Official Vikings vs Pats thread

[richpats]

Ya can't call this a "trap" game.

A trap game is against a much weaker opponent,that you are liable to take for granted.

Minn.is 4-2,playing at home.

I'll bet the Pats are a minimal favorite,
at best.

I think it's all relative - Minnesota may not be "weak" like Miami in '04 but it's a lesser opponent relative to the Colts. The timing of the game is the most important thing though - playing in Minnesota on a Monday night when you've got the Colts coming to town in 6 days (probably something orchestrated by Polian via the competition committee).

 

[Oswlek]

You're overstating that a little. It's more like Belichick's teams are almost unbeatable (except for the Broncos) the second time they face a QB in the same season. I wouldn't say they struggle in the others, they're just not as unbeatable.

When you have a team that has won enough games since 2001 that a 13 win year (including playoffs) would bring the average down, looking less unbeatable *is* struggling.

 

[vafides]

Lets save this talk about the Colts till next week. Do not overlook this team that just beat a very good Seattle team in one of the toughest places to play in all of the NFL. This game will not be an easy one.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

When you have a team that has won enough games since 2001 that a 13 win year (including playoffs) would bring the average down, looking less unbeatable *is* struggling.

Just making sure you meant that in relative terms, not absolute terms . . .

 

[Oswlek]

Just making sure you meant that in relative terms, not absolute terms . . .

Yes, of course. It is hard to find a lot of flaws in the recent run, but, even without tons of hard evidence, just think back. Even with teams they see all the time, the first is almost always the hardest:

In 2003

Miami - 23-16 / 12-0
Buffalo - 0-31 / 31-0
NYJ - 23-16 / 21-16 (Vinny T played the first one, so I think that is a mulligan)
Indy - 38-34 / 24-14
TN - 38-30 / 17-14
The struggled against the Texans

In 2004

Buffalo - 31-17 / 29-6
NYJ - 13-7 / 24-7
Miami - 24-10 / 28-29
Pitt - 20-34 / 41-27
Indy - 27-24 / 20-3
Arizona was a tougher game than you would think

I don't think I am that far off base here.

Just looking at this, it is remarkable. In only one case did the opposing team score as many points as they did in the first game. NE really does play much better the second time around.

 

[MrBigglesWorth]

Yes, of course. It is hard to find a lot of flaws in the recent run, but, even without tons of hard evidence, just think back. Even with teams they see all the time, the first is almost always the hardest:

In 2003

Miami - 23-16 / 12-0
Buffalo - 0-31 / 31-0
NYJ - 23-16 / 21-16 (Vinny T played the first one, so I think that is a mulligan)
Indy - 38-34 / 24-14
TN - 38-30 / 17-14
The struggled against the Texans

In 2004

Buffalo - 31-17 / 29-6
NYJ - 13-7 / 24-7
Miami - 24-10 / 28-29
Pitt - 20-34 / 41-27
Indy - 27-24 / 20-3
Arizona was a tougher game than you would think

I don't think I am that far off base here.

Just looking at this, it is remarkable. In only one case did the opposing team score as many points as they did in the first game. NE really does play much better the second time around.

this trap game stuff is stupid. minnesota is a very good team, built alot like the patriots with beef on the both the offensive lines and defensive lines. brad johnson is somewhat of an old man's brady..,... he's very smart and doesn't lose you many games.

the pats will have big tests on both sides of the lines especially with minnesota's left tack and left guard. Let's hope seymour is in there, if not the pats better plan on playing a 4 man line quite a bit. if seymour is out, hill better be ready to back up green. plus we'll get to see how good mike wright is.

on offense the pats better plan on exploiting the edges, becuase there ain't gonna be much running room up the middle. the no huddle could be key to tired out pat williams.

minnesota is a good team and the pats will have their hands full

 

[Keegs]

You guys are too funny.

I got an idea. Lets all rush and try to be the first one to make an "official Patriots Game Thread"...
it does not matter how early it is posted because the first person to do it is cool and they have their name next to it.

Unbelievable. We are over a week away.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

anyone have early scouting info on these guys? good pts ,weakness ?...i havent followed them much other than hutchinson and taylor..

Commentator remarks during the Seattle game indicate they lead the NFL in penalties...8/game I believe.

The O-line/D-line matchups are going to be classic - I really hope Sey's elbow bounces back to full strength, else we might see Marquise Hill for the first time.

CB Winfield used to play for the Buffs and give the Pats fits. He got big money moving to Minny.

Brad Johnson won a superbowl by playing smart and within himself and within his teammates skill set. The WR corps is starting to settle down, he has one big play guy Marcus Johnson (I think) and two Bethel Johnsons (including the original). For possession receiver, he has TE Jermain Wiggins who speaks with the melodious tones of East Boston and harbors a SB36 ring in a safe deposit box somewhere.

RB Chester Taylor put on a clinic for Seattle's defense, with that O-line, he could create some work for our secondary on occasion. He had a 95 yd TD run against Seattle's super fast defense - you do the math.

They've knocked off two playoff teams from last year: Seattle, Carolina. This is a team that held a slugfest with Chicago (another playoff team) and nearly won. Their schedule has been one to challenge them or destroy their spirit - they have risen to the challenge.

The Pats need to play smart, disciplined, and be opportunistic when Minnesota's boys foul-up with penalties and other mental mistakes. Brad can throw the long ball and pick you apart, keep it front and don't break. Put Chad Scott on Jermain Wiggins. Special Teams are critical.

 

[Lockdown06]

im pretty sure the guy you're thinking of is marcus robinson, but their big play receiver is troy williamson im pretty sure.

 

[cstjohn17]

this trap game stuff is stupid. minnesota is a very good team, built alot like the patriots with beef on the both the offensive lines and defensive lines. brad johnson is somewhat of an old man's brady..,... he's very smart and doesn't lose you many games.

the pats will have big tests on both sides of the lines especially with minnesota's left tack and left guard. Let's hope seymour is in there, if not the pats better plan on playing a 4 man line quite a bit. if seymour is out, hill better be ready to back up green. plus we'll get to see how good mike wright is.

on offense the pats better plan on exploiting the edges, becuase there ain't gonna be much running room up the middle. the no huddle could be key to tired out pat williams.

minnesota is a good team and the pats will have their hands full

I agree, this is a good team and it has a huge home field advantage. The team is gaining confidence and the fans will be going nuts, being on Monday Football will make it even louder. It see this being a slug fest. When games are this tight I pick the team with the edge at QB and in coaching. Leads to NE winning a close one, like have done a million times before.

Vikings profile
- stout D, allowing 70 YPG rushing (which is just sick!)
- solid DL with the Williamseses (Pat & Kevin)
- good corners (Smoot & Winfield) and Safeties (Smith & Sharper)
- pretty active LBs (Harris,Hendersen & Leber)

Offense
- very good offensive line (Hutchinson, McKinnie are beasts), the right side of the Pats defense (Seymour?? and Colvin, Seau will have their hands full)
- above average running game, Chester is not a power back but can break them ala Tatum Belll (not as fast as Bell but similar style)
- effective QB, experienced, savy vet (former SB winner), doesn't make a lot of dumb mistakes, will play field position game because most times their D can win those battles
- ok WRs

In many ways this team mirrors the Pats, team that makes the least mistakes will win. This will be a real nice road victory for the Pats when the pull it off).

 

[nukin]

My best friend / Roomate is a vikings fan...

Should make for a fun night.


BTW, OT... what did we get from colts for Vinatieri...? I can't seem to remember and I am to lazy to find it online.

 

[Julius]

I'm sorry for starting this thread just thought this was an interesting match up and wanted to hear peoples thoughts. Judging by the number of responses I assume I'm not the only one excited for this game. Next time I'll be sure to title the thread the "very unofficial whoever vs Pats pre-game thread"

 

[Julius]

Yeah NEM Julius is actually for Julius Adams something old school.

 

[edgecy]

Here comes Romo..

EDIT: And there goes his first INT...

 

[CheerforTom]

BTW, OT... what did we get from colts for Vinatieri...? I can't seem to remember and I am to lazy to find it online.

Unless I've gone crazy, he was a FA...

I don't mean to be a jerk, but I'm surprised at how much respect you guys are giving the Vikes. I don't want to slight them much either, they did just kick the snot out of the Seahawks, but it's just not the Colts we're talking about here. I've never been overly concerned about this game. It could be tough if the Vikes bring their very best A game, but we are talking about the team that lost to the very same Buffalo team we just smashed.

 

[Julius]

..

I don't mean to be a jerk, but I'm surprised at how much respect you guys are giving the Vikes. I don't want to slight them much either, they did just kick the snot out of the Seahawks, but it's just not the Colts we're talking about here. I've never been overly concerned about this game. It could be tough if the Vikes bring their very best A game, but we are talking about the team that lost to the very same Buffalo team we just smashed.

To me what makes the Vikings dangerous on offense is the way Brad Johnson spreads the ball around. For instance his top 6 receivers have between 14-20 catches. That breaks down to three wr and a rb and a TE getting the ball. Brad Johnson is hitting 62% of his passes so this distribution seems to be effective for them. Basically there is no one person on the Vikings receiver core to focus on and game plan againts and that makes them dangerous.
Also Chester Taylor leads the league in rushing with 590 yards and an 4.3 ypc average. So you have to account for that first before focusing on the passing game. Plus their is our old friends Wiggins and Johnson to consider.
On defense they have a very solid front four and are very hard to run againts. This neutralizes one of our strengths on offense. Also their corners are capable of shutting down our receivers especially if the defensive line can apply pressure like Buffalo did. To me their weakness is the linebackers and safeties. The Pats should hit them with screens and try to get Watson open over the middle. If the Vikings don't turn the ball over this will be a tight game. Hopefully BB has a nice game plan.

 

[patsfan13]

The Vikes haven't given up over 17 pts in a game this year. I don't care who they've played, that gets my attention.

Given their success against the run maybe we use the pass to set up the run?

 

[Oswlek]

I think people are going a little overboard on the Vikings love here.

They lost to the Bills.

Carolina, who are terrible offensively without Steve Smith, only lost because of possibly the dumbest turnover all year.

Detroit was smacking them around pretty good at 17-3 in the 4th before John Kitna realized who he was and turned it over twice late in the game.

Washington has proven to be a not-so-great team.

They have played decently against the two best teams they have faced, Chicago and Seattle, so they have that going for them. With Seattle, though, there was the whole "poison pill" issue, so I'm sure that helped psych them up. Plus it was another win against a team missing probably their best player. I think that the high flying Bears are going to prove to be the anomaly, but I can see why people would be impressed with the Chicago game.

edited to add that with the Bears comment I mean to say that Chicago is going to prove to be more like the team that faced Minny than the one that stomped Seattle. Not that is was out of character that Minny played Chicago well.

this trap game stuff is stupid. minnesota is a very good team, built alot like the patriots with beef on the both the offensive lines and defensive lines. brad johnson is somewhat of an old man's brady..,... he's very smart and doesn't lose you many games.

the pats will have big tests on both sides of the lines especially with minnesota's left tack and left guard. Let's hope seymour is in there, if not the pats better plan on playing a 4 man line quite a bit. if seymour is out, hill better be ready to back up green. plus we'll get to see how good mike wright is.

on offense the pats better plan on exploiting the edges, becuase there ain't gonna be much running room up the middle. the no huddle could be key to tired out pat williams.

minnesota is a good team and the pats will have their hands full

I'm not sure why this was directed at me and my post about how NE plays better in a second matchup. I was one of the members saying that it is *not* a trap game. I just feel that Minnesota is a blah team. Not bad, not great; I guess decent is about as flattering as I can get.

However, I do feel that NE will struggle partially because it is away, but mostly because it is their MO to not win by much when facing a team for the first time. It doesn't have to be the first time ever, but the first time that season. Bonus struggling occurs when it is a new coach, QB combo. This is why I feel that it will be a 20-17 game either way.

But make no mistake. Minnesota is a team that NE would then go on to beat 27-6 the second time they faced.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

I think people are going a little overboard on the Vikings love here.

I'm looking forward to seeing Football Outsiders' updated rankings later today to see how much the Seattle win moved them up.

Going into this past week, they had :

the Pats Overall, Offense, Defense ranked 11, 7, 22 respecively.
Minnesota was 19, 22, 10 respectively.

Also Seattle was 16, 14, 15 - very average indeed.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/2006/10/17/ramblings/dvoa-rankings/4409/

 

[Jacky Roberts]

I can't wait to see Maroney and Jackson running on that carpet in the Dome. Minnie's defense is stout, but I think NE's defense vs. Minn's offense will be more stout. I think the Pats win this one 21-13 or so.

I dont care how good Chester Taylor's numbers are, he's still Chester Taylor.