Roster Thoughts

[mgteich]

1) Is Langi on the 53? I think that he is.

2) Perry doesn't seem to be here for long. We will add a WR. Belichick just has to find one better than Wilkerson and Harry.

3) Is there a reason that we are waiting on signing Hoyer back to the 53? Is Belichick really going to activate him from the Practice Squad in the next four games? Could Belichick be looking to sign a backup QB and keeping Hoyer on the Practice Squad as a coach, and as an emergency #3 QB? After all, Hoyer is probably the 32nd best #2 at this point, and I suspect that assessment is generous.

4) I suspect that Belichick is dredging through the available free agent CB's and WR's, and seeing nothing that he wants. Folks here have their choices. I would think that they all have been considered and found wanting. Obviously trades are possible.

5) Is LB the roster spot that needs to be cut to re-sign Hoyer or another QB? Langi or a Winovich trade I presume.
=========
The BOTTOM LINE is that, Belichick is ready for the season (and probably the first 4 games) with what we have.

 

[Deus Irae]

Is there a reason that we are waiting on signing Hoyer back to the 53?

Per multiple reporters (I never cared enough to verify it):

Hoyer to PS, not roster
+
PS call up
=
No guarantee of full year salary

 

[mgteich]

Per multiple reporters (I never cared enough to verify it):

Hoyer to PS, not roster
+
PS call up
=
No guarantee of full year salary

Ok. Let's play.

If Hoyer is activated and on the 53 for Game One, is his full year of salary guaranteed? Is it the original cut down or some other time? Is this guy in error, certainly possible?

Vested Veteran Salary Guarantees (profootballrumors.com)

 

[patfanken]

1) Is Langi on the 53? I think that he is.

2) Perry doesn't seem to be here for long. We will add a WR. Belichick just has to find one better than Wilkerson and Harry.

3) Is there a reason that we are waiting on signing Hoyer back to the 53? Is Belichick really going to activate him from the Practice Squad in the next four games? Could Belichick be looking to sign a backup QB and keeping Hoyer on the Practice Squad as a coach, and as an emergency #3 QB? After all, Hoyer is probably the 32nd best #2 at this point, and I suspect that assessment is generous.

4) I suspect that Belichick is dredging through the available free agent CB's and WR's, and seeing nothing that he wants. Folks here have their choices. I would think that they all have been considered and found wanting. Obviously trades are possible.

5) Is LB the roster spot that needs to be cut to re-sign Hoyer or another QB? Langi or a Winovich trade I presume.
=========
The BOTTOM LINE is that, Belichick is ready for the season (and probably the first 4 games) with what we have.

Here's my problem about finding a solution to the WR depth issue from outside. Everyone talks about how hard it is to learn this offense for WR's. How can we expect someone to come from another system and pick it up without spending at least a month on the PS. They'd be hard pressed to legitimately be expect to be productive for a month if they are on the 53.

Same reason goes in spades to a potential replacement for Hoyer as the back up QB. Gilbert will be learning the system, but is mostly here to be the 3rd arm for practice. The best chance to upgrade Hoyer is probably Stidham when he comes back in October and who knows if he'll actually be an upgrade

I don't see Winovich being on the block. His pass rushing skills are real, and the need for him to set the edge has been mitigated because of all the LB's who CAN do that job. I'm thinking this secondary is a little suspect until Jones and Gilmore get back and Gilmore won't be back until mid October. So a strong pass rush will be more important than ever, and Wino may be a one trick pony, but that "trick" is an important one, especially early on this season.

 

[mgteich]

Here's my problem about finding a solution to the WR depth issue from outside. Everyone talks about how hard it is to learn this offense for WR's. How can we expect someone to come from another system and pick it up without spending at least a month on the PS. They'd be hard pressed to legitimately be expect to be productive for a month if they are on the 53.

Same reason goes in spades to a potential replacement for Hoyer as the back up QB. Gilbert will be learning the system, but is mostly here to be the 3rd arm for practice. The best chance to upgrade Hoyer is probably Stidham when he comes back in October and who knows if he'll actually be an upgrade

I don't see Winovich being on the block. His pass rushing skills are real, and the need for him to set the edge has been mitigated because of all the LB's who CAN do that job. I'm thinking this secondary is a little suspect until Jones and Gilmore get back and Gilmore won't be back until mid October. So a strong pass rush will be more important than ever, and Wino may be a one trick pony, but that "trick" is an important one, especially early on this season.

So, we just need to re-sign Hoyer, cut Perry or Langi and worry about injuries when they come, and on the injured when they are able to come back? Their status doesn't matter much, since they would be inactive in any case.

I do expect that the offensive system will be somewhat different than in the past. That being said, I agree that it would take a month for a WR to become useful? Why is that an issue with an 20 week season? For me, the issue is that no one out there now is likely to be much better than Harry or Wilkerson. In a month, Belichick may decide that he wants to trade for a WR, one expected to be considerably better than Harry or Wilkerson.
In any case, if Wilkerson is close to being our #4, I would think that he should be on the 53, with another decision to come when Harry is healthy.

This all is likely to be moot. Belichick will likely find a player or two or three to add before Game Two.

 

[Triumph]

Perry plays the slot. Thats been his role.

Miami is deep at WR - Fuller, Parker, Hurns.Waddle.? Youre likely looking at the next NE slot WR. Plus Perry plays special teams.

 

[Triumph]

Why would BB sign Perry to a 3.3 mil contract just to cut him? The Pats deperatly need WRs too.

Malcolm Perry Contract Details, Salary Cap Charges, Bonus Money, and Contract History | Over The Cap

Malcolm Perry contract and salary cap details, including signing bonus, guaranteed salary, dead money, roster bonuses, and contract history

overthecap.com

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Why would BB sign Perry to a 3.3 mil contract just to cut him? The Pats deperatly need WRs too.

Malcolm Perry Contract Details, Salary Cap Charges, Bonus Money, and Contract History | Over The Cap

Malcolm Perry contract and salary cap details, including signing bonus, guaranteed salary, dead money, roster bonuses, and contract history

overthecap.com

7th round guys get cut all the time. Perry has $75k in guaranteed money with a $800k a year contract. I expect he will be cut and put on the practice squad after game 1 or 2.

 

[Scotty]

Last season teams would stack the box and dare Cam to throw in an effort to stop the Pats making progress. I have read that Agholor , being a deep threat , and Mac being a better thrower should stop this tactic. What happens if Agholor struggles or gets injured ? There is no back up deep threat. I assume by having two excellent TE's and a dependable Myers and Bourne ? this should also allow the offence to score points ?

 

[DarrylS]

Why would BB sign Perry to a 3.3 mil contract just to cut him? The Pats deperatly need WRs too.

Malcolm Perry Contract Details, Salary Cap Charges, Bonus Money, and Contract History | Over The Cap

Malcolm Perry contract and salary cap details, including signing bonus, guaranteed salary, dead money, roster bonuses, and contract history

overthecap.com

He didn't that was the Miami Contract, that 4 year contract averages $842,622 over 4 years...

 

[PScottman]

I don't see Winovich being on the block. His pass rushing skills are real, and the need for him to set the edge has been mitigated because of all the LB's who CAN do that job. I'm thinking this secondary is a little suspect until Jones and Gilmore get back and Gilmore won't be back until mid October. So a strong pass rush will be more important than ever, and Wino may be a one trick pony, but that "trick" is an important one, especially early on this season.

Moreover the best Patriots pass rushing teams have had a rotation of guys that are solid pass rushers rather than 2-3 studs. Keep em fresh and keep em coming is a good mantra plus there are likely situational advantages as well...Wino has success against this guy...Uche owns that guy...etc, etc, etc.

 

[Triumph]

7th round guys get cut all the time. Perry has $75k in guaranteed money with a $800k a year contract. I expect he will be cut and put on the practice squad after game 1 or 2.

Yeah, I get that his contract is mostly unguaranteed salary. Nevertheless, the Pats have room for WRs and this seems like Perry is being given an opportunity here. The current batch of NE WRs is uninspiring.

Where he was drafted really isnt meaningful. Raiders TE Darren Waller was a 5th. Harry is a 1st.

 

[Family]

Is there a reason that we are waiting on signing Hoyer back to the 53? Is LB the roster spot that needs to be cut to re-sign Hoyer or another QB? Langi or a Winovich trade

The rules are a little funky this year, but my interpretation is NOBODY needs to be cut to get Hoyer activated to the roster week one.

Teams are allowed to add two players from the practice squad for the game. So the actual roster can be 55 on game day.

They can add Hoyer and worry about roster subtraction after the game. Odds are someone will be three week IR worthy by then.

Bill knew what he was doing when he put this plan together.

 

[mgteich]

The rules are a little funky this year, but my interpretation is NOBODY needs to be cut to get Hoyer activated to the roster week one.

Teams are allowed to add two players from the practice squad for the game. So the actual roster can be 55 on game day.

They can add Hoyer and worry about roster subtraction after the game. Odds are someone will be three week IR worthy by then.

Bill knew what he was doing when he put this plan together.

Hoyer can be activated without counting only twice.

2021 NFL practice squad rules, deadline, eligibility - Pride Of Detroit

As an aside, at the beginning of each game week, four players PS players can be protected from poaching by another team. And, I believe that there is no limit on how many times a player can be protected.

So, for example, if Bryant and Ross make it to Monday, whoever isn't on the 53 could be protected every week.

A developmental player like Sherman could be protected for the entire year.

An emergency backup like Ferentz could be protected.

IMO, this rule expands the roster. The other rule that expands the roster is having unlimited IR to return players.

 

[BTTA]

Last season teams would stack the box and dare Cam to throw in an effort to stop the Pats making progress. I have read that Agholor , being a deep threat , and Mac being a better thrower should stop this tactic. What happens if Agholor struggles or gets injured ? There is no back up deep threat. I assume by having two excellent TE's and a dependable Myers and Bourne ? this should also allow the offence to score points ?

Yes, the team does not have starter quality backups at every position, with QB and WR being the most obvious at this point.
Any other starter goes down, and the team has a quality backup ready to step in.
Having only two is pretty good.

 

[Sciz]

As an aside, at the beginning of each game week, four players PS players can be protected from poaching by another team. And, I believe that there is no limit on how many times a player can be protected.

So, for example, if Bryant and Ross make it to Monday, whoever isn't on the 53 could be protected every week.

A developmental player like Sherman could be protected for the entire year.

An emergency backup like Ferentz could be protected.

IMO, this rule expands the roster. The other rule that expands the roster is having unlimited IR to return players.

The Patriots didn't protect anybody on the practice squad last year, and I don't anticipate that changing. There's no long term benefit, because a team that wants your developmental player just has to wait until he's unprotected each Monday and Tuesday. They didn't use it in the short term either, leaving Folk unprotected in week 1 even though he was going to be signed to the active roster to kick for them.

They're not alone, either. In week 8 (the first full list I could find), 12 teams didn't protect any players.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Unfortunately I think bb is just gonna bring hoyer back on the 53 as backup once hes done playing around with the roster. When can Harry officially be moved to IR ? Thats one of the moves that will open a spot for qb2.

Im hoping wino is kept around, doubt we’ll get enough to justify a trade

 

[Sciz]

Unfortunately I think bb is just gonna bring hoyer back on the 53 as backup once hes done playing around with the roster. When can Harry officially be moved to IR ? Thats one of the moves that will open a spot for qb2.

Im hoping wino is kept around, doubt we’ll get enough to justify a trade

They moved Harry to IR yesterday. They cut Langi to make room for the Perry claim, then used Harry's old roster spot to re-sign Langi.

 

[SlowGettingUp]

A developmental player like Sherman could be protected for the entire year.

This is a common misunderstanding. Protection just lasts from Tuesday evening through the next game. Any time in between those times the player can be claimed.

 

[p8ryts]

1) Is Langi on the 53? I think that he is.

2) Perry doesn't seem to be here for long. We will add a WR. Belichick just has to find one better than Wilkerson and Harry.

3) Is there a reason that we are waiting on signing Hoyer back to the 53? Is Belichick really going to activate him from the Practice Squad in the next four games? Could Belichick be looking to sign a backup QB and keeping Hoyer on the Practice Squad as a coach, and as an emergency #3 QB? After all, Hoyer is probably the 32nd best #2 at this point, and I suspect that assessment is generous.

4) I suspect that Belichick is dredging through the available free agent CB's and WR's, and seeing nothing that he wants. Folks here have their choices. I would think that they all have been considered and found wanting. Obviously trades are possible.

5) Is LB the roster spot that needs to be cut to re-sign Hoyer or another QB? Langi or a Winovich trade I presume.
=========
The BOTTOM LINE is that, Belichick is ready for the season (and probably the first 4 games) with what we have.

I would see Gunnar, Perry and Bolden as expendables and maybe King. I could see a Winovich trade but its hard to find a pass rusher.