Story on Patriots' documentary brings recent dysfunction to light

[signbabybrady]

He is 100% going to be a first ballot hall of famer....but he has taken himself out of running for GOAT coach thanks to past 4 years.
If he had retired after Brady left he would go down as the GOAT...but he sabotaged himself and his shelf life expired.

Did you see the way they treated him a few months ago on the set of college GameDay. That's how people really see him don't let the jackals around here fool you.

 

[venecol]

Lol, Bill try to tell the GOAT how to QB.

 

[venecol]

Did you see the way they treated him a few months ago on the set of college GameDay. That's how people really see him don't let the jackals around here fool you.

Nick Saban actually got a job with college GameDay.

 

[NormZauchin]

He is 100% going to be a first ballot hall of famer....but he has taken himself out of running for GOAT coach thanks to past 4 years.
If he had retired after Brady left he would go down as the GOAT...but he sabotaged himself and his shelf life expired.

If he had retired after Mac's first year and making the playoffs, his image would not have suffered. The last two years were what hurt.

 

[SVN]

 

[SVN]

 

[Triumph]

I have my my own issues with kraft, but is there any credible evidence of this?
I hear those over and over, but never any evidence other then " I'm sure he wasn't" or " he probably wasn't"
I've never seen any reports of anyone inside Gillette saying that Mac was Kraft's pic or that he told Bill to pic Mac .

Like asking seriously, did I miss it?

Reports are that BB did not have the final say on drafting Corky. Furthermore, BB wanted to get rid of Corky, but was over ruled by Kraft.

 

[Triumph]

He's not getting in to the HOF on 1st ballot either. Bill's arrogant ways screwed Bill.

Yes, BB is a first ballot HOFer.

If a HC/DC with 8 Super Bowl rings cant get in Canton first shot then who can?

 

[Triumph]

Team Bill is making **** up in a desperate last ditch effort to whitewash the disaster of his last 4 seasons. Just watch the Youtube video of the Pats war room on the Mac pick. That'll answer your question. The rest is BS.

 

[Triumph]

Kraft has proven time and time again that he makes bad football decisions.

Like giving Bledsoe that 100 million dollar contract. BB had it right all along to stick with Brady because BB knew that Bledsoe was erratic.

I believe that Kraft is going to be very involved with the inner workings of the Pats moving forward because Mayo has no experience.

 

[neuronet]

It sounds like it's gonna be a hit piece. Bill made a lot of enemies in the media. I am not surprised it's going to make him look bad. Lots of people waited to piss on him, so here it comes.

Let’s wait and see.

 

[Steve102]

I think it's real easy to sit here and say we could have or should have won more and just point to examples like Butler. And there are certainly ways where that could have been true but if he was the kind of person that would compromise for those moments than what other moments change and what kind of Butterfly effect might that have made.

Valid points.

 

[0818NePa]

I have no idea what you mean about 2018 and Deebo or AJ Brown. That makes no sense.

It is well documented the scouting dep was high on both and BB passed. We where discussing ipotheticals. Imagine TB throwing to this 2 guys (it was 2019 draft, of course)

Doesn't matter what happened the prior year.

And if we are in 2017 it does not matter what actually happened in 2018 since, you know, it has not happened yet....

In any case fom me would have worked to fire BB after 2018 (instead of 217) and trade Gilmore for a 1st. That is what old school BB would have done. That was the window to move on, that 2 years.

 

[venecol]

Let’s wait and see.

First two episodes were good. Nothing really new. Not a hit piece at all. It's well made.

 

[archstanton543]

Holy ****, Andy's in the documentary.

Destro?

 

[catent]

i think this show is going to kill his chances of getting a job again

Unless BB can learn from it, take 8-10 months to reflect on the past 2+ decades, what went well, what didn’t, etc, come into interviews with a better perspective having had time away from things, and articulate to owner(s) how he will evolve/adapt in how he treats and interacts with players.

The thing is, though, I don’t think BB was an ******* all the time, or even in general. I think he was uncompromising and unbending when it came to how he coached the team and enforced discipline.

The sticking point for TB12 wasn’t that BB was too mean; it’s that he didn’t acknowledge TB12 as a peer. I think TB12 had earned that right and likely felt he should be treated less like every other guy, and more as a peer to BB, with greater respect given to him, with an acknowledgment/appreciation of/for his career, football acumen, accumulated on-field experience, and the contributions he made to the team’s success during their time together in New England.

That’s why I think that folks are getting ahead of their skis, here. A handful of quotes are telling us BB was extremely hard to play for (shocking, right?), and us, being prisoners of the moment, are allowing this to color the entire narrative.

Is BB a **** at times (press conferences, coaching points, on/off-field discipline)? Absolutely.
Does he feel strongly about his style of / approach to coaching? No doubt.
Is he a raging, antisocial ******* worthy of derision? No.

 

[Steve102]

Unless BB can learn from it, take 8-10 months to reflect on the past 2+ decades, what went well, what didn’t, etc, come into interviews with a better perspective having had time away from things, and articulate to owner(s) how he will evolve/adapt in how he treats and interacts with players.

The thing is, though, I don’t think BB was an ******* all the time, or even generally. I think he was uncompromising and unbending when it came to how he coached the team and enforced discipline. The sticking point for TB12 wasn’t that BB was too mean generally; it’s that he didn’t acknowledge TB12 as a peer. I think TB12 had earned that right and likely felt he should be treated less like every other guy, and more as a peer/coach, with greater respect given to him, with an acknowledgment/appreciation for his career, football acumen, and accumulated on-field experience.

That’s why I think that folks are getting ahead of their skis, here. A handful of quotes are being taken without context (at the moment) telling us BB was extremely hard to play for (shocking, right?), and us, being prisoners of the moment, are allowing this to color the entire narrative. Is BB a **** at times (press conferences, coaching points, on/off-field discipline)? Absolutely. Does he feel strongly about his style of / approach to coaching? No doubt. Is he a raging, antisocial ******* worthy of derision? No.

That was my take on it at the end. Tom had more in common with Bill than anyone else on the roster, and wanted, maybe even earned, to be treated more like a peer. Bill couldn't do it. Player's play, coaches coach.

 

[Tunescribe]

Unless BB can learn from it, take 8-10 months to reflect on the past 2+ decades, what went well, what didn’t, etc, come into interviews with a better perspective having had time away from things, and articulate to owner(s) how he will evolve/adapt in how he treats and interacts with players.

The thing is, though, I don’t think BB was an ******* all the time, or even generally. I think he was uncompromising and unbending when it came to how he coached the team and enforced discipline. The sticking point for TB12 wasn’t that BB was too mean generally; it’s that he didn’t acknowledge TB12 as a peer. I think TB12 had earned that right and likely felt he should be treated less like every other guy, and more as a peer/coach, with greater respect given to him, with an acknowledgment/appreciation for his career, football acumen, and accumulated on-field experience.

That’s why I think that folks are getting ahead of their skis, here. A handful of quotes are being taken without context (at the moment) telling us BB was extremely hard to play for (shocking, right?), and us, being prisoners of the moment, are allowing this to color the entire narrative.

Is BB a **** at times (press conferences, coaching points, on/off-field discipline)? Absolutely.
Does he feel strongly about his style of / approach to coaching? No doubt.
Is he a raging, antisocial ******* worthy of derision? No.

That was my take on it at the end. Tom had more in common with Bill than anyone else on the roster, and wanted, maybe even earned, to be treated more like a peer. Bill couldn't do it. Player's play, coaches coach.

Good posts, guys. I haven't watched this yet but am looking forward to it.

 

[venecol]

That was my take on it at the end. Tom had more in common with Bill than anyone else on the roster, and wanted, maybe even earned, to be treated more like a peer. Bill couldn't do it. Player's play, coaches coach.

One of my favorite stories, told by Belichick himself, was about Bill going to Parcells and snitching on LT being late to a mtg. & asking BP what he wanted to do about it. Parcells says, why did you start the mtg w/o LT.

You can be disciplined, even a hard coach, but that doesn't mean you aren't able to see the bigger picture. Not every player on a team needs to be treated the same to get a point across. Players know this. That's just micro-management nonsense. The idea the dynasty could have only achieved what it did BECAUSE OF the way Bill coached the team, is utter nonsense. It's obvious so much more could've been achieved had he toned down his arrogance.

 

[Steve102]

One of my favorite stories, told by Belichick himself, was about Bill going to Parcells and snitching on LT being late to a mtg. & asking BP what he wanted to do about it. Parcells says, why did you start the mtg w/o LT.

You can be disciplined, even a hard coach, but that doesn't mean you aren't able to see the bigger picture. Not every player on a team needs to be treated the same to get a point across. Players know this. That's just micro-management nonsense. The idea the dynasty could have only achieved what it did BECAUSE OF the way Bill coached the team, is utter nonsense. It's obvious so much more could've been achieved had he toned down his arrogance.

Sorry my man, I don't think it's obvious, which is why I started the What If thread. It's easy to cherry pick, as I did, with the Butler situation and the Welker situation and say there's those opportunities that he screwed it up. But do they even get to the first three if he's not who he is and coaches how he coaches? Who knows, right?

To your point, yeah, he could have played it differently, as Parcells suggests., except he simply can't do it. I don't think it's in his DNA to be able to alter his approach. He's like a robot. Like a terminator. He can't be bargained with. He can't be reasoned with. He doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear! And he absolutely will not stop, ever.