Please convince me that Simmons and/or Beason fit the Patriots system

[Remix 6]

He would be a SS in the Pats system.

maybe..he does have a few INTs

 

[Rob0729]

Maybe we should move Bruschi to SS, or draft Beason to replace Harrison.

Unreal. Do you even watch NFL football?

Aparently, I do. You apparently don't realize that Vilma and Bruschi are two completely different players. It isn't a new concept that a LB has converted to safety or otherwise. Vilma is fast enough to play safety and drop into coverage. The SS in the Pats' system is used as an additional LB type role all the time.

 

[TripleOption]

Aparently, I do. You apparently don't realize that Vilma and Bruschi are two completely different players. It isn't a new concept that a LB has converted to safety or otherwise. Vilma is fast enough to play safety and drop into coverage. The SS in the Pats' system is used as an additional LB type role all the time.

The Pats play a load of Cover 2 and Cover 2 lock. You want Vilma playing a deep half, huh?

Just because they roll up the SS doesn't mean he is a LB either.

 

[DaBruinz]

I think Vilma would be a good SS in the Pats' system.

Besides, who knows if the Pats were legitimately interested in him. They had little to no shot at getting him so their interest was probably a smokescreen.

Who cares? We didn't draft him or try to move up to get him. We have no idea if the Pats were really interested in him.

Vima has been average at best in the 3-4 defense and got worse as the year went on. He was a stud 4-3 LB. What's your point? Beason is very good 4-3 LB and he can be downright average in the 3-4?

Actually, I am pretty sure that the Pats WERE interested in Vilma and, in fact, tried to trade up to get Vilma. They were rebuffed and the Jets ended up grabbing him and left the Pats with Wilfork.

Also, I believe that Belichick mentioned in Patriot Reign about the Pats being interested in Vilma.

 

[Rob0729]

why do u judge Vilma off 1 year on a new system?

Beason can be average.. or he can be amazing in a 3-4. we dont know. nuff said

Beason could be great in our system. I never said he couldn't be. I said he probably wouldn't, but then again you could say the same thing about Bruschi becoming a ILB. I just have concerns about his size. And they are legitimate concerns.

I don't think Vilma will ever be a great ILB in the belichick/Pioli 3-4.

 

[Remix 6]

Aparently, I do. You apparently don't realize that Vilma and Bruschi are two completely different players. It isn't a new concept that a LB has converted to safety or otherwise. Vilma is fast enough to play safety and drop into coverage. The SS in the Pats' system is used as an additional LB type role all the time.

Bruschi is not 250. Hes lighter..believe me. a few guys can move to Safety .. and they struggled(Michael Boulware) We already have an extra LB in our system. 4-3 uses 3 LBs..3-4 uses 4!

answer my question about Jason Taylor. Hes 255..go tell him hes too small for DE

 

[Rob0729]

The Pats play a load of Cover 2 and Cover 2 lock. You want Vilma playing a deep half, huh?

Just because they roll up the SS doesn't mean he is a LB either.

They don't play all that much cover 2. It depends on the oponent. If we had Don Davis out there at SS and he did decent. I think Jonathan Vilma could do it.

 

[Rob0729]

Bruschi is not 250. Hes lighter..believe me. a few guys can move to Safety .. and they struggled(Michael Boulware) We already have an extra LB in our system. 4-3 uses 3 LBs..3-4 uses 4!

He 247. Boulware is one player. Besides, we had Don Davis playing strong safety in part of 2004 and he did ok.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

This thread would be more appropriate if we ACTUALLY draft these guys,Otherwise this discussion is moot at this time... better to ask AFTER WE SELECT - Then the talks about who we selected and how they fit in NE is better timed

 

[TripleOption]

He 247. Boulware is one player. Besides, we had Don Davis playing strong safety in part of 2004 and he did ok.

We had Davis out there because of an apocalypse in the Secondary. He was terrible.

 

[TripleOption]

They don't play all that much cover 2. It depends on the oponent. If we had Don Davis out there at SS and he did decent. I think Jonathan Vilma could do it.

You are insane. They play a ton of Cover 2.

 

[Remix 6]

He 247. Boulware is one player. Besides, we had Don Davis playing strong safety in part of 2004 and he did ok.

Davis played half a game at SS..


why would someone move 1 of the best LBs (Vilma) in the draft, to safety?

u look at #s too much. you say he has size and hes athletic, fast..thats not how it works

can Willis play Safety? he ran a 4.37

2 different positions..2 different skill sets

 

[sebman2112]

The only thing you have taught me is that there are a lot of people that don't know anything about football but still post on NFL message boards.

I second that!

 

[Rob0729]

Actually, I am pretty sure that the Pats WERE interested in Vilma and, in fact, tried to trade up to get Vilma. They were rebuffed and the Jets ended up grabbing him and left the Pats with Wilfork.

Also, I believe that Belichick mentioned in Patriot Reign about the Pats being interested in Vilma.

You may be right, I thought Patriot Reign came out shortly after that draft. I don't think it was in there. But I could be wrong

 

[Rob0729]

We had Davis out there because of an apocalypse in the Secondary. He was terrible.

He wasn't terrible. He wasn't great. But was decent.

 

[TripleOption]

He wasn't terrible. He wasn't great. But was decent.

He was bad.

 

[Rob0729]

Davis played half a game at SS..


why would someone move 1 of the best LBs (Vilma) in the draft, to safety?

u look at #s too much. you say he has size and hes athletic, fast..thats not how it works

can Willis play Safety? he ran a 4.37

2 different positions..2 different skill sets

Why would the Bears move the best safety in the draft to LB when they drafted Brian Urlacher? I agree that it would be a stretch that they would move Vilma to safety, but I was throwing out hypotheticals.

I do think Vilma does have the skill set to play safety in the Mangini/Belichick system. It isn't about straight line speed. If straight line speed meant anything, Bethel Johnson would be an All Pro. But Vilma plays well in coverage in spaces and good recovery speed and can turn on a dime. Those translate well at SS.

 

[TripleOption]

Why would the Bears move the best safety in the draft to LB when they drafted Brian Urlacher? I agree that it would be a stretch that they would move Vilma to safety, but I was throwing out hypotheticals.

I do think Vilma does have the skill set to play safety in the Mangini/Belichick system. It isn't about straight line speed. If straight line speed meant anything, Bethel Johnson would be an All Pro. But Vilma plays well in coverage in spaces and good recovery speed and can turn on a dime. Those translate well at SS.

1. Urlacher was NOT the "best Safety in the draft", he was a Safety that was projected to play LB the entire time.

2. Vilma is a 4-3 OLB all day long. He is not a SS.

 

[Rob0729]

He was bad.

He wasn't bad. His first start at safety vs. Jets, he led the team in tackles and had a pass defense and helped lead Pennington to his worst game of the 2004 season. He had 5 tackles at safety vs. Baltimore.

For a back up LB and special teamer, he did a great job at safety. Besides, 2004 wasn't a year we had problems at LB. Both Wilson and Harrison had very productive and relatively healthy years.

 

[TripleOption]

He wasn't bad. His first start at safety vs. Jets, he led the team in tackles and had a pass defense and helped lead Pennington to his worst game of the 2004 season. He had 5 tackles at safety vs. Baltimore.

For a back up LB and special teamer, he did a great job at safety. Besides, 2004 wasn't a year we had problems at LB. Both Wilson and Harrison had very productive and relatively healthy years.

Wilson and Harrison play Safety.

Davis looked awkward and out of place, as you would expect from a LB playing Safety. It's a bad idea.