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Game Day Thread PRESEASON GAME DAY THREAD (8/22): Patriots vs. Saints

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Tom E. Curran ?@tomecurran 10m10 minutes ago
McCourty on move to corner: 'I hope it's not permanent' | Comcast SportsNet - http://CSNNE.com http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/mccourty-move-corner-i-hope-its-not-permanent…


I understand and agree with his sentiment, but wouldve loved him not complain about. In emergency situations if he is asked to play , he needs to be up to it. Already showing disinterest , is not going to help putting him that situation.

I dunno. I think he has every right to be pissed off about it. You paid him as a safety so you could move him to corner. That's crap. Especially when you had him playing man all night, and he sucks in man.
 
That's the #1 reason why I don't get people reading into Amendola or Brady's performance tonight. It wasn't even a bad game. It was a few three and outs. You could maybe say they had a bad quarter.

Yeah, personally I've never seen a game where Tom Brady had a bad first half of the first quarter and was like 2/5 then totally lit it up and ended the game 28/36 with 350 yards and 4 TDs but then the Packers game last week was the first Patriots game I have ever seen.
 
After Moss in 2007 I've learned that it's basically irrelevant whether a talented player even participates in training camp, let alone posts statistics in a few preseason drives.

Yep! PS is always plan vanilla and mostly just "off" ALso, we have some issues at WR already. Our two starters are injured. We need DA more than ever.

I hope Harper can be a player for us. But who the hell knows whats going to happen top to bottom with that WR group. Lafell may stay PUP, Dobson my never be healthy again, or be a star, what is wrong with JE? Gibson looked good other night but I hear he may be hurt now. Tyms is gone.
 
After Moss in 2007 I've learned that it's basically irrelevant whether a talented player even participates in training camp, let alone posts statistics in a few preseason drives. The roster spots of Edelman (lol) and Amendola are totally safe. Hell, Dobson's seems safe at this point.
Be careful there, from what I hear from Moss, he is football smart. He saw the field just as Brady did. Most people other than Hernandez and Gronk need timing with Brady before they are sync'd.
 
I dunno. I think he has every right to be pissed off about it. You paid him as a safety so you could move him to corner. That's crap. Especially when you had him playing man all night, and he sucks in man.
I get it. but is preseason. Like they trained troy brown for emergencies. Why make a big deal about it ?
 
Yep! PS is always plan vanilla and mostly just "off" ALso, we have some issues at WR already. Our two starters are injured. We need DA more than ever.

I hope Harper can be a player for us. But who the hell knows whats going to happen top to bottom with that WR group. Lafell may stay PUP, Dobson my never be healthy again, or be a star, what is wrong with JE? Gibson looked good other night but I hear he may be hurt now. Tyms is gone.

Even Gibson is a known quantity. At least Harper has upside, I've watched a lot of Rams games over the last 5 year a send you know what you're getting with Gibson: a guy who should be a star if not for the fact he drops passes an 8 year old would have no problem holding onto.
 
Even Gibson is a known quantity. At least Harper has upside, I've watched a lot of Rams games over the last 5 year a send you know what you're getting with Gibson: a guy who should be a star if not for the fact he drops passes an 8 year old would have no problem holding onto.

I think Gibson edges Harper because he backs up LaFell pretty well, not least as a blocker. I can't speak to his blocking elsewhere but from what I've seen in PS, he's looked pretty good at it so far.
 
Be careful there, from what I hear from Moss, he is football smart. He saw the field just as Brady did. Most people other than Hernandez and Gronk need timing with Brady before they are sync'd.

OK but Moss is not the only example, just the most memorable because you had Florio hilariously claiming the Patriots hated him because he was lazy and hurt and were going to cut him right up until he annihilated the Jets on opening day and showed no signs of being injured. So basically never ever take training camp or preseason at face value.
 
I think Gibson edges Harper because he backs up LaFell pretty well, not least as a blocker. I can't speak to his blocking elsewhere but from what I've seen in PS, he's looked pretty good at it so far.

Gibson is just going to be very frustrating for us, just as he was for Rams fans.
 
I get it. but is preseason. Like they trained troy brown for emergencies. Why make a big deal about it ?

Because if they stick with it, they intentionally screwed him over with money.

Devin McCourty wasn't just going to stay here because "Loyalty, Patriots Way, Blah Blah Blah". He stayed because he got paid as a top-5 safety.

He knows how to play corner in an emergency. They put him in a position to fail, and I can understand why he wouldn't like it much.
 
Because if they stick with it, they intentionally screwed him over with money.

Devin McCourty wasn't just going to stay here because "Loyalty, Patriots Way, Blah Blah Blah". He stayed because he got paid as a top-5 safety.

He knows how to play corner in an emergency. They put him in a position to fail, and I can understand why he wouldn't like it much.
How is getting reps in pre season putting in a position to fail. ? If they make him play majority of reps in CB position during the season then I agree with him . Right now its just what it is. He knows how to play CB in emergency doesnt mean he cant practice for it.He complains after 1st season of regular season then so be it.
 
You won't get any argument from me on Brady's efficiency and this teams ability to maximise their strengths and limit their weaknesses. But why deliberately give yourself a potential weakness by giving up on a deep threat guy just to have two similar receivers in Amendola and Harper? As I said in my original comment, if Dobson can't get healthy for the start of the season then I think his position is at risk and Harper has been terrific. But if Dobson can get fit, and offer a deep threat for Brady, why hamstring yourself tactically to get a UDFA #5 WR on the final 53 when you can probably get him on the PS anyway.


Ok it's a valid thought.

My point is that we have a great quick thinking QB. It is his strength. Reading a defence, quick precise throws is Brady's strength. He is not the best deep ball thrower in the league. If you want to point to the Moss years then I would argue that Moss was a once in a decade type receiver. Moss is arguably one of the best receivers to ever play the game. I do not see Dobson being anything close to a Moss type receiver. So if you want to continue the success the Patriots have had offensively over the last 5+ years which includes a Super Bowl victory and appearances then why not stick to the same game plan? Brady just lit up the best defense in the league and broke a couple of Super Bowl records doing so.

Part of the success Brady has had has to do with the continuity (chemistry) he has with his receivers. Amendola, JE11, Lafell, etc... are all on the same page with Brady and it's a dangerous offense. Harper is not Amendola yet. We have seen too many PS heroes turn into RS duds. Let harper prove himself over the next season before we send Amendola anywhere. Amendola had a phenomenal post season. I do not think asking Harper to fill AD's shoes is a fair thing to do right now.

Anyways, I like how Harper has performed during the preseason and I hope it continues into the regular season. Having too many good receivers is a good problem to have.
 
Some observations on the game

Disclaimer: The longer I follow the Pats the LESS I care about what happens in these pre season games. I think practices will tell you more sometimes. It's hard to watch individual battles and techniques, which is what really matters in these scrimmages There is little or no game planning, and that's a huge factor in the team results, so aside from effort and communications, it is very hard to get a fix on where your team is. So for that reason I only watched the first quarter of the game, and then switched, only coming back during commercials. Keep that in mind as you read my comments

1. Lots of things to be critical of and lots of teaching points to be made. But there were a few mitigating factors that have to be mention beyond the players who weren't on the field.
a. The play calling wasn't in reaction to either down and distance or what the Saints were playing.

b. C on the OL is weak. Andrews held up pretty well in pass protection but was over his head vs the run. The fact is you cannot run the ball if your C is getting handled. The good news that IS the #3 C, who happens to be an UDFA rookie

c. That being said it didn't seem like the Rookie OG's weren't getting much movement either in the first half. But at first glance it looked like Mason showed improvement vs the pass.

d. Pass protection was decent. From what I saw, Brady was rarely touched, even though he was hurried a few times.

2. Hard to follow the defense. I thought the first DL played well against the run. And showed some decent inside push. Malcolm Brown got too high a few times I watched him and that can kill an initial push. Easley looked a bit quicker off the ball, but was too high as well. BTW - it was nice to see Siliga back, but he looked like a guy who's missed a lot of camp

3. Interesting to see McCourty still at CB, though he played the slot as well on the GL. Most of the succes Brees had on his first 2 drives was with his RB's and check downs. That's an easy fix when you game plan. Having Collins covering RB's from a MLB position is NOT something they'd do during the season.

4. Based on what I read during the 2 practices with the Saints it was very clear that very little was being done in the running game. So I wasn't surprised that neither side was particularly sharp in that area.

5. I like the way Deion Lewis runs the ball. White STILL as shown nothing in the running game. It has now taken him almost 2 years to come up with one nifty run for his TD, but that's been IT for his running highlight film. However it's clear even to me that he is definitely a threat out of the backfield. Unlike when he runs the ball, on almost every catch he makes the first guy miss. So to me at this point the guy is giving us only ONE value to his game, when he needs to be trying to have 4 (running, catching, blocking, and ST's)

6. The way the Giants are losing S's, it might be the time to pull of a trade, since we are very deep and strong at that position. It wouldn't be a bad thing to pick up a low round pick for either Ebner or Wilson.

7. JG improved his game considerably. He was much more aware of the pass rush, and moved productively when pressured, something he didn't do well against the Packers. His TD pass was a nice preview of his field awareness. I didn't see his pick.
 
Ok it's a valid thought.

My point is that we have a great quick thinking QB. It is his strength. Reading a defence, quick precise throws is Brady's strength. He is not the best deep ball thrower in the league. If you want to point to the Moss years then I would argue that Moss was a once in a decade type receiver. Moss is arguably one of the best receivers to ever play the game. I do not see Dobson being anything close to a Moss type receiver. So if you want to continue the success the Patriots have had offensively over the last 5+ years which includes a Super Bowl victory and appearances then why not stick to the same game plan? Brady just lit up the best defense in the league and broke a couple of Super Bowl records doing so.

Part of the success Brady has had has to do with the continuity (chemistry) he has with his receivers. Amendola, JE11, Lafell, etc... are all on the same page with Brady and it's a dangerous offense. Harper is not Amendola yet. We have seen too many PS heroes turn into RS duds. Let harper prove himself over the next season before we send Amendola anywhere. Amendola had a phenomenal post season. I do not think asking Harper to fill AD's shoes is a fair thing to do right now.

Anyways, I like how Harper has performed during the preseason and I hope it continues into the regular season. Having too many good receivers is a good problem to have.

I am fine with Harper going to the PS and Amendola sticking on the roster. I don't think Dobson is anything like Moss trust me, I didn't like him pre-draft particularly and I've not seen anything to change my mind. BUT, I do think this team can get too narrow and short in the passing game and Gronk is too often triple-teamed. Why not try to stretch the field and take some safety coverage away from Gronk. Amendola can't do that, Dobson might be able too.
 
Is that so? Didn't know he had troubles as a WR

He's one of those guys who makes unbelievable circus catches and then follows them up by dropping an easy catch on the very next play. He drops a lot of balls.

I thought that if he could ever put it all together he would be a stud, because the good is really good, and when he went to Miami I figured he'd emerge for them, that maybe it was just quarterback play in St Louis.

But that hasn't happened yet and at this point he's been in the league long enough that it seems likely it never will. That doesn't mean he isn't worth a roster spot, because he gets open well, but it means he has severe limitations.
 
In my totally non-professional opinion, that had high ankle sprain written all over it.

Not the end of the world, but certainly not ideal. If only Amendola didn't suck for four snaps, we might have something.

There was pass interference that wasn't called by the refs... but yeah, he didn't look his best tonight
 
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