PATRIOTS TRAINING CAMP Training Camp Day 11 - August 5

[DaBruinz]

Why would we move Peppers? He's a heart and soul guy, leader and tone setter. Better than Dugger the last 2 years and cheaper.

As for WHY? Well, they have 2 OTHER guys in Mapu and Woodson who need to get playing time.

Peppers is a guy who has, very recently, had issues with league discipline as well.

No. Peppers hasn't been better than Dugger the passed 2 years. Peppers was suspended for numerous games last year while Dugger played injured (ankle).

 

[Real fan 02]

I think he's solid, but zero upside. A good benchmark for a 3rd WR in the NFL is 500-600 yards and Bourne has failed to reach that mark in 6 of 8 NFL seasons, and the last time he did it was 4 years ago. It's not about a new shiny toy, it's about rostering the best guys, and hopefully with some upside. The bottom line is Bourne is not that good, and his best season was average, and was 4 years ago.

As much as I like Bourne as he's been a consumate professional on/off the field. He has seemed to assert himself very well outside of football with his fashion and business ventures.. I believe his time is probably up here.. as I mentioned pre-camp.. and it's been coming to fruition.. Diggs, Pop & Boutte seem like the 3 top pass catchers at WR.. Hollins is role specific, Williams as well has been worked in. Baker feels like the 6th guy.. should we trade Bourne to somewhere of his choice??

 

[DaBruinz]

JaMycal Hasty. Surely they can do better.

Who else is out there?

They tried Trayveon Williams and he couldn't hack it.

 

[DaBruinz]

Me too. When he's on the field, he plays consistently well wherever he is lined up. I get that Patsfans posters want something new, bright and shiny, but I'd hope that the Pats coaches were aware how solid he is.

It's not just that he plays consistently. The energy of the team on the field is just different. Better. Nate Ebner was the same way for Team USA 7 on 7 Rugby. They sat him the 1st half of the 1st game and the team was lethargic and getting it's rear end kicked. They put HIM on the field, and it was like a switch was flipped. He ended up started every game after..But they'd lost the 1st game, so it put them behind and they just couldn't make up the difference.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

As for WHY? Well, they have 2 OTHER guys in Mapu and Woodson who need to get playing time.

Peppers is a guy who has, very recently, had issues with league discipline as well.

No. Peppers hasn't been better than Dugger the passed 2 years. Peppers was suspended for numerous games last year while Dugger played injured (ankle).

I know about the injury. Peppers has been better the last 2 years, and it's not particularly close. Peppers was cleared of any wrong doing and was never suspended.

 

[Real fan 02]

As for WHY? Well, they have 2 OTHER guys in Mapu and Woodson who need to get playing time.

Peppers is a guy who has, very recently, had issues with league discipline as well.

No. Peppers hasn't been better than Dugger the passed 2 years. Peppers was suspended for numerous games last year while Dugger played injured (ankle).

While I agree on Woodson..Mapu is MIA all camp. Woodson is a rookie, and will be worked in.. so regardless of how you may feel about peppers he's talented and has had a great camp, and reasserted his leadership.. as Bedard and Perry mentioned Dugger may be cut/traded.. he's been getting 2nd team reps.. is petus? Hawkins? Guys who can be relied upon? When peppers went down last season the secondary was giving up plays left and right last season. Peppers has a role here. You need veteran guys in the secondary at S.. to help the young guys while they acclimate to the NFL. If Dugger does get moved you can rest assured peppers will be here.. Vrabel's not going into the season with a rookie and unproven guys starting at S.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

12. Jabrill Peppers, New England Patriots​

Peppers missed significant time in 2024 while on the commissioner's exempt list due to off-field issues, but his 82.3 PFF overall grade still ranked sixth. Over the past three seasons, he has earned a 90.1 PFF overall grade, which ranks third among 96 qualifying safeties.


Dugger isn't even on the list of the top 32.

So yes, Peppers has been better the last 2 years, and by a pretty wide margin.

 

[Real fan 02]

I know about the injury. Peppers has been better the last 2 years, and it's not particularly close. Peppers was cleared of any wrong doing and was never suspended.

 

[PWRxWLF]

12. Jabrill Peppers, New England Patriots​

Peppers missed significant time in 2024 while on the commissioner's exempt list due to off-field issues, but his 82.3 PFF overall grade still ranked sixth. Over the past three seasons, he has earned a 90.1 PFF overall grade, which ranks third among 96 qualifying safeties.


Dugger isn't even on the list of the top 32.

So yes, Peppers has been better the last 2 years, and by a pretty wide margin.

PFF is crap incoming in 3….2……1

 

[Real fan 02]

PFF is crap incoming in 3….2……1

 

[Pape]

He lost 4 out of his 6 openers with pretty good teams.

2023: Lost opener to Saints 16-15, started 1-2
2022: Lost opener to Giants 21-20, started 0-2/1-2
2021: Lost opener to Cardinals 38-13, started 2-1/2-2
2020: Won opener over Broncos 16-14, started 5-0
2019: Won opener over Browns 43-13, started 1-2
2018: Lost opener to Dolphins 27-20, started 2-1

Bedard's just speaking how Vrabel's teams do "out of the gate," and is wondering if a soft training camp has something to do with that. Bedard even says Vrabel must intentionally have a reason for a light camp.

He's not questioning the end product or if Vrabel is a good coach.

Since 1991 every good head coach we've had lost their first game as HC

**** McPherson - won vs clots
Big Bill - lost to Barfalo
Pete Carroll - won vs The Los Angeles Chargers of San Diego
Little Bill - lost to Tampon Bay
Jerod Mayo - won vs ₵incy

 

[Uptown]

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

PFF is crap incoming in 3….2……1

I'm personally not a big PFF guy, don't subscribe. Was just going off what I have seen with my own eyes since Peppers got here, and he's been the far better safety. Wasn't surprised to see the PFF rankings line-up with what I saw.

 

[Uptown]

Indeed…

 

[Uptown]

 

[Steve102]

You must not read him because he's been pretty positive about Vrabel and the team.

The take he made was valid, though I agree he's an arrogant prick.

I’m not gonna read a guy with a douchey “I hope he knows what he’s doing” take when he’s hoping to get me to click.

 

[Uptown]

 

[DaBruinz]

I think he's solid, but zero upside. A good benchmark for a 3rd WR in the NFL is 500-600 yards and Bourne has failed to reach that mark in 6 of 8 NFL seasons, and the last time he did it was 4 years ago. It's not about a new shiny toy, it's about rostering the best guys, and hopefully with some upside. The bottom line is Bourne is not that good, and his best season was average, and was 4 years ago.

How about some perspective.

2 years ago, Bourne was treated like s**t by Fat Matt because Bourne had actually played in a Shanahan Outside Zone system and told Fatt Matt that he was doing it wrong,. Patricia refused to listen and doghoused Bourne. Despite being Doghoused, Bourne was still on his way to 800 yards before he tore his ACL.

Last year, he was coming back from the torn ACL and had to put up with the crappy coaching.


2017 - QB Merry-go-round with Garoppolo, Berthard, Hoyer. Rookie Year. 5th WR in terms of targets.
2018 - Bourne led ALL 49ers WRs in Yardage, Targets and receptions despite not being the #1 WR.
2019 - 3rd behind Deebo Samuel and Emmanuel Sanders
2020 - #2 behind Aiyuk in Receptions.
2022 - Mac Jones Rookie Year.

BTW, the 49ers have their really awesome TE by the name of George Kittle. He's been a top receiver for them and led them in target numerous times. Like in 2018 & 2019.

Bourne has the ability to be a solid #2/#3 receiver. No one is saying he's going to put up 1600 yards. But when you watch the offense when he's on the field, it takes on another level. Even last year when they weren't playing him much.

 

[Family]

Per the contract between the NFL and the NFLPA aren’t all training camps on the soft side? I know there is a limit on how many padded practices teams can have. When camp is over we should see if Vrabel maxed out the number of padded practices.

He covered that, and they can do much more than they're doing.

 

[Pape]