Patriots Pregame Thread Week 8 pregame discussion: Jete @ Your .142 Patriots

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Dont like to see concussions but if they weren’t benching polk this was ideal timing. Keep him on protocol for 2-3 weeks

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Booty and Thornton both have good-great speed. Looking forward to a long ball or 2. Both can take a slant to the house, I am pretty excited about this week especially with the improvement that Maye has shown. Yes I know that Booty ran a 4.5 40, but he was still recovering from 2 ankle surgeries.

Boutte was not a 4.2 guy before his 2 ankle surgeries. Boutte and Thornton are not similar in speed. Thornton is really fast and Boutte is average. There is more to being a WR than speed, but let's be honest about raw physical ability.

 

[captain stone]

Another embarrassment at home is not going to sit well with the faithfulls.

Or with ownership.

 

[upstater1]

They need to have the talent to match up with them first. They are one of the least talented defenses in the league.

Mayo isn't good enough x's and o's to help disguise the lack of talent Bill was able to do.

You put way too much stock in this defense needs to have stars mentality.

The defense needs to play well together. Full stop. They need good players, yes, but there's plenty of talent out there right now.

The 2018 defense was more talented because of Gilmore, but the rest of these guys are even with that D.

 

[Tunescribe]

The Pats' only hope of being in this game is knocking Rodgers out of it.

 

[archstanton543]

The Pats' only hope of being in this game is knocking Rodgers out of it.

Their only hope is stopping the run.

 

[Mike the Brit]

You put way too much stock in this defense needs to have stars mentality.

The defense needs to play well together. Full stop. They need good players, yes, but there's plenty of talent out there right now.

The 2018 defense was more talented because of Gilmore, but the rest of these guys are even with that D.

Not sure about that. First, the 2018 team had a much stouter defense up the middle with Shelton, Guy and Malcom Brown. The DBs weren't just Gilmore, but Chung, J.C. Jackson and the McCourty twins. And then there was "Mr February", Donta Hightower.

Still, there is no question that the defense didn't play well last week, even given their limitations in personnel.

 

[PatsFan2]

Their only hope is stopping the run.

Can't get blood from a stone: almost impossible task based on recent evidence.

 

[TommyD4207]

The Pats' only hope of being in this game is knocking Rodgers out of it.

You say this like Tyrod Taylor wouldn't light us the **** up. They have a better chance if Rodgers stays in.

 

[PatsFan2]

The Pats' only hope of being in this game is knocking Rodgers out of it.

D can't get to the passer also can't stop the run an Offenses dream.

 

[Tunescribe]

Their only hope is stopping the run.

You say this like Tyrod Taylor wouldn't light us the **** up. They have a better chance if Rodgers stays in.

If he remains upright Rodgers will pick the Pats' loose zone apart. I expect the Patriots to show improvement vs. the run and am guessing the Jete do as well.

 

[PatsFan2]

Boutte was not a 4.2 guy before his 2 ankle surgeries. Boutte and Thornton are not similar in speed. Thornton is really fast and Boutte is average. There is more to being a WR than speed, but let's be honest about raw physical ability.

I told you Wolf would would win GM of the year... Worse GM of the year award.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I told you Wolf would would win GM of the year... Worse GM of the year award.

Yes, you were right all along. I was wrong. Worse GM of the year. Wolf got Maye right I think, but all of FA plus the rest of the draft gets an F.

 

[TheRainMaker]

You put way too much stock in this defense needs to have stars mentality.

The defense needs to play well together. Full stop. They need good players, yes, but there's plenty of talent out there right now.

The 2018 defense was more talented because of Gilmore, but the rest of these guys are even with that D.

The Pats had the best secondary in the NFL.

HT has been a 2 time Pro Bowl player and a 2nd team All Pro.

Trey Flowers was a good complementary player on the D line as well as Van Noy at OLB.

This D does not have “plenty of talent” who have been overmatched the last 5 years. Bill did what he could with the players he picked. We are seeing now with an inferior coach they are one of the worst in the NFL.

 

[upstater1]

The Pats had the best secondary in the NFL.

HT has been a 2 time Pro Bowl player and a 2nd team All Pro.

Trey Flowers was a good complementary player on the D line as well as Van Noy at OLB.

This D does not have “plenty of talent” who have been overmatched the last 5 years. Bill did what he could with the players he picked. We are seeing now with an inferior coach they are one of the worst in the NFL.

With HT, the emphasis is on WAS. He had trended down.

Flowers is really no better than Wise or Keion White. I expected a Flowers trajectory for White if Belichick had stuck around.

Last 5 years? It's a totally different defense than what it was. Look at the players. They played well in the last 2 years after the overhaul.

 

[upstater1]

Not sure about that. First, the 2018 team had a much stouter defense up the middle with Shelton, Guy and Malcom Brown. The DBs weren't just Gilmore, but Chung, J.C. Jackson and the McCourty twins. And then there was "Mr February", Donta Hightower.

Still, there is no question that the defense didn't play well last week, even given their limitations in personnel.

? I'd much rather have Godchaux, Wise and Keion than Shelton, Malcolm Brown and Guy.

Gonzalez, Dugger, Marcus Jones and Jon Jones are a good D-backfield.

Hightower I should've listed with Gilmore BUT he was really at the end.

 

[TheRainMaker]

With HT, the emphasis is on WAS. He had trended down.

Sure, he was trending down, but still better than what they have now. They still have among the worst LB crew in the NFL.

Flowers is really no better than Wise or Keion White. I expected a Flowers trajectory for White if Belichick had stuck around.

Flowers was a way better player than Wise or the irrelevant Keion White. I wasn't the biggest fan of Flowers as he was dependent on Bill, but he was better than those guys.

Last 5 years? It's a totally different defense than what it was. Look at the players. They played well in the last 2 years after the overhaul.

The Pats defense has been overmatched by better teams for quite some time now. I've shown the stats numerous times and former players have come out and said the D isn't good. If the D was really good, Bill would still be here.

 

[upstater1]

Sure, he was trending down, but still better than what they have now. They still have among the worst LB crew in the NFL.

Flowers was a way better player than Wise or the irrelevant Keion White. I wasn't the biggest fan of Flowers as he was dependent on Bill, but he was better than those guys.

The Pats defense has been overmatched by better teams for quite some time now. I've shown the stats numerous times and former players have come out and said the D isn't good. If the D was really good, Bill would still be here.

The defense was good the last 2 years. They can't overcome Mac Jones's turnovers or being on the field constantly, but they were good.

You're proving my point by dismissing Keion White. These are top players playing under a bad coach. You think they're irrelevant, that's because of who the coach is.

This reminds me back in '01 when NFL GMs and Scouts said the Patriots were the most untalented team in football.

Go back and look at that roster.

 

[TheRainMaker]

The defense was good the last 2 years. They can't overcome Mac Jones's turnovers or being on the field constantly, but they were good.

Good defenses do better than the Pats have done allowing almost 30 points per game against good teams as opposed to half of that against bad teams.

You're proving my point by dismissing Keion White. These are top players playing under a bad coach. You think they're irrelevant, that's because of who the coach is.

White is pedestrian. Come on now. He's a worse version of Trey Flowers. Like Flowers, they can't take over games with their god given ability.

This reminds me back in '01 when NFL GMs and Scouts said the Patriots were the most untalented team in football.

Go back and look at that roster.

Yes, they were the most untalented in 2001 overall. Although they were coming off of bad seasons, they still had Pro Bowl and All Pro players in Law, Milloy and McGinest. They had complementary players in Bruschi and Johnson. Then they brought over hungry veterans in Cox, and Phiffer and other players such as Pleasant, Hamilton in 2000, Otis Smith, Terrell Buckley. Comparing this defense to the current Pats defenses is an insult to the 2001 team.

The offense was the major problem with no help for Bledsoe at WR on the outside besides Glenn, no TE and the OL and Antowain Smith were not going to scare anyone.

With that said, they had a losing record against teams .500 and above and would've possibly missed the playoffs had they not had a last place schedule.

 

[TomPatriot]

Can't get blood from a stone: almost impossible task based on recent evidence.

They didn’t make any meaningful adjustments.