OT: 2021 NFL QB Prospects List or 1st Round Discussion

[Joker]

BCG is spot on about board bias though, I must admit. I say NEVER draft a pimped and pumped up USC Trojan QB. They always end up like the used condom, not the Greek warrior. Oh yeah, almost forgot my other bias...Lamar Jackson. Looks like he's turned out to be exactly the kind of "QB" I said he was...in other words, a running back with an inaccurate arm. My most profound bias, however, is ANY QB selected by the NY Jets. I'll take that one to the grave.

 

[scott99]

Unfortunately, just because we all (or mostly all) feel Belichick needs to select a QB with our 1st round pick, doesn’t mean he will. In fact, I’d be in shock if he does. That being said, Depending where the Pats pick, and I think it’ll be top 10, I would hope they would select a top notch QB. But Belichick’s trends are troubling.

 

[Vindicate]

Anyone got a read on Book (pun intended) from ND? I watch little to no CFB, but caught the tail end of that game last night. Guy seemed to really go through progressions and make good, situation-football decisions. Seems like a guy who you could take a tiny bit later if he's not as hyped as prospects like Lawrence, and get a disciplined QB who can march down a field and remain posied in tense situations.


Man, I really made a bunch of assumptions off of 4-6 minutes of play. Hopefully I'm a bit accurate lol. Any idea?

 

[scott99]

Anyone got a read on Book (pun intended) from ND? I watch little to no CFB, but caught the tail end of that game last night. Guy seemed to really go through progressions and make good, situation-football decisions. Seems like a guy who you could take a tiny bit later if he's not as hyped as prospects like Lawrence, and get a disciplined QB who can march down a field and remain posied in tense situations.


Man, I really made a bunch of assumptions off of 4-6 minutes of play. Hopefully I'm a bit accurate lol. Any idea?

He’s been really solid the last few years. He’s pretty small, 6’0” 210, but size concerns are a thing of the past when you look at the NFL nowadays. He has some good traits, and runs the ND offense really well.

That being said, I’d be surprised if he was one of the top 10 QBs selected in the 2021 draft. I’d bet he’d get drafted in the 5th round.

 

[Uptown]

Love the kid..

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Unfortunately, just because we all (or mostly all) feel Belichick needs to select a QB with our 1st round pick, doesn’t mean he will. In fact, I’d be in shock if he does. That being said, Depending where the Pats pick, and I think it’ll be top 10, I would hope they would select a top notch QB. But Belichick’s trends are troubling.

Don't burn a pick that possibly involves McDaniels giving horribly bad opinions. Cross off ANY first round pick at WR, QB, TE. Maybe OLine only if Scar personally comes out of retirement and says so. Otherwise use our first rounder on a DE/DT or Linebacker. Draft and develop QB Mac Jones out of Alabama off a mid-round pick

.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Anyone got a read on Book (pun intended) from ND? I watch little to no CFB, but caught the tail end of that game last night. Guy seemed to really go through progressions and make good, situation-football decisions. Seems like a guy who you could take a tiny bit later if he's not as hyped as prospects like Lawrence, and get a disciplined QB who can march down a field and remain posied in tense situations.


Man, I really made a bunch of assumptions off of 4-6 minutes of play. Hopefully I'm a bit accurate lol. Any idea?

Inconsistent accuracy that drives you nuts. Was good in 18 but mechanics and accuracy are so inconsistent. His upper half is all over the place. Tough kid. Looks a little gun shy but he's a leader. Decent college QB on a very good team. ND would probably be a contender if they switched QB's the other night. I like him as a mid-late round possible backup. Possible Tay Hill type, possible.

 

[Uptown]

Report: 49ers scouting QBs Wilson, Jones for 2021 NFL Draft

The 49ers reportedly have been scouting these two draft prospects as possible Jimmy G replacements.

www.nbcsports.com

NFL rumors: 49ers scouting QBs Zach Wilson, Mac Jones for 2021 draft

The 49ers reportedly have been scouting these two draft prospects as possible Jimmy G replacements.

sports.yahoo.com

SF 49ers NFL Draft needs: Zach Wilson stock on the rise

While it's unclear whether or not the SF 49ers move on from Jimmy Garoppolo, the chatter about BYU's Zach Wilson is certainly getting louder.

ninernoise.com

 

[DropKickFlutie]

So JimmyG might be available

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

Love the kid..

I like him as well. I’m nervous about SF. Looks like a great fit in shannys offense, if we’re behind them in the draft may have to trade up.

 

[ToonPatriot]

Can someone explain to me the clear and obvious benefit of going vet over rookie at this stage in our rebuild?

It worries the hell out of me that we re-sign Cam or bring back Jimmy G (or maybe even take a shot at someone like Stafford), all of which are capable NFL QBs to win games, but not to win Championships - and shouldn't that always be the goal?

If we were a play-off team lacking a QB I could see the logic (though it didn't work for the Vikings), but we aren't, and we look like we are going to draft at our highest place in a long time that may also conveniently be the best time to try and secure our next franchise QB.

We can probably all agree we won't be that high next year regardless, so we either get the young centerpiece in with all the potential, plug pieces around him and build that way, or we sign a vet (with Jimmy G on money we wouldn't pay Brady) who have shown in their career that they're good solid QBs but not the guy to put a team on his shoulders and carry them to the promised land, build around them, and get back to a winning record at least. My one issue with that is, it's short term given their age, with Jimmy he will likely get injured a couple more times, and eventually we have to address the future anyway - so aren't we just delaying the inevitable?

It's then also harder to draft the QBoTF when you're middle of the pack-low picking, and I know plenty on here have pointed out the varying degrees of success of round 1 QBs but surely it's acknowledged you still have a higher percentage of success the higher you take him?

Maybe an out of place question for this thread, but I never understand why guys like Foles continue to get starting jobs when they're a known quantity, and that quantity just isn't very good.

 

[Uptown]

 

[Jim Beankie]

BCG is spot on about board bias though, I must admit. I say NEVER draft a pimped and pumped up USC Trojan QB. They always end up like the used condom, not the Greek warrior. Oh yeah, almost forgot my other bias...Lamar Jackson. Looks like he's turned out to be exactly the kind of "QB" I said he was...in other words, a running back with an inaccurate arm. My most profound bias, however, is ANY QB selected by the NY Jets. I'll take that one to the grave.

Lamar is more accurate than Brady was over the first 3 years and is more careful with the football (way fewer fumbles and much lower INT%). They also have the same number of TDs (rush+pass) even though Lamar has played 7 fewer games. That's only the regular season, though. He was clearly terrible in the 2 playoff games, which is why it's understandable that he has that stigma of inaccuracy.

 

[Joker]

Lamar is more accurate than Brady was over the first 3 years and is more careful with the football (way fewer fumbles and much lower INT%). They also have the same number of TDs (rush+pass) even though Lamar has played 7 fewer games. That's only the regular season, though. He was clearly terrible in the 2 playoff games, which is why it's understandable that he has that stigma of inaccuracy.

So Brady had 954 completions out of 1541 attempts his first 3 seasons...your "hero!!!" Ravens boy Lamar so far in his first 3 season, 522 completions in 818 attempts. Brady had 10K in yardage, your "better than Brady!!!!!~" mutt has about 7K so far. Throw in the FACT, that's F-A-C-T, that rules changes have exponentially helped the passing stats of TODAY's QB's and your assertion is ridiculous.Brady at age 43 is ahead of "Superstar!!!!" in passing yardage this season by OVER a 1000 yards.

 

[Triumph]

Luck took his team to a number of AFCCG's? True if that number is 1. And in that 1 game he was 12-33 for 126 yards and 2 picks in a 45-7 loss. Overall he was 4-4 in the playoffs with lousy numbers. 12 TDs and 13 picks.

Luck was a Bust.

His losing was never his fault. The Colts were always out of one more piece to the puzzle so Andy could succeed.

 

[Jim Beankie]

So Brady had 954 completions out of 1541 attempts his first 3 seasons...your "hero!!!" Ravens boy Lamar so far in his first 3 season, 522 completions in 818 attempts. Brady had 10K in yardage, your "better than Brady!!!!!~" mutt has about 7K so far. Throw in the FACT, that's F-A-C-T, that rules changes have exponentially helped the passing stats of TODAY's QB's and your assertion is ridiculous.Brady at age 43 is ahead of "Superstar!!!!" in passing yardage this season by OVER a 1000 yards.

Lamar is faarrr from my hero (although I was disappointed we didn't draft him) - you just called him inaccurate, and I compared him to the GOAT's progress. Plus Lamar's only played 40 games so far to Brady's 47 for the 1st 3 seasons, so you have to multiply Lamar's stats (or divide Brady's) by 1.175 to get an accurate picture. You're also completely discounting Lamar's rushing - put those together and Lamar has generated significantly more yards than Brady did over his 1st 3 seasons.

The Ty Law rule implemented after Brady's 3rd year definitely helps all - I'll give you that. However, Lamar's Career Completion % is exactly the same (63.8%) as Brady's in his 20 years in NE. He'd be 18th all time just behind Brady at this rate (and tied with him at 3rd all time in INT%). Where he goes from here, who knows. I thought he threw pretty well in horrible conditions (except the INT) against us. I'm leaning towards your having your Dennis Green moment. As an AFC foe, I'd definitely want that.

Disclosure: I'm also rooting for Brady and Gronk to do very well in Tampa, with the hope that we'd beat them in the SB. Gonna happen? Laughable.

 

[Doctor DDS]

Lamar is faarrr from my hero (although I was disappointed we didn't draft him) - you just called him inaccurate, and I compared him to the GOAT's progress. Plus Lamar's only played 40 games so far to Brady's 47 for the 1st 3 seasons, so you have to multiply Lamar's stats (or divide Brady's) by 1.175 to get an accurate picture. You're also completely discounting Lamar's rushing - put those together and Lamar has generated significantly more yards than Brady did over his 1st 3 seasons.

The Ty Law rule implemented after Brady's 3rd year definitely helps all - I'll give you that. However, Lamar's Career Completion % is exactly the same (63.8%) as Brady's in his 20 years in NE. He'd be 18th all time just behind Brady at this rate (and tied with him at 3rd all time in INT%). Where he goes from here, who knows. I thought he threw pretty well in horrible conditions (except the INT) against us. I'm leaning towards your having your Dennis Green moment. As an AFC foe, I'd definitely want that.

Disclosure: I'm also rooting for Brady and Gronk to do very well in Tampa, with the hope that we'd beat them in the SB. Gonna happen? Laughable.

There have been multiple rule changes/points of emphasis since the early 2000's that have drastically impacted QB stats. Jackson is currently 26th in the league in completion % at 64% yet it's higher than Joe Montana's career 63.2%. Montana passed for 30 TD's once in his career and never passed for 4,000 yards. It is a completely different sport so unless we want to conclude that the 10 greatest QBs to ever play all happen to be playing right now the comparisons are stupid.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

How are we debating whether Lamar is good or not. The kid won a freaking NFL MVP and still has a ton he can get better. Which is incredible. That means the kid is super talented. To be a MVP and still have an even higher possible ceiling.


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[Jim Beankie]

There have been multiple rule changes/points of emphasis since the early 2000's that have drastically impacted QB stats. Jackson is currently 26th in the league in completion % at 64% yet it's higher than Joe Montana's career 63.2%. Montana passed for 30 TD's once in his career and never passed for 4,000 yards. It is a completely different sport so unless we want to conclude that the 10 greatest QBs to ever play all happen to be playing right now the comparisons are stupid.

In this case, I was just focused on the accuracy aspect, nothing more. I believed that Lamar was not an inaccurate QB, and tried to compare him to the GOAT's 1st 3 seasons and his overall body of work. Given that, thanks for making me think about this a little more. While the latter is fair, I'm definitely aware of the different eras especially with all the different offense friendly rule changes, but decided to investigate it. Average Comp% from 2001-2003 was 59.0% and from 2018-2020 was 64.6%. I did not think that it was going to be that big of a difference, so I do stand corrected in this regard (current accuracy) about Lamar. Don't worry, I thought he sucked before, anyway (for different reasons). Apologies for derailing the thread.

That being said, I'm not familiar with the college game - have they gone through the same offense friendly rule changes as the pros? Curious to look at stats over the years to evaluate the current crop.

 

[Joker]

MVP awards are pure idiocy. It's a popularity contest.Lamar is getting exposed this season and will soon be replaced by the Arizona QB as the flavor of the year for you fantasy geekaloids