Was this a Breakout Game by the Patriots Next Generation Defense?

[Off The Grid]

* Physically, this was just an important step in the right direction.

* Psychologically, this was huge.

This cannot be underestimated.

Excellent points.

 

[rojo8401]

No. Quite obviously not any kind of breakout performance by any objective football fan's estimation.

I'll go ahead and say that in my opinion, the Dolphins and Henne moved the ball at will during the first half and that there was very little pressure on Henne. The picks he threw were pretty much very poor decision making on his part (though the 2 int was a very athletic play by Ninkovich and the last a miscommunication). Anyone watching the game who claims they were confident in our defense is a pretty optimistic cat.

I would opine that this game was more flukey than a superior defensive effort. Punt blocks, UNFORCED interceptions (forced is defined by the QB being under pressure - there was none outside of Cunningham on 1 play). Pass rush continues to be a major problem and the source of that problem is Mike Wright.

I am happy with the win but I am not going to magically stop worrying about the defense because Henne had a bad night and their special teams had multiple breakdowns ( a punt should never be blocked in professional football).

McCourty looked good (minus the terrible PI call) and Mayo looks like he has regained a bit of his play but other than that, a pretty soft performance by our d.

I'm going to reserve my praise for Ninkovich until he performs at a consistent level and learns how to tackle.

 

[goheels22002]

didn't I just tell you to stop making sense???

what does it take to get you to see the obvious???

Oh. Was I making sense? That's never happened before. Maybe I better have my meds adjusted.

I love the guy who wrote that if it wasn't for the 2 INTs by Ninovich the defense would have sucked. Uh, yeah, but they were two pretty tough catches in traffic by a linebacker who was supposed to be just a special teamer and they did basically stop two drives by the other team. What is a good defense supposed to do? Burn the opposing offense at the stake?

 

[Synovia]

I would opine that this game was more flukey than a superior defensive effort. Punt blocks, UNFORCED interceptions (forced is defined by the QB being under pressure - there was none outside of Cunningham on 1 play). Pass rush continues to be a major problem and the source of that problem is Mike Wright..

The idea that a team can force 7 turnovers on 10 drives, and not put any pressure on a QB is absurd.

 

[emoney_33]

If it was not for the 2 interceptions by Ninko we would all be doom and gloom today

Why? You assume that without those 2 INTs the Dolphins were guaranteed TDs? Why does Ninkovinch intercepting a pass suddenly turn into a single individual play, rather than the defensive turnover that it is? It's not as if Ninkovinch decided "hey I'm bored, I'll go intercept a pass now".

 

[rojo8401]

Oh. Was I making sense? That's never happened before. Maybe I better have my meds adjusted.

I love the guy who wrote that if it wasn't for the 2 INTs by Ninovich the defense would have sucked. Uh, yeah, but they were two pretty tough catches in traffic by a linebacker who was supposed to be just a special teamer and they did basically stop two drives by the other team. What is a good defense supposed to do? Burn the opposing offense at the stake?

One tough catch, the first was thrown right to him.

 

[Off The Grid]

* Why are people talking about how many points the Dolphins would have scored if it were not for Henne's INT's?

* "Other than that, how was the play Mrs Lincoln?"

* Who do you think forced those INT's? The defense.

* That is part of the game and the mark of an opportunistic defense.

* Ask the Saints from last year how a defense that makes big plays does.

* Who give's a rats ass about yards?

* All that matters is the points on the board and last time I checked 14 points allowed is pretty good in this league.

EXACTLY.

Call me crazy, but I think that going on the ROAD, to our WORST venue of ALL...and winning by 27...is a sign of a pretty good ball team!!

 

[emoney_33]

One tough catch, the first was thrown right to him.

An imperfect throw/read is a "lucky gift" that the defense should get 0 credit for. A perfect throw/read is the result of a worthless defense who can't stop anyone.

Do I have it right yet?

 

[rojo8401]

The idea that a team can force 7 turnovers on 10 drives, and not put any pressure on a QB is absurd.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion. I didn't see any pressure on henne and chocked it up to him making a couple of ill-advised throws and some miscommunication with Marshall.

if you can point out some plays where we pressured him into making bad throws i will looki for them when I rewatch the game tonight though. Right now i remember Cunningham prssuring him once or twice and the Ninkovich sack and thats pretty much it.

 

[Synovia]

One tough catch, the first was thrown right to him.

So?

You do realize that a lot of coverages are set up so that the QB doesn't see a defender until the last second right? IE, hes tracking a WR left to right, and the defender comes from the Right, and is never in his field of view until the ball is thrown?

Thats why a lot of picks in Zone look like they're thrown right at defenders. The QB just never sees the guy.

 

[Joker]

EXACTLY.

Call me crazy, but I think that going on the ROAD, to our WORST venue of ALL...and winning by 27...is a sign of a pretty good ball team!!

Off The Gris is obviously off his meds again....

EVERYBODY knows this was a terrible 27 point road win...Brady saucked...Moss saucked....the D saucked....all the INT's were blind freakin' luck....the Phins O line buried and obliterated our D and those blocks on the FG and punt were just "blind squirrel finds acorn" dumb luck.

 

[goheels22002]

No. Quite obviously not any kind of breakout performance by any objective football fan's estimation.

I'll go ahead and say that in my opinion, the Dolphins and Henne moved the ball at will during the first half and that there was very little pressure on Henne. The picks he threw were pretty much very poor decision making on his part (though the 2 int was a very athletic play by Ninkovich and the last a miscommunication). Anyone watching the game who claims they were confident in our defense is a pretty optimistic cat.

I would opine that this game was more flukey than a superior defensive effort. Punt blocks, UNFORCED interceptions (forced is defined by the QB being under pressure - there was none outside of Cunningham on 1 play). Pass rush continues to be a major problem and the source of that problem is Mike Wright.

I am happy with the win but I am not going to magically stop worrying about the defense because Henne had a bad night and their special teams had multiple breakdowns ( a punt should never be blocked in professional football).

McCourty looked good (minus the terrible PI call) and Mayo looks like he has regained a bit of his play but other than that, a pretty soft performance by our d.

I'm going to reserve my praise for Ninkovich until he performs at a consistent level and learns how to tackle.

Your arrogance is only exceeded by your ignorance. Nobody anywhere ion this board gives a flip about whether you do anything "magically" or not nor do we care if you reserve or bestiow your praise on anybody or anything.

We do care that you sniff at 4 interceptions (one for a TD) a blocked punt for a TD and a blocked Field goal. Mayo had 15 tackles last night

 

[Off The Grid]

Off The Gris is obviously off his meds again....

EVERYBODY knows this was a terrible 27 point road win...Brady saucked...Moss saucked....the D saucked....all the INT's were blind freakin' luck....the Phins O line buried and obliterated our D and those blocks on the FG and punt were just "blind squirrel finds acorn" dumb luck.

Damned straight.

The Fish didn't lose, last night.

They just ran out'f time. :singing:

 

[QuinielaBox]

And then it would have been 17-13 in 10 seconds to start the second half. And sorry you're not going to convince me Fish play calling on their next drive would have been that different vs being down 6, and we still get punt block and are up 20-17 and game pretty much unfolds similarly with panicky Fish offense.

I'm sorry, nothing personal more to all the doom and gloomers, but if I had such a hard time enjoying a 41-14 victory vs a division rival at home in prime time, I would reevaluate even bothering following sports.

Worry about the warts later and just enjoy a blowout road win.

I agree, tom, we better enjoy these blowout road wins while we can get them because the rest of this schedule looks really rough at least until Turkey Day. Belichick will map out his program for the rest of the season particularly on the defensive side of the ball. What I am hoping for is the no-name running back corps to keep doing their jobs running up the gut and keeping the Next-Gen defense off the field as much as possible. Plus win the Turnover Ratio and get a big play or two out of our special teams. Long term, we need help with our DL because we traded out Seymour for Oakland's #1 and Ty Warren is out for the year and Julius Peppers is in Chicago instead of here. Otherwise, our undersized but athletic secondary will get exposed by the "Power Forward" WR and TE that crop up from week to week. LB are good but young so Professor Belichick will raise 'em to be proper football playas.

 

[Kontradiction]

If the D can consistently create turnovers, I don't care how many yards they give up. Consistently, of course, being the key word; they haven't shown that they can do anything consistently yet. This is a pretty fantastic start, though.

I agree. Last night, we saw what the ceiling would look like for this defense. They're not going to shut anybody down, but the made timely interceptions and pounced on turnovers giving our offense second chances. Of course, I don't think that they solved all of their issues in one night. As other posters have said, this is going to be a roller coaster season for this defense. Ups and downs throughout. However, quarterbacks (and this includes Henne last night) are still going to be able to exploit the holes in our zones with some regularity. I saw it last night (nice to be able to get the all 22 view for once) and I've seen it throughout the season. The Dolphins had no trouble gaining yardage and first downs. They had no issues driving down the field on us. However, the defense did what I hope it can do with consistency by the time the season ends: create and take advantage of turnovers. If they can do that consistently, we should be good to go.

 

[emoney_33]

You're certainly entitled to your opinion. I didn't see any pressure on henne and chocked it up to him making a couple of ill-advised throws and some miscommunication with Marshall.

if you can point out some plays where we pressured him into making bad throws i will looki for them when I rewatch the game tonight though. Right now i remember Cunningham prssuring him once or twice and the Ninkovich sack and thats pretty much it.

It's not really an opinion, you are just flat out WRONG. Heck he was pressured on the Bess TD and threw off his back foot.

It's not only pressure that makes for good defense either. The 1st INT was a good play by the defense, just because the camera shows the ball going directly to Ninkovinch doesn't mean he was there when Henne made the read/decision.

Not to mention a perfect read/throw simply CANNOT be intercepted, and therefore every single INT must have some imperfect decision/throw. The problem is that people lack perspective. Good defenses allow yards, period. If you are expecting to see flat out dominance every single drive, go watch another league or another era.

 

[Off The Grid]

Mayo had 15 tackles last night.

That means they must've been rolling all OVER our D Line!!

Hey! This I'm Bitter Because I Predicted the Patriots Would Lose So I'm Gonna Whine and Wail About It stuff is FUN!!

 

[Joker]

That means they must've been rolling all OVER our D Line!!

Hey! This I'm Bitter Because I Predicted the Patriots Would Lose So I'm Gonna Whine and Wail About It stuff is FUN!!

aha!!! you see???? it's great to be an "objective Pats fan" rather than a poor dumb blind homer who actually enjoys a tough, unexpected win....get in line and get your chicken cap, buddy and WELCOME ABOARD!!!

 

[JackBauer]

The funny thing is the same people who are acting unimpressed with the D were generally predicting that it'd give up 30+ points. If the D gives up less than half of what you expect, of course you should be impressed.

Sometimes, I just don't know what people expect from this team. Give the Dolphins some credit, people. They're a good team and we played them in their house, where we have a history of sucking some serious wind. Furthermore, after being plagued by second half road woes all of last year, we were able to go into the locker room at halftime down 7-6 and end up winning 41-14. Miami's two biggest threats on offense were effectively neutralized (R. Brown: 11 carries, 27 years, 2.5 YPC; B. Marshall: 5 rec., 50 yards). People keep pointing to the fact that they gave up 400 total yards; I say, so what? They played a good portion of the second half to protect a lead, which means giving the Dolphins the underneath stuff while taking away the big plays.

In case people have already forgotten, the Dolphins put up 436 yards of offense against the vaunted Jets defense last week. So let's try and keep things in perspective a bit, shall we? This defense, while it still has a ways to go, is clearly improving. If people can't look at this game as anything other than a marked step forward forward for the team, there are 31 other teams in the league that might better suit your fancy.

 

[JackBauer]

really? first of all you are wrong. Second of all, even if I conceded you were right, you are still wrong. Below are the YPP and YPR for both teams. Guess which numbers correspond to the Dophins and which correspond to the Pats.

Hint: You are wrong so you can assume the answer to the question sheds light on this fact.

Yards per pass
6.1 6.8

Yards per rush
3.7 4.8

I wonder if Brady's 5 rushes for 6 yards might skew the running numbers a bit?