Patriots claim (update: Cut) RB Trey Williams - (Flowers to IR)

[RobertWeathers]

Why weren't they starters when they were backups?

100s of reasons.

As it pertains to James White- who is an average backup with limited physical ability, what is your point?

 

[RobertWeathers]

James White has "done a pretty decent job as a 2nd/3rd stringer?" Really? He has 13 rushes on the year for a total of 35 yards, or 2.7 YPC.

Basically, his production over 2 yrs as a NEP comes down to catching a pass in the flat and breaking a tackle in the Bills game. If they didn't even bother to use him in the game last week @DEN where the entire game plan was to try and beat the LBs in coverage, that may not be a good sign.

You have a much higher opinion of him than I do. Let's hope you're right and I'm wrong.

I'm not going including last year and ground game in itself was below average last week.

Look- the guy most likely will not be with the team next year because he is limited but like I said he's caught some balls and scored a couple of TDs. In the grand scheme of things that's not awful.

 

[Mack Herron]

100s of reasons.

As it pertains to James White- who is an average backup with limited physical ability, what is your point?

You said:

Backup players are not consistent as starters .

My point is that this statement is false. There are backup players who become consistent starters (Troy Brown, released 3 times). Being a backup means only that the coach has judged the player less effective than the starter (and the coach could be wrong). In this case, White was behind Dion Lewis, who was one of the best in the league. That still leaves a lot of room potentially for White to be an effective contributor. There are other, better, arguments as to why we might not feel so sanguine about White's future (see Supafly above). Playing behind Lewis is not one of them.

 

[1960Pats]

My point is that this statement is false. There are backup players who become consistent starters (Troy Brown, released 3 times). Being a backup means only that the coach has judged the player less effective than the starter (and the coach could be wrong). In this case, White was behind Dion Lewis, who was one of the best in the league. That still leaves a lot of room potentially for White to be an effective contributor. There are other, better, arguments as to why we might not feel so sanguine about White's future (see Supafly above). Playing behind Lewis is not one of them.

Tedy Bruschi is another player who was a backup for a few years before he became a very consistent starter. He turned out to be one of the best Pats evah.

 

[RobertWeathers]

You said:

My point is that this statement is false. There are backup players who become consistent starters (Troy Brown, released 3 times). Being a backup means only that the coach has judged the player less effective than the starter (and the coach could be wrong). In this case, White was behind Dion Lewis, who was one of the best in the league. That still leaves a lot of room potentially for White to be an effective contributor. There are other, better, arguments as to why we might not feel so sanguine about White's future (see Supafly above). Playing behind Lewis is not one of them.

Let's categorize as this is where I am going with James White.

There are backups that evolve into starters.

There are backups/part timers that when thrust into full time roles are limited and who's deficiencies are exposed.

The latter is James White and was/is a backup to Lewis for multiple reasons.

 

[Skree]

Is Williams playing today? I'd like to get a look at him.

 

[Richard Camembert]

Late to the party here, but that tape didnt wow me. The guy is elusive against poor competition. Also, he got caught from behind a lot, and seemed to run out of gas on some plays too. I'm sure he'll play if he's playing better than White in practice, but the brakes may require some pumping.

Also, clearly, Lewis was great for us this year until hurt. That dude was electrifying. No, he's not an all time great (yet?), but he sure played great, and obviously his loss left a gap which has yet to be filled.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Late to the party here, but that tape didnt wow me. The guy is elusive against poor competition. Also, he got caught from behind a lot, and seemed to run out of gas on some plays too. I'm sure he'll play if he's playing better than White in practice, but the brakes may require some pumping.

Also, clearly, Lewis was great for us this year until hurt. That dude was electrifying. No, he's not an all time great (yet?), but he sure played great, and obviously his loss left a gap which has yet to be filled.

Did you see the play vs CAR in preseason where he made 5 defenders swing and miss?

Hes not Lewis but making guys miss is a strength of Williams'.

 

[I.M. Fletcher]

Let's give the guy a shot. Lewis was on pace for one of the 2-3 best seasons ever for a pats back, so that will be an unfair measuring stick no matter who we had on the roster.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Let's give the guy a shot. Lewis was on pace for one of the 2-3 best seasons ever for a pats back, so that will be an unfair measuring stick no matter who we had on the roster.

Lewis was having a fine year but thats a stretch.

 

[I.M. Fletcher]

Lewis was having a fine year but thats a stretch.

Yards from scrimmage, he was right there with Dillons and martins best seasons. There is no way to know how it would have played out, but he started the season like he was shot out of a cannon.

 

[Concussion Protocol]

Late to the party here, but that tape didnt wow me. The guy is elusive against poor competition. Also, he got caught from behind a lot, and seemed to run out of gas on some plays too. I'm sure he'll play if he's playing better than White in practice, but the brakes may require some pumping.

Also, clearly, Lewis was great for us this year until hurt. That dude was electrifying. No, he's not an all time great (yet?), but he sure played great, and obviously his loss left a gap which has yet to be filled.

He's definitely faster than Faulk, Vereen, or Lewis. If you consider being tackled by a DB with an angle as being caught from behind, then ya, he gets caught from behind like every RB not named Bo Jackson. I'm pretty sure he won't be in Lewis' league, but speed won't be his problem.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Yards from scrimmage, he was right there with Dillons and martins best seasons. There is no way to know how it would have played out, but he started the season like he was shot out of a cannon.

Lewis was on a pace for about 88 yards a game.

That is not better than 04 Dillon or Jim Nances.

 

[Angelpats]

To have one of the best seasons for a pats back the man has to finish out the season. He is good but you have to be durable as well.

 

[I.M. Fletcher]

Lewis was on a pace for about 88 yards a game.

That is not better than 04 Dillon or Jim Nances.

I did say he was up there with. He also left early from the last game which cut down on his overall number.

All that to be said, if you want to put him on pace with the 4-5 best seasons ever for the pats, the point still remains.

 

[Off The Grid]

Scott Chandler

Voted ~ by his Colleagues ~ Most Average Tight End In The Galaxy ~ 4 Years in a row.

So we got that going for us.

Which is nice.

 

[DaBruinz]

Lewis was on a pace for about 88 yards a game.

That is not better than 04 Dillon or Jim Nances.

It's truly disingenuous to attempt to compare Lewis stats this year to that of Corey Dillon's or Jim Nance's. Why? Because in 2004, the Patriots ran 524 running plays (including kneeldowns) compared to 485 passing attempts. In 1966, when Nance's avg. was 111 YPG from scrimmage, the Patriots ran 474 running plays to 393 passing plays. The Patriots are currently running at 65% passing plays and 35% running plays. A significant shift.

Also, Lewis didn't play a full 7 games. He went down before he completed the 7th. His number is closer to 93-94 yards per game than 89 (not sure why you rounded 88.857 down).

 

[RobertWeathers]

I did say he was up there with. He also left early from the last game which cut down on his overall number.

All that to be said, if you want to put him on pace with the 4-5 best seasons ever for the pats, the point still remains.

Initially you said right there with Dillon.

If you want to put him substantially below Dillon then that is fine.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It's truly disingenuous to attempt to compare Lewis stats this year to that of Corey Dillon's or Jim Nance's. Why? Because in 2004, the Patriots ran 524 running plays (including kneeldowns) compared to 485 passing attempts. In 1966, when Nance's avg. was 111 YPG from scrimmage, the Patriots ran 474 running plays to 393 passing plays. The Patriots are currently running at 65% passing plays and 35% running plays. A significant shift.

Also, Lewis didn't play a full 7 games. He went down before he completed the 7th. His number is closer to 93-94 yards per game than 89 (not sure why you rounded 88.857 down).

The discussion was about RBs and total yards and I did the math in my head.

 

[manxman2601]

Scott Chandler

Voted ~ by his Colleagues ~ Most Average Tight End In The Galaxy ~ 4 Years in a row.

So we got that going for us.

Which is nice.

The nice thing about being average is that there are always people worse than you by definition.