard of any potential issues with the former Pro Bowler whose arrival in New England has helped to push expectations higher than ever.

Though Moss was not released on Saturday, the team could still dump him prior to next weekend and avoid responsibility for his $2.5 million salary. As we mentioned on Saturday night, the Pats currently have six receivers on the roster -- Moss, Donte' Stallworth, Wes Welker, Jabar Gaffney, Reche Caldwell, and Kelley Washington. (Troy Brown and Chad Jackson are on the PUP list.)

Notably absent are any youngsters who would try to earn reps with the offense in the future through heavy involvement in special teams. As the roster is currently configured, guys like Gaffney and Caldwell (both starters in 2006) and Washington would be used for punt/kick coverage/return teams.

Could it be that the Pats will try to shop Moss to someone like the Packers or the Vikings before cutting him? Though Minnesota coach and former Eagles offensive coordinator Brad Childress surely has no interest in acquiring another potential T.O., owner Zygi Wilf might conclude that a return by Randy could be the way to sell out all of the seats for 2007.

--------------------------------

This last paragraph strikes me as desperately grasping at straws to sell this story. Why the F would they have not cut him last night instead of TRY trade a potentially volatile locker room guy in a market recently flodded with guys you can pick up for nuthing?

Anyone else think this is a BS, or is there something to it.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

The news media won't run with a rumor if they can't verify it????? LOL!!!

I think I see why we're in disagreement here. There is very little difference between Florio and Tomase. That's what Tomase's blog is for. He can add and retract anything he wants without accountabilty to editors.

Tomase does rumor some things on his blog that does not meet the journalistic standards, but he said he knew about this rumor since Thursday. Tomase knew the rumor for days and didn't report it until he heard from someone who you would assume that is in the Pats' organization that there was a surprise roster cut. So what exactly is your point?

 

[Slagathor]

Re: From PFT: Wow these guys don't give up

To think this is some kind of media conspiracy and either Michael Felger, Mike Florio, or John Tomase created this rumor for their own biases towards Moss or need to be right is crazy though.QUOTE]

You can't be that naive?

In Felger's case, there is a bias, either actual or manufactured for ratings purposes.

For Florio, how many hits did his site get because of these rumors.

For Tomase, I hate to pick on the fellow, but there's a need to stay relevant in a very competitive Boston sports meia market. He tends to jump the gun a little to often.

 

[RayClay]

Re: Moss and PFT...............wtf?????

What's going on here and what's the deal with this persistent rumor. I personally think it's crap, but PTF won't STFU about it. It's like if they print it long enough, it might come true.

Not sure if this has been posted already but there's another story from this AM.

--------------------------------

POSTED 10:15 a.m. EDT, September 2, 2007

MOSS RUMORS DON'T DIE

We are hearing more -- not less -- of those rumors that the Patriots might pull the plug prematurely on the Randy Moss experiment.

The talk is intensifying in the media, and among league insiders. One league source tells us that Moss is "b*itching quietly" about his perceived role in the offense. A media source says that "where there's smoke there's fire" on this story.

Karen Guregian of the Boston Herald mentions the rumors, and reports that Tim DiPiero, who represents Moss, had not heard of any potential issues with the former Pro Bowler whose arrival in New England has helped to push expectations higher than ever.

Though Moss was not released on Saturday, the team could still dump him prior to next weekend and avoid responsibility for his $2.5 million salary. As we mentioned on Saturday night, the Pats currently have six receivers on the roster -- Moss, Donte' Stallworth, Wes Welker, Jabar Gaffney, Reche Caldwell, and Kelley Washington. (Troy Brown and Chad Jackson are on the PUP list.)

Notably absent are any youngsters who would try to earn reps with the offense in the future through heavy involvement in special teams. As the roster is currently configured, guys like Gaffney and Caldwell (both starters in 2006) and Washington would be used for punt/kick coverage/return teams.

Could it be that the Pats will try to shop Moss to someone like the Packers or the Vikings before cutting him? Though Minnesota coach and former Eagles offensive coordinator Brad Childress surely has no interest in acquiring another potential T.O., owner Zygi Wilf might conclude that a return by Randy could be the way to sell out all of the seats for 2007.

--------------------------------

This last paragraph strikes me as desperately grasping at straws to sell this story. Why the F would they have not cut him last night instead of TRY trade a potentially volatile locker room guy in a market recently flodded with guys you can pick up for nuthing?

Anyone else think this is a BS, or is there something to it.

They've guessed wrong on about 8 stories in a row (as noted by Ponyexpress in the other thread). Moss is a "sensational" big name. If they're right on him they cover all their losses.