Needs Analysis: Safety

[bakes781]

I have been thinking about the type of Safety the Patriots are looking for.

Are they targetting:
option A - smaller safety with good coverage skills ?
- ability to play Safety and some corner in a pinch
names - Delmas, Johnson, Pegues

option B - bigger, more traditional SS type
- in the box type, potential LB is long yardage situtions
names - Moore, Vaughn

versatile players - play a little bit of both (Chung) <- they more I read about this guy the more I like him, instant quality depth at both Safety spots and special teams contributor from day 1

I think both Delmas and Vaughn provide the flexibity to do either. Delmas is a hitter and Vaughn is faster than his own CB teammate, Alphonso Smith.

 

[DW Toys]

I tend to agree with you assessment on Sanders.. Maybe not to the degree that you say he's a special teams player but my feelings is the Pats will upgrade the position..

The strongest part of Sanders game is his tackling. More times than not, he wraps up the ball carrier and takes them down. BUT on taht note, he just doesn't make plays for you.

& don't worry about half of these guys with 10,000+ posts.. Most of them know very little about the game and just post to defend their weak point of views.. I find to many times these posters are rude and take the discussion personal..

Great post! The more they bully, the less they know.
DW Toys

 

[mayoclinic]

I think both Delmas and Vaughn provide the flexibity to do either. Delmas is a hitter and Vaughn is faster than his own CB teammate, Alphonso Smith.

Add 5-10 lbs. of muscle to Delmas and he's as big or bigger than Troy Polamalu (5'11" 207-212# vs. 5'10" 207#). I don't think anyone has a problem with Polamalu as a SS. Similar styles of play as well. As Bakes said, he's a hitter. I love the quote about him being pissed at the Senior Bowl because of the lack of contact in practice.

 

[DW Toys]

Unlike you, I am in touch with reality. Unlike you, I understand that Sanders is more than just a special teams player. Its why he got 3 million a year to stay with the Patriots. Its highly unlikely that the Pats shelled out 3 million a year for Sanders just to be a special teams player. Unlike you, I saw opposing coaches go deep on the Patriots regardless of who was the lone safety. It didn't matter whether it was Meriweather, Harrison, or Sanders.

As for the "countless posts from other posters," you must be counting each of DW Toys ones separately. Most people accept that Sanders is a starting quality safety, but also know that he could be improved upon. But they also understand that you can only have so many star quality players.



The delusioned always believe that they are the only ones in the land of reality.

Simon, Oh you know this would happen! The more I stay out the more they try to drag me back in.
It's on! Yes bully boy, Sanders is NOT viewed in "awe" with everyone on this forum. He is a JAG and you know it too you sly old fox, but you want to ruffle everybodies feathers...come on cousin, admit it. Sanders is the only S besides Merriweather on the roster and that is because he is breathing.

As I have mentioned this before, the Patriots gave up the most TDs by the pass than any other team in the league.....including the Lions! Ouch! I have heard the excuses, bad CB play, bad D-Line play, Mayo's fault etc.
Most of those TD's were in the middle of the field. You can't have a Safety that runs a 4.8-40 and takes bad angles, back there starting. The scary part is, once they are catching those passes, now you have to tackle them too. Strike two.

I am sure you are on Madden now as we speak, honing your GM skills. Even on Madden, EA Sports has reduced the value or your son James and said "He has not been involved at all in pass coverage". If BB plays Madden, will he'll be surprised. Simon, how will you win with the Pats now when you go over your buddies house for a "sleep over"?

You started this! I am not the only one who can see James Sanders.
DW Toys

 

[DW Toys]

Add 5-10 lbs. of muscle to Delmas and he's as big or bigger than Troy Polamalu (5'11" 207-212# vs. 5'10" 207#). I don't think anyone has a problem with Polamalu as a SS. Similar styles of play as well. As Bakes said, he's a hitter. I love the quote about him being pissed at the Senior Bowl because of the lack of contact in practice.

Excellent post sir.
DW Toys

 

[DaBruinz]

Simon, Oh you know this would happen! The more I stay out the more they try to drag me back in.
It's on! Yes bully boy, Sanders is NOT viewed in "awe" with everyone on this forum. He is a JAG and you know it too you sly old fox, but you want to ruffle everybodies feathers...come on cousin, admit it. Sanders is the only S besides Merriweather on the roster and that is because he is breathing.

As I have mentioned this before, the Patriots gave up the most TDs by the pass than any other team in the league.....including the Lions! Ouch! I have heard the excuses, bad CB play, bad D-Line play, Mayo's fault etc.
Most of those TD's were in the middle of the field. You can't have a Safety that runs a 4.8-40 and takes bad angles, back there starting. The scary part is, once they are catching those passes, now you have to tackle them too. Strike two.

I am sure you are on Madden now as we speak, honing your GM skills. Even on Madden, EA Sports has reduced the value or your son James and said "He has not been involved at all in pass coverage". If BB plays Madden, will he'll be surprised. Simon, how will you win with the Pats now when you go over your buddies house for a "sleep over"?


You started this! I am not the only one who can see James Sanders.
DW Toys

DW -
YOU started this garbage with your BS views on Sanders 2 years ago. So please don't be dumb and try and blame me for your own ignorance.

Yes, you made your BS argument with that wasn't supported by actual facts regarding Sanders. And other people besides myself told you that you didn't know what you were talking about. BOR even told you to basically stfu with your stupid Sanders rants.

As for your other dumb comments, YOU are the Madden expert here. I don't even own a copy of it. Unlike you and Condon, I understand that Sanders IS a starting quality safety. You making garbage up about what I said doesn't change that fact. I've never said he was more than a NFL starting quality safety. He's more than a JAG and YOU need to just finally admit that. The Pats don't pay JAGS $3 million a year.

So, please, DW, why don't you do yourself a favor and stop throwing in your pathetically biased opinion on Sanders. No one listens to it and it doesn't resemble the truth. It will make this board MUCH easier on you.


P.S. Sanders ran a 4.6 - 40, not a 4.8 40.

 

[VJCPatriot]

I think BB recently talked about how important it was for safeties to be able to cover in the NFL. The safety position is evolving in the NFL to where you need guys who can tackle as well as cover. That being said, I still like the idea of paring Meriweather with a guy who has more sand in the pants who won't wear out as fast playing SS. I'm wondering if Patrick Chung, Sean Smith, or William Moore can be that guy. If he can also cover tight ends, then sign me up. And for the very reason I mentioned above, I don't see Roy Williams coming to New England.

 

[alvinnf]

Well Chung has only been playing football for about 7 yrs, and he seems to have made his share of plays in a pass happy conference. On the otherhand Delmas is the little dog that does'nt think or care that he's little. Tough call, alright let's just draft em' both and let them sort it out.....

 

[DW Toys]

DW -
YOU started this garbage with your BS views on Sanders 2 years ago. So please don't be dumb and try and blame me for your own ignorance.

Yes, you made your BS argument with that wasn't supported by actual facts regarding Sanders. And other people besides myself told you that you didn't know what you were talking about. BOR even told you to basically stfu with your stupid Sanders rants.

As for your other dumb comments, YOU are the Madden expert here. I don't even own a copy of it. Unlike you and Condon, I understand that Sanders IS a starting quality safety. You making garbage up about what I said doesn't change that fact. I've never said he was more than a NFL starting quality safety. He's more than a JAG and YOU need to just finally admit that. The Pats don't pay JAGS $3 million a year.

So, please, DW, why don't you do yourself a favor and stop throwing in your pathetically biased opinion on Sanders. No one listens to it and it doesn't resemble the truth. It will make this board MUCH easier on you.


P.S. Sanders ran a 4.6 - 40, not a 4.8 40.

Now little Bruinzy, don't get your panties in a bunch. You dragged me into your contest with another swipe at a poster who had a good point because you act like an anal pore to anyone who does not fall into your line of thinking. You are a pseudo-intellectual and if you don't know what that means, ask mom.

I looked up James "the speed merchant" Sanders 40 times and it is 4.7 or close enough but certainly not a 4.6 you silly heart. Sorry. I had him as way too slow instead of just plain slow. And yes...yes I did make my point. More TD passes than anyone in the NFL in 2008, i.e.we have a problem back there.

I am sorry, I have no idea who the BOR is. Is he a good guy? I didn't ask for this. You dragged me into this one when I did not say a thing cousin.

And no, you said Sanders was a more than an average NFL Safety.

Gee Bruinzy, it appears that a lot of posters listen and agree that Sanders is a great backup or rotation guy, but an upgrade is needed(ouch!).....Wait a minute...is this Mrs. Sanders???

Unfortunate in this economy as it is, would you like a list of JAGS in the NFL getting $3m a year? Want to take a guess? Just look at the signings in FA this year. There are more than a few.
With Love,
DW Toys

 

[cstjohn17]

I have been thinking about the type of Safety the Patriots are looking for.

Are they targetting:
option A - smaller safety with good coverage skills ?
- ability to play Safety and some corner in a pinch
names - Delmas, Johnson, Pegues

option B - bigger, more traditional SS type
- in the box type, potential LB is long yardage situtions
names - Moore, Vaughn

versatile players - play a little bit of both (Chung) <- they more I read about this guy the more I like him, instant quality depth at both Safety spots and special teams contributor from day 1

Looks like option A is off the board with Springs and Bodden having some ability to play FS.

 

[patchick]

Sanders is the only S besides Merriweather on the roster and that is because he is breathing.

If I'm not mistaken, Sanders signed the 2nd-biggest FA contract of all safeties this offseason, while the likes of Sean Jones sat on the shelf moldering. So regardless of what fans think of Sanders, it's pretty clear that the team likes him a lot.

 

[DW Toys]

If I'm not mistaken, Sanders signed the 2nd-biggest FA contract of all safeties this offseason, while the likes of Sean Jones sat on the shelf moldering. So regardless of what fans think of Sanders, it's pretty clear that the team likes him a lot.

No question. Good team guy. Upgradeable?.....Yes.
One caveat. If he was so indispensable to the team, they would have signed him before he left for FA.They could have had Sanders for less money. They restructured Randy before FA as I recall. They had more Safeties visit and either the money wasn't right or the team concept thing wasn't there. So sometimes the devil that you know,... and all that.
We will never know what transpired with any visits. Jones numbers and physical attributes far out weigh Sanders. He might not have BB type intelligence.He might have wanted too much in the future for dollars. If I recall, the Jones money was about the same. The Safety FA ratings by the NFL put Jones ahead but that doesn't mean that Jones or any other Safety or their agent didn't have conversations with the Pats F.O. and were eliminated. It is what it is.
DW Toys

 

[captain stone]

If I'm not mistaken, Sanders signed the 2nd-biggest FA contract of all safeties this offseason, while the likes of Sean Jones sat on the shelf moldering. So regardless of what fans think of Sanders, it's pretty clear that the team likes him a lot.

Then the team is wrong - again.

C'mon, everybody, sing along: Lil' Jimmy is a JAG, e-i-e-i-o...

Good on ya, DW; give 'em hell.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

NFL Blog | Sports News | News for Dallas, Texas | Dallas Morning News

TCU S Hodge a natural pass rusher
6:13 AM Wed, Mar 18, 2009
Rick Gosselin

The franchise players in the NFL are the quarterbacks. The Tom Bradys, Peyton Mannings and Ben Roethlisbergers win championships. So on defense, the No. 1 objective is to get to the quarterback.

That's what makes TCU safety Stephen Hodge such an interesting prospect. No defensive back in this draft gets to the quarterback like Hodge, an All-Mountain West selection. He led the NCAA in sacks among defensive backs with eight in 2007 and added three more in 2008.

"In our defense, I'm the strong safety so I do a lot of blitzing," Hodge said. "I blitz 75-80 percent in each game. I'm used to it. It was just something we do in our defense."

Hodge measures 5-11 1/2 and weighs 234 pounds. Because of that bulk, some NFL teams are looking to move him closer to the offensive backfield, projecting him as an outside linebacker.

"I just want to play in the NFL," Hodge said. "I don't care what position I play."

Rodney Jr.

 

[mayoclinic]

NFL Blog | Sports News | News for Dallas, Texas | Dallas Morning NewsRodney Jr.

You really like the TCU players, don't you? First Phillips, now Hodge. Both are good players and are certainly worth a hard look, but I'm not sure I would anoint anyone as "Rodney Jr." coming out of college.

 

[Seneschal2]

I have been thinking about the type of Safety the Patriots are looking for.

Are they targetting:
option A - smaller safety with good coverage skills ?
- ability to play Safety and some corner in a pinch
names - Delmas, Johnson, Pegues

Looks like option A is off the board with Springs and Bodden having some ability to play FS.

I wouldn't write off the tweener DB just yet:

NFL DRAFT BIBLE - Workout Watch: Pats & Rams Interested In DB

Cincinnati defensive back Brandon Underwood to work out for the New England Patriots...

Underwood has played primarily cornerback at the college level, but is viewed by some as a potential free safety at the next level.

Brandon Underwood, Cincinnati, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com Football

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

You really like the TCU players, don't you? First Phillips, now Hodge. Both are good players and are certainly worth a hard look, but I'm not sure I would anoint anyone as "Rodney Jr." coming out of college.

If you search around a bit in this forum, you'll note I've had Hodge nicknamed Rodney Jr. since the Poinsettia Bowl and his performance against Boise State. He earned that designation by putting on a Rodney-like performance that included QBHs, sacks, run stuffing, big hits, at least one PI, and the ever classic game clinching interception.

I'm late to the Jason Phillips bandwagon, but Hodge has been on my SS/hybrid short list a bit longer.

 

[DW Toys]

Then the team is wrong - again.

C'mon, everybody, sing along: Lil' Jimmy is a JAG, e-i-e-i-o...

Good on ya, DW; give 'em hell.

O.K., I get it......With a missed tackle here and a bad angle there. Here a bad, there a bad, everywhere, plays are o'er his head. Ole little Jimmy could be burned e-i-e-i-o....

DW Toys