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Story on Patriots' documentary brings recent dysfunction to light


Sure. I mean there are always circumstances but he is the GOAT HC with Brady, and sub .500 without him. The juxtaposition is hard to ignore.
It would be hard to ignore if he hadn't otherwise doubled everyone else not named Noll. And it would be hard to ignore if most other coaches ultimate success wasn't also tied to one QB too.
 
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It would be hard to ignore if he hadn't otherwise doubled everyone else not named Noll. And it would be hard to ignore if most other coaches ultimate success wasn't also tied to one QB too.
It be interesting what Reid does these next couple of years. If he gets 2 more chips one could argue he's the GOAT he got to a Superbowl and multiple championship games without Kermit...as of now BB is the GOAT
 
No

Your new GM * Kraft should have let BB run the team instead of interfering. It was the beginning of the end. As time passes, the tenets that BB instilled in this team will fade away.
Oh no I was hoping we would keep stockpiling receivers who can't play, drafting bust after bust, hiring only friends on the coaching staff, and maybe even another few years of mismanaging the quarterback and offensive line. It will be a sad day when those things are just memories of the past.
 
It be interesting what Reid does these next couple of years. If he gets 2 more chips one could argue he's the GOAT he got to a Superbowl and multiple championship games without Kermit...as of now BB is the GOAT
No doubt Reid has a pretty good chance to catch him. Because of his run in Philly his case is very strong. If he gets a little closer to 6 then we can start talking about winning with different teams and QBs but then Bill still has the SB39 win. If Reid can get to 5 and pass Noll then I think the debate can start. Until then I think Lombardi, Shula, and a few other pre SB era guys are the only cases that can be made for GOAT other than Bill.
 
Look no further than who is Andy Reid chasing? Bill is unquestionably considered the GOAT right now. No one is saying Reid is chasing Lombardi. He just tied Bill Walsh and Joe Gibbs in SB wins not a single mention. Chuck Noll is next with 4 no mention. Why because Bill is basically considered the GOAT everywhere except here.
.... you know what I mean
 
.... you know what I mean
I know what your saying but I just don't think it's true the same people that dump on Bill and act like this impacts his GOAT status are the same people that talk about Reid catching him if they were genuine then Reid would already be the Goat or he'd be chasing someone else other than Bill.
 
I know what your saying but I just don't think it's true the same people that dump on Bill and act like this impacts his GOAT status are the same people that talk about Reid catching him if they were genuine then Reid would already be the Goat or he'd be chasing someone else other than Bill.
Bill's the GOAT unless Reid gets to 6SBs.
 


I think the title is 100% click bait, there's maybe 10 second spent discussing Butler, but it's easily the best thing EEI's put out in a while. 30 minutes well spent listening to Benedict.

Thanks for that, good find. Similar to what the Director (Matt) says on the docuseries. As I understand Matt, this is a story about the arch of the relationship between Belichick and Brady (and Kraft) from the beginning (when Tom arrived) to the end of the dynasty (when Tom left). They focus on key moments in that relationship, with all the other intervieews (players, executives, etc.) filling in for context. I'm looking forward to the rest.
 
BB is one of the coaching greats. You can make arguments for and against that he’s the greatest but he belongs on that top tier. I’m a Pats fan so I’ll call him the greatest just because.

His record sans Brady blows and that’s notable on his legacy but his work with Brady counts too and the GOAT has acknowledged what his HC meant to his success. Have a hard time envisioning a scenario where he is not a first ballot HOFer.
I think there's a real possibility that guys like Borges will do there damnedest to make him wait. Between Bill's surly manner the media and the 'gates, he's got his detractors. I fully think the guy should be in, first ballot, no question, but it won't be a forgone conclusion. No unanimous decision on Bill. Tom's will be. That'll be a 1 minute discussion.
Thanks for that, good find. Similar to what the Director (Matt) says on the docuseries. As I understand Matt, this is a story about the arch of the relationship between Belichick and Brady (and Kraft) from the beginning (when Tom arrived) to the end of the dynasty (when Tom left). They focus on key moments in that relationship, with all the other intervieews (players, executives, etc.) filling in for context. I'm looking forward to the rest.
Wasn't really a find. It was in my youtube feed. I was riveted for the 30 minutes, it was good. I will be listening to Tom Curran's podcast tonight while painting the basement, I will let you know what he and Phil have to say if there's anything good. I am probably 3 weeks away from getting it just because I don't want another subscription.
 
So Kraft got 70 people to get in front of a camera and say exactly what he wanted them to say? Come on man. Watch it then comment.

Not what I said don't put words in my mouth. Bill wouldn't have participated in this without Kraft's nudging. This is Kraft's baby, he was deeply involved with the production. How much did this bias the result? Intelligent people can judge that for themselves.
 
I think there's a real possibility that guys like Borges will do there damnedest to make him wait. Between Bill's surly manner the media and the 'gates, he's got his detractors. I fully think the guy should be in, first ballot, no question, but it won't be a forgone conclusion. No unanimous decision on Bill. Tom's will be. That'll be a 1 minute discussion.

Wasn't really a find. It was in my youtube feed. I was riveted for the 30 minutes, it was good. I will be listening to Tom Curran's podcast tonight while painting the basement, I will let you know what he and Phil have to say if there's anything good. I am probably 3 weeks away from getting it just because I don't want another subscription.
The youtube link I posted is of Curran and Phil talking with Matt, the director of the Dynasty. Did you watch it?
 
Not what I said don't put words in my mouth. Bill wouldn't have participated in this without Kraft's nudging. This is Kraft's baby, he was deeply involved with the production. How much did this bias the result? Intelligent people can judge that for themselves.
According to the writer and director, Kraft had no say in what was produced or edited. Nobody forced Bill to the interview. It took them two years to make this, patiently waiting for people to accept (Vinatieri, Moss, etc.). The 1st two episodes didn't paint Kraft in a positive light w/ his backing of Bledsoe (w/o interfering w/ Bill). Other episodes won't make him look great either. Nobody is going to come off as a saint in this docuseries, just like men, with all their faults. We'll see film that's never before seen. Should be good.
 
The youtube link I posted is of Curran and Phil talking with Matt, the director of the Dynasty. Did you watch it?
No I didn't realize that's what it was. I will listen to it tonight. working now.
 
According to the writer and director, Kraft had no say in what was produced or edited. Nobody forced Bill to the interview. It took them two years to make this, patiently waiting for people to accept (Vinatieri, Moss, etc.). The 1st two episodes didn't paint Kraft in a positive light w/ his backing of Bledsoe (w/o interfering w/ Bill). Other episodes won't make him look great either. Nobody is going to come off as a saint in this docuseries, just like men, with all their faults. We'll see film that's never before seen. Should be good.

Note I'm not crapping on it. I think it's going to be great this is an extremely talented production team. I just know Kraft was very involved is all I'm saying (though not saying he was in the cutting room or whatever). Sorry I was touchy. :)

I don't want to say a lot because reasons. Everyone should watch it. I can pretty much guarantee it will be amazing.
 
According to the writer and director, Kraft had no say in what was produced or edited. Nobody forced Bill to the interview. It took them two years to make this, patiently waiting for people to accept (Vinatieri, Moss, etc.). The 1st two episodes didn't paint Kraft in a positive light w/ his backing of Bledsoe (w/o interfering w/ Bill). Other episodes won't make him look great either. Nobody is going to come off as a saint in this docuseries, just like men, with all their faults. We'll see film that's never before seen. Should be good.
Yeah, I expect there's going to be a lot of stripping of the heroes veneer on this. I would think that Bill is going to look bad, only because of when the interviews took place, the house of cards was falling. My guess is Brady is going to look good, only because he's Brady. I am really excited to see the other players, especially from the 1st three, only because it's going to be less drama filled. The second three, they are all older and more jaded, and had been thru some battles at that point. They were all, essentially, young and innocent 2001-04. (no one was young, no one was innocent, you know what I mean) By the time 4-5-6 roll around, they had been thru 2007, 2011, the 'gates, Tom's suspension and the Butler fiasco. They had been battle hardened by the end, especially RKK, Bill and Tom. We saw a little of that in The Man In The Arena, how Tom had changed. They all were much less wide eyed by the end. It'll be interesting to see how it changes.
 
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1. Mac never had it, never will. BB was absolutely right to want a later round QB instead, and you could see it when they drafted him. They didn't pounce on the guy, BB even asked if they were really all agreed to go with Mac in the final analysis. Clearly there were other opinions.

2. He was referring to BB's won loss record. Not Super Bowls won without Brady. What don't you understand about this?

3. Your argument about Bledsoe makes no sense. Who cares what Bledsoe did? The point is they won the game without Brady contributing.
I don't get this, supposedly BB had final say, if he wanted a later round QB couldn't he have just said no about Mac and draft the guy he wanted?
 
It would be hard to ignore if he hadn't otherwise doubled everyone else not named Noll. And it would be hard to ignore if most other coaches ultimate success wasn't also tied to one QB too.
Are you saying a great coach needs a great QB to win in the NFL? Of course, I know the answer but we as Pats fans scrutinize every detail about BB and not so much on other great coaches.
 
I think there's a real possibility that guys like Borges will do there damnedest to make him wait. Between Bill's surly manner the media and the 'gates, he's got his detractors. I fully think the guy should be in, first ballot, no question, but it won't be a forgone conclusion. No unanimous decision on Bill. Tom's will be. That'll be a 1 minute discussion.

Wasn't really a find. It was in my youtube feed. I was riveted for the 30 minutes, it was good. I will be listening to Tom Curran's podcast tonight while painting the basement, I will let you know what he and Phil have to say if there's anything good. I am probably 3 weeks away from getting it just because I don't want another subscription.
I bet that idiot in Indy doesn't vote for either one if he has a vote. Forget his name but he always picked Indy over the Pats when it was obvious they couldn't beat us.
 
I bet that idiot in Indy doesn't vote for either one if he has a vote. Forget his name but he always picked Indy over the Pats when it was obvious they couldn't beat us.
Bob Kravitz?
 


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