OT...sort of...I need some help...

[patfanken]

....In a discussion about Antonio Cromartie, someone posted stats that indicated that most of his interception production in 2007 came in a 9 game period and was accomplished against sub par QBs. I really need to find that post to use against some delusional Jet fans.

Anybody? Thanks

 

[Nikolai]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

Antonio Cromartie's 2007 Game Log

It was in a 9-game vacuum, but he wasn't a consistent starter at the beginning of the year. Three of his INTs came against Manning, and the rest came against Culpepper, Rosenfels/Schaub*, Huard/Thigpen*, Young, and Kitna.

*Who exactly the interceptions came against isn't clear to me.

 

[eom]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

nfl.com probably has all those play by play game logs

http://www.nfl.com/teams/schedule?team=SD&season=2007&seasonType=REG

but still, give the guy some credit for producing the picks --- I don't care who he was playing against.
the problem is people get all crazy over picks, just like sacks ---- that's maybe 9 (or whatever) plays throughout the year.
what'd he do on the other 800+ plays?

 

[the wrothbroughterer]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

Week 6 against Oakland: 1 INT off of Josh McCown 69.4 QB rating for the year
Ween 8 against Houston : 2 INT off of Matt Schaub 87.2 QB rating for the year
Week 10 against Indy: 3 INT off of the King of Choke Mountain 98.0 QB rating for the year
Week 13 against KC: 2 INT off of Damon Huard 76.2 QB rating for the year
Week 14 against Tennessee: 1 INT off of Vince Young 71.1QB rating for the year
Week 15 against Detroit: 1 INT off of John Kitna 80.9 for the year

Average QB rating of QBs he intercepted: 80.4666

You might have a point.

 

[eom]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

Week 6 against Oakland: 1 INT off of Josh McCown 69.4 QB rating for the year
Ween 8 against Houston : 2 INT off of Matt Schaub 87.2 QB rating for the year
Week 10 against Indy: 3 INT off of the King of Choke Mountain 98.0 QB rating for the year
Week 13 against KC: 2 INT off of Damon Huard 76.2 QB rating for the year
Week 14 against Tennessee: 1 INT off of Vince Young 71.1QB rating for the year
Week 15 against Detroit: 1 INT off of John Kitna 80.9 for the year

Average QB rating of QBs he intercepted: 80.4666

You might have a point.

mccown --- 11 picks on 190 att
schaub -- 9/289
manning -- 14/515
huard -- 13/332
young -- 17/382
kitna -- 20/561

for a grand total of 84 picks in 2269 attempts, I think, or one pick per 27 attempts.
let's not pretend these guys throw picks every other down.

 

[eom]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

by the way, if you're really into small sample stats, here's an article to help fuel your debate:

ProFootballFocus.com - Articles

Getting topical, we look at some of the players involved in trades and free agent move over the past week. Recent Jets acquisition Antonio Cromartie has often had a reputation as a player who isn't as keen on tackling as maybe he should be, and he finds himself just outside the bottom ten with a 16.22 TIR

 

[the wrothbroughterer]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

mccown --- 11 picks on 190 att
schaub -- 9/289
manning -- 14/515
huard -- 13/332
young -- 17/382
kitna -- 20/561

for a grand total of 84 picks in 2269 attempts, I think, or one pick per 27 attempts.
let's not pretend these guys throw picks every other down.

And over 500 attempts thats 18.52 which will consistently put you in the top 5 in INTs every year. Let's not pretend that its a solid group of talent either. There are only 2 players that are starters now.

 

[jmt57]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

Week 6 against Oakland: 1 INT off of Josh McCown 69.4 QB rating for the year
Ween 8 against Houston : 2 INT off of Matt Schaub 87.2 QB rating for the year
Week 10 against Indy: 3 INT off of the King of Choke Mountain 98.0 QB rating for the year
Week 13 against KC: 2 INT off of Damon Huard 76.2 QB rating for the year
Week 14 against Tennessee: 1 INT off of Vince Young 71.1QB rating for the year
Week 15 against Detroit: 1 INT off of John Kitna 80.9 for the year

Average QB rating of QBs he intercepted: 80.4666

For the most part the anti-Cromartie camp has stated he had one (or one half) good year. Looking at those stats, it's more like he had one excellent game against the Colts, and then feasted on rookies or guys that should never have been starting in the first place for his other interceptions.


Slightly off-topic, but I can't help but wonder if he would be as well known if his name was say, Doug Brown or Leo Smith. I get the feeling there is a certain percentage of NFL fans (and media) that get enamored by a unique name and story.

 

[patsfan-1982]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

i for one would not say anything about him. in 2007 he was san diego. best CB so he was playing other teams best WR at lest half of the time. with the jets he will never be lined up on the other teams best WR.


he may just have a all pro year with that defense.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

I lived in Orange County in 2007, which meant that I had the dubious... err, pleasure of watching pretty much every Chargers game that year. And make no mistake, Cromartie was a physical freak. He's too tall to be as fast and agile as he is. Honestly, I think that attempting to discredit what he did over those six games in 2007 is misguided, because it was a pretty ridiculous run.

If you want to go after something, go after the fact that he hasn't even come close to replicating it since. Over the past two years, he's been unremarkable to say the least, and hip injuries scare the hell out of me.

Basically, I think it's a losing strategy to bank on guys showing something that they haven't shown for 2+ years. There's usually a reason why they haven't shown it in the interim.

 

[patriotscpfc]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

So, when we play the Jets with our full WR outlook (providing no more FAs/trades)

We'll have Moss, Welker, Tate, Edelman.

Who lines up on who?

I think Wes could have a field day against Cromartie.

But Revis shuts Moss down. Can he shut Wes down?

Do they put Lowery on Welker and Cromartie on Tate/Edelman?

Whichever way we look at it, there will be some sort of matchup advantage against them.

 

[patfanken]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

Thanks a lot for the info guys. I don't think Cromartie is a stiff, just not the second coming of "Night Train" Lane, as some Jet fans think he is.

 

[spacecrime]

Re: OT...sort of....I need some help....

mccown --- 11 picks on 190 att
schaub -- 9/289
manning -- 14/515
huard -- 13/332
young -- 17/382
kitna -- 20/561

for a grand total of 84 picks in 2269 attempts, I think, or one pick per 27 attempts.
let's not pretend these guys throw picks every other down.

No, but let's not pretend that 1 pick every 27 attempts isn't averaging 2 picks per game, or 32 picks per year. That sucks by anyone's definition.

Cromartie is what he is. Whether he got his picks against good teams or bad in 2007, he hasn't shown very much since.

 

[makoute]

Isn't that generally the case, you're more likely to have more picks against bad qb's then good ones. Tom Brady, Seyton Manning, Drew Brees, generally don't throw a lot of picks.

 

[eom]

Isn't that generally the case, you're more likely to have more picks against bad qb's then good ones. Tom Brady, Seyton Manning, Drew Brees, generally don't throw a lot of picks.

of course that's generally the case, and there are a lot of corners playing crap qb's around the league who aren't hauling in 10 picks.
generally speaking, most corners in the league don't line up against the league's top 5 qb's 12+ times/season.
but like I mentioned before, those 10 plays don't outweigh the other 800.

I wouldn't mind actually sifting through some pff data on this just for the sake of conversation, but we'll see if I can maintain motivation.
what kind of stats do you guys think would tell the tale of a cb?

 

[eom]

I was going to look week by week, but I lost motivation pretty fast on that, so I just thought I'd work off season stats for '09 --- I'll post a few up here for conversation, but i'm not making any claims about their relevance.

ProFootballFocus.com - By Position

there are 41 corners who played 75% of snaps last year, and cromartie primarily plays rcb.

# of total snaps:
low = 846
cro' = 895
jammer = 949
high = 1109

thrown at:
1. asomugha = 28
2. c rogers = 61
13. cro' = 79
15. r barber = 80
16. jammer = 82
T38. revis = 111
41. drc = 120

(thrown at)/(# of snaps)x100:
asomugha = 2.9
c rogers = 6.9
jammer = 8.6
cro' = 8.8
revis = 11
drc = 12

passes defended:
1. revis = 23
2. drc = 16
T16. jammer = 9
T32. cro' = 6
40. asomugha = 2

qb rating for passes thrown into player's coverage:
1. revis = 32
2. l hall = 52
3. woodson = 52
11. drc = 67
14. jammer = 71
15. cro' = 71
35. asomugha = 98
41. r barber = 117

% of completions made in player's coverage:
1. revis = 37
6. drc = 51
14. jammer = 55
18. cro' = 57
40. r barber = 70
41. asomugha = 75

stops - # of solo tackles made which constitute an offensive failure:
(I don't know what constitutes a 'failure')
1. woodson = 37
2. r barber = 34
T15. asomugha = 17
T15. finnegan = 17
T24. revis = 14
T30. drc = 12
38. cro' = 8
T39. jammer = 7
41. c rogers = 6

total yac:
1. asomugha = 119
T2. revis = 145
5. jammer = 157
7. woodson = 172
T9. cro' = 178
39. drc = 310 (6 td's tied for high)
41. get rich to this = 341 (5 td's)

(yac)/(# rec):
revis = 3.5
jammer = 3.5
r barber = 3.7
cro' = 4.0
woodson = 4.4
finnegan = 4.8
drc = 5.1
asomugha = 5.7
get rich to this = 7.6