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Content Post idle thoughts - the big play edition


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patfanken

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Among the things I discovered watching this game is how my TV can record the games.

I wasn't sure that I would get back in time to see the stat of the game, so I decided to record it. I recently discovered I could do that with my remote. So even while I missed most of the first half I got a chance to watch it after the game as well as go over the plays several times (plus skip all the commercials. ;) It is a little embarrassing to admit to something most of you probably take for granted, but while I think of myself as someone who is computer literate, my cell phone is for taking and receiving calls and changing channels on my remote is high technology. So clearly you CAN teach an old dog new tricks. But lets talk about the game.

General thoughts

There were several Key stat lines that stood out. 1. And the most important was: 4 TO's that resulted in 24 points. Without those TO's this obviously would have been a much different game. So as much as I LOVE the fact that we are now starting to win that key stat, it is something that you can't always count on to save your bacon. Sometimes you don't get the bounce so the fumble gets recovered by the offense. Sometimes the ball isn't under thrown or the tip doesn't go to your guy. 2. 3 TDs in 5 attempts in the red zone. Not great, but SOOOOO much better than last week. To put in perspective I heard a stat during the start of the KC/Bills game which stated KC was 19 out of 23 in the red zone. INSANE numbers. I don't know exactly where we stand in that important stat, BUT I sure its near the bottom of the league....still.

As I watched a game that we were clearly in control of, I also saw how precarious even double digit leads are in this game. The onside kick for example. We were VERY lucky the guy whose feet were out of bounds touched the ball first, because if he hadn't Cleveland would have recovered it. Granted it was correctly called, BUT the Pats 18 point lead that was now 9 would have looked very scary as the momentum had changed drastically.

As an aside: I LOVED how the Browns kicker kicked that ball. Standard protocol has the kicker kick the top of the ball which tends to go end over end and then pop up, which ideally gives the KO team a shot at the ball on the pop up. HOWEVER teams in those situations have "hands" guys on the field to cleanly catch the "pop up" So that why only 1 onside kick has succeeded this season. In this case the Kicker "skittered" the ball so the points of the ball were spinning parallel to the ground making it VERY difficult for the front line to field. None of the Pats front line guys seemed to want to take a stab at it. I'd love to see the Pats use that method when WE are in the position.

FYI - It occurred to me that the Pats have had only 2 home games so far, compared to Miami who has had 4. That will come in handy as we start to get more home games. BTW- I think Miami and Tampa have the built in unfair home field advantage in September. More difficult than the supposed home field advantage that we get in December.

Speaking of home field advantage, half the teams in the league will get an extra home game every year. The Pats get 8 this year, but before you get all pissed and righteous like I did when I noticed the extra away game. Remember the Pat GOT 9 home games last year. So I guess or rather hope that means it will alternate every other year.

I thought Miles Garrett had a Great game. He was impactful with 2 sacks and a forced fumble to go with 5 total tackles. He played in constant pain and was a warrior out there. The Pats, for the most part had great protection for Zappe (2 sacks, 2 QB hits compared with 4 and 8 vs Jacobi) so a great majority of that hard pressure came from Garrett.

3-3 and we are dead last in the AFCE, which will now be known as the AFC BEAST a division we still have to play 5 more times

OFFENSE - General- 304 yds passing was well beyond my expectations, But when I look at the box score the thing that popped out to me was the fact we had FIVE offensive plays that were 25 yds and over. Most drives that are more than 60 yds NEED a 20+ yd play to succeed. Drives that take more than 10 plays are HARD to complete. A penalty, a drop, a play for a loss, are all things that kill long drives. Scoring drives have to have at least one"chunk" play. That may sound strange for a fan of team that PERSONIFIED long slow drives, but its true.

My second general offensive thought was CHRIST there were a lot of offensive penalties I think we had 11, if you don't counts the one we took on purpose on a punt. I blame the Browns' crowd for some of those. They were VERY loud. I'm guessing that the Pats might have been using a silent count, which can be harder with a rookie QB. The Pats had 92 yds in penalties, a number that will usually cause you to lose games. It helped that the Browns had 73 yds. I'm hoping that a home crowd will help eliminate a majority of those mistakes.

QB - My initial impression while I was watching the game live was that Zappe was doing a good job hitting the wide open receivers. When I watched the game again I saw about 5 really good throws into tight windows. I'm thinking about that Parker catch on the sideline. QB's NEED to have receivers who can make that kind of 50-50 ball. Great throw, better catch. The throw that impressed me the most was the TD to Thornton. NOT his first target, he bought time and threw a really tough throw in a tight window to the rookie who was just breaking open. Very important play at a very important time.

Now the elephant in the room becomes now Mac or Bailey, assuming Mac is healthy. I still would rather run with Mac. Bailey is a nice shiny penny that everyone wants, but Mac stood the test time of last season. Again what I mentioned last week about high ankle sprains still stands. Now that we look to have a capable QB to play against a bad Bears team, we can afford to wait if Mac is at all limited in practice this week. We shall see. At least the media will have something to talk about. Let the speculation begin.

OL - The Pats managed 96 yds of rushing this week against a team that had a great deal of trouble stopping the run. If you look quickly at the stats that showed Stevenson with 76 yds on 19 carries for a respectable 4ypc. However if you take away his 31 yd TD run, he only averaged 2.5ypc for his other 18 carries. That's NOT going to be good enough against better defenses. We need more consistent plus yardage on runs and that needs to have better blocking More push up front. The kind of push that we saw on that 8 yd TD run at the end of the game.

All that being said, the Browns were playing 8 man fronts on running downs all game. It looked like 4-4 with cover 3 over the top. That is very hard to run against. They usually wind up with one man being unblocked. When we went heavy they had 9 man fronts. One reason Henry was so wide open on his TD pass.. I would like to see more play action passes, especially with the QB under C and more boots. You HAVE to make defenses pay for running 8 man fronts.

OTOH, the pass protection overall was excellent. 2 sacks and just 2 QB hits on 34 attempts is very good. And on the last sack by Garrett late in the game, I thought Zappe could have avoid it, and he almost did, but he was a bit late stepping up. There must have been VERY good pass blocking on the interior since it seemed Zappe few successful interior pass rushes. Most of the time Zappe always had room to step up. Good on - Strange, Andrews and Owenu.

RB - Stevenson is really good. that outside cut he made on his TD run was Sanders-esque. He turned a 6 yd gain into a 31 yd TD. Even with his 2,5 yd average on the rest of his runs, he didn't miss any opportunities and got what was there every time. Nice to see Strong and Harris get bloodied. We really need one or the other to be at least somewhat productive until DHarris comes back.

TE's - That 50 yd run by Smith was what we hoped would be a regular happening when he was signed. Henry was again what we saw last season, with 4 catches. He also had the most targets with 7. So we got 124 yds from the 2 TE's today. Smith with only 2 targets needs to see the ball more. Maybe some screens or slants

WR's - I thought this was going to be a big game for Bourne before he got hurt. I hope it isn't long term. Otherwise the WR's performed admirably with Parker showing he can make the tough catch. I'd like to see him become more of a factor in the red zone. He, Smith and Henry SHOULD be TD machines in the red zone.. We shall see if that continues to improve. I was happy to see 3 guys with catches over 25 yds. I thought the WR corps was going to be more than able this year. Thornton got a lot of run this game. Interesting to see him be used NOT as a deep threat, but more of a precision route runner. I'm very happy to see what he's done thus far, but I hope next week see get to see some of that explosive speed out of him, which might answer the question, "Does he have explosive speed?"

DEFENSE- Well I guess we should be bemoaning the defense because they finally gave up a TD. :rolleyes: breaking a 7 quarter streak of not allowing one. But the most important impression I got this week was just how TIGHT the secondary was in their coverage ALL game. Again even when a Browns receiver caught the ball they were tightly covered and had to make great catches and great throws to make them. This was especially visible on their TD drive, where a 3rd and long play vs Mjones was cover so well I expected a pick. He just slightly misjudged the ball and over ran it by a step. This kid is good enough to run with ANYONE, my only fear is his height and when he has to run against a bigger receiver like that play vs Cooper. Same went for theTD. Bryant was RIGHT in position and the ball went to the ONLY spot it could, and the receiver did a great job of getting his feet inbounds. You don't blame your guys, you just have to tip your cap.



Front 7- DL and LB's played very tough against the best run game in the league. Out of context the stats will look better than they really were. The Pats only allowed 70 total yds rushing against a team that was averaging over TWICE that per game. Here's were the context comes in. Chubb DID average 4.7 ypc but his impact was almost non-existent because he only got just 12 carries because the Browns got behind by over 2 TD by the end of the 3rd quarter, to the point were Chubb became a non-factor. It really helps your run game when a great run team only runs it 18 times all game.



Judon didn't have a sack, but I thought he played a very impactful game putting pressure on Brissett and a rock in the run game. 5 games in and he's still going strong.



We really need to do a reset on our expectations concerning Detrick Wise. He has been just fantastic this year. He has gone from the guy who was a rotational DLman who you hoped would kill you when he was in their. After today he has 5 sacks matching his high he had in his rookie year. I'll bet that no one has played more snaps on the DL than Wise and I'll bet its by a lot. STILL his motor doesn't seem to run down. The fact I love about him is that most of his pressures come from what I call 2nd effort rushes. Few great moves, or stunts designed to free him, but most for just working hard and out working the OLman after the initial contact. The guy just doesn't give up



A nice word here for Godcheaux - He got his first sack of the year and it was HIS pressure and hand in Brissett's face that cause the fumble when Jacobi tried to reset his passing angle to avoid having Devon block the pass. He was also one of the guys who stuffed Brissett on that QB sneak.



CDavis not only had a fumble recovery he also got to show us the best big play dance I've seen in a long while. I needed to see that, especially after seeing that HORRIBLE TD dance, Thornton put us through. Too long Tyquan and kind of icky.



VERY worried about Barmore's knee. Not the fact that he hurt it, but the fact it was the one that's been bothering him most of the season. Maybe THAT's why he's been less explosive so far this season. Now I read a report that he was on the field in his uniform in the 2nd half, BUT......



I'll be interested in seeing how many snaps Sam Roberts got. I thought I saw Daniel Ekuele on the field a lot too. I thought Daniel made a couple of decent rushes to flush Brissett and had 3 tackles including one for a loss. Be interesting to see the snap chart list when it comes out. We may have to see more of these guys if Barmore and Guy are out for the next few weeks.



DB's - Again my constant impression when the other team throws the ball is there is CONSISTENTLY close coverage on most every pass, AND when a pass is caught the YAC is hard to get. It seems all our DB's are also excellent tacklers. The Pats seemed to use a LOT of man coverages, especially underneath to make the short throws Jacobi likes to throw harder to make. Both our Jones seem to be glued to their men, Cooper who all the WR nerds would be drooling over as "a true #1 receiver" had just 4 catches on TWELVE targets for just 44 yds and that GREAT catch for their TD on 4th down



I also liked the fact that while I thought Mills got the calla majority of the time with Cooper. Steve/Jerad weren't afraid to put J Jones MJones or MBryant on him as well. While I'm sure there will be the chorus that will howl about MBryant "giving up" the TD; I thought he had pretty good coverage on the play. I have a soft spot for him, because I see a bit of myself in him. I played just one year as DB, actually my last year playing. I was NOT a good pass defender, but not because I couldn't run with the guy I was supposed to cover (mostly TE's and RB's) but because I didn't have the elite athleticism to make the minor adjustments in mid-air to put myself in the BEST position to defend the pass. Unfortunately for me a lot of the RB's and TE's DID have that ability. So basically I'd be right there, they'd jump up, I'd jump up, they'd catch the ball and I'd tackle them. Now Miles Bryant is WAY better athlete than I am, but when I saw him on that TD play I saw myself. Right THERE to make a play, but not quite able to get my body into a position to actually do it. Now Bryant has time to get better at it, because even if the chorus doesn't believe it I on the other hand was in a classroom the next week. ;) He's better this year than last year
 
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patfanken

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I played just one year as DB, actually my last year playing. I was NOT a good pass defender, but not because I couldn't run with the guy I was supposed to cover (mostly TE's and RB's) but because I didn't have the elite athleticism to make the minor adjustments in mid-air to put myself in the BEST position to defend the pass. Unfortunately for me a lot of the RB's and TE's DID have that ability. So basically I'd be right there, they'd jump up, I'd jump up, they'd catch the ball and I'd tackle them. Now Miles Bryant is WAY better athlete than I was, but when I saw him on that TD play I saw myself. Right THERE to make a play, but not quite able to get my body into a position to actually do it. Now Bryant has time to get better at it, because even if the chorus doesn't believe it I on the other hand was in a classroom teaching 8th graders history the next week. ;) btw He's better this year than last year

OK, when I start to ramble like this I know it's time to stop. Just a few more General Comments - Kind of like Peter King's 10 things I think.

I think the offensive coaching is starting in click. I know the penalties were troubling and NEED to get better. Having a few home games will help. That was a tough environment today. Zappe was still going to Bill on time outs. Seen sitting with Joe Judge going over stuff on the computer, And Matt calling in the plays. But most importantly the plays themselves seem to get more people open more often than earlier in the season. Not as many tight window throws. I wasn't thrilled by the results of the run game today, but I liked the construction of the plays. There just has to be slightly better execution to make 1 yd gains into 3 yd gains. Matt seems to be settling in. As strange as it looked the overall operation looked good.

I think the same can be said about defensive side as well. Steve/Jerad seem to be putting their players in good positions especially in the secondary. Maybe we should be looking at Mike Pelligrino (CB's) and Brian Bellichick (S's) for their good work with a pretty young Secondary, Especially Pelligrino who is working with 2 rookies who are getting more and more playing time AND playing well.

I think the AFCE is pretty impressive. The Jets have been pretty impressive. They have also creating a lot of TO's. Today they had a blocked kick for a TD. Tell the Joker that it looks like I'll be back to full HATE mode by the time the Jets game comes around. Bills were impressive to day with a big win over KC in KC. MIami out gained the Vikes almost 2 to 1 (258-463) but got beat by 8. The reason, 3 Dolphin TO's

think Bill made a great call not to challenge the Pick m\by MJones. If he won that challenge the Pats would have gotten the ball on the 18 yd line. Instead he forced the Browns to punt and after a 15 yd return by the said MJones, we got the ball at the 38. BTW I thought it WAS a pick. It was close but I thought the knee was in as well. Jones has become a real 2 way threat getting us that extra first down with 10 or rmore yds on just about every return and he seems more and more comfortable every game. He's also playing pretty good CB as well.

I think I say it every week, but it can't be repeated too much. Win the TO battle, Win the game. I think with this 4-1 win, we are finally just getting into the plus side for the year. In every highlight that I happened to see there was a big TO shown by the winning team.

OK, I'm done. Enjoy I hope. Respond a lot, and it is on to the Bears. It will be kind of fitting if Bill passes Halas against his beloved Bears. Too late to edit this, I'll do it tomorrow and this will all make more sense.
 
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borg

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Great job PFK, your insights are most appreciated
I live out of market and I refused to go to the local Buffalo Wild Wings where mutants congregate and the food sux beyond description...so all I had yesterday was ESPN gamecast which offers no context and Red Zone which gave the Pats game little attention, no doubt to spite me.

My totally uninformed 2 cents...

Given all the line of scrimmage penalties, especially early on, my initial thought was Zappe hasn't yet taken charge of the huddle or while he's under center barking out whatever QBs bark out.
More likely, the usual culprits (Wynn & Brown) simply have concentration issues

Given how the awful Browns run defense tightened things up vs NE, it appears their game plan was Belichickian...."Clog the run and force the 3rd string QB to make some plays"

During BB's post game presser, he emphasized the team's success playing complimentary football...ie...defense giving the offense shorter fields, pinning the Browns O back and forcing Cleveland to go 75-80 yds, etc
Old school Field Position football on the day BB ties George Halas' win total.....Bill had to feel a bit nostalgic.

Note: BB also intentionally (IMO) underplayed Zappe's role today....which to this tealeaf reader can only mean Zappe will be soon be parked on the bench. Guess BB didn't want to make Mac sad :cool:
Hope I'm wrong.
#LetZappeCook

Question for the board:
What website offers the most extensive game highlights?
Sportscenter's 3 highlights just don't cut it

OT: Is it wrong for me to state the obvious....
Gisele has Yoko'd again
First NE, now Tampa
 
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Rob0729

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OK, when I start to ramble like this I know it's time to stop. Just a few more General Comments - Kind of like Peter King's 10 things I think.



I think the offensive coaching is starting in click. I know the penalties were troubling and NEED to get better. Having a few home games will help. That was a tough environment today. Zappe was still going to Bill on time outs. Seen sitting with Joe Judge going over stuff on the computer, And Matt calling in the plays. But most importantly the plays themselves seem to get more people open more often than earlier in the season. Not as many tight window throws. I wasn't thrill by the results of the run game today, but I liked the construction of the plays. There just has to be slightly better execution to make 1 yd gains into 3 yd gains. Matt seems to be settling in.



I think the same can be said about defensive side as well. Steve/Jerad seem to be putting their players in good positions especially in the secondary. Maybe we should be looking at Mike Pelligrino (CB's) and Brian Bellichick (S's) for their good work with a pretty young Secondary, Especially Pelligrino who is working with 2 rookies who are getting more and more playing time AND playing well.



I think the AFCE is pretty impressive. The Jets have been pretty impressive. They have also creating a lot of TO's. Today they had a blocked kick for a TD. Tell the Joker that it looks like I'll be back to full HATE mode by the time the Jets game comes around. Bills were impressive to day with a big win over KC in KC. MIami out gained the Vikes almost 2 to 1 (258-463) but beat them by 8. The reason, 3 Dolphin TO's


think Bill made a great call not to challenge the Pick m\by MJones. If he won that challenge the Pats would have gotten the ball on the 18 yd line. Instead he forced the Browns to punt and after a 15 yd return by the said MJones, we got the ball at the 38. BTW I thought it WAS a pick. It was close but I thought the knee was in as well. Jones has become a real 2 way threat getting us 10 yds on just about every return and he seems more and more comfortable every game. He's also playing pretty good CB as well.



I think I say it every week, but it can't be repeated too much. Win the TO battle, Win the game. I think with this 4-1 win, we are finally just getting into the plus side for the year. In every highlight that I happened to see their was a big TO shown by the winning team.

OK, I'm done. Enjoy I hope. Respond a lot, and it on to the Bears. It will be kind of fitting if Bill passes Hallas against his beloved Bears. Too late to edit this, I'll do it tomorrow and this will all make more sense.

Sorry Ken, I usually love your analysis, but now I am totally questioning your analysis abilities when you emulate Peter King. :)
 
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Rob0729

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As a long time Deatrich Wise critic, I apologize. He has been effective this year.

Other than Judon, you can actually make the case for he may be the best player on defense this year. I don't know if I would, but he is definitely up there.
 

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QB - My initial impression while I was watching the game live was that Zappe was doing a good job hitting the wide open receivers. When I watched the game again I saw about 5 really good throws into tight windows. I'm thinking about that Parker catch on the sideline. QB's NEED to have receivers who can make that kind of 50-50 ball. Great throw, better catch. The throw that impressed me the most was the TD to Thornton. NOT his first target, he bought time and threw a really tough throw in a tight window to the rookie who was just breaking open. Very important play at a very important time.

Now the elephant in the room becomes now Mac or Bailey, assuming Mac is healthy. I still would rather run with Mac. Bailey is a nice shiny penny that everyone wants, but Mac stood the test time of last season. Again what I mentioned last week about high ankle sprains still stands. Now that we look to have a capable QB to play against a bad Bears team, we can afford to wait if Mac is at all limited in practice this week. We shall see. At least the media will have something to talk about. Let the speculation begin.
About that elephant, when Mac was first injured and diagnosed with a high ankle sprain I hoped the team would put him on IR. Two reasons we would get to see what we had for backups either Hoyer or Zappe, but the most important we wouldn't rush Mac back.

I just want the best quarterback out there, but not being on IR he may rush back and both play poorly and or reinjure himself then we won't know who is the best of the two. We may go on preconceived notions.

I really am enjoying the Zappe era, but who knows what Mac has in store I don't think any of us can truly say at this time. I just want the best qb out there because that improves the team's chances of winning. Just my thoughts.

Always enjoy your insights when you have a chance to post them one of the reasons I come to the forum after every game. Thank you for taking the time to do that.
 

patfanken

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About that elephant, when Mac was first injured and diagnosed with a high ankle sprain I hoped the team would put him on IR. Two reasons we would get to see what we had for backups either Hoyer or Zappe, but the most important we wouldn't rush Mac back.

I just want the best quarterback out there, but not being on IR he may rush back and both play poorly and or reinjure himself then we won't know who is the best of the two. We may go on preconceived notions.

I really am enjoying the Zappe era, but who knows what Mac has in store I don't think any of us can truly say at this time. I just want the best qb out there because that improves the team's chances of winning. Just my thoughts.

Always enjoy your insights when you have a chance to post them one of the reasons I come to the forum after every game. Thank you for taking the time to do that.
I was just thinking about that. I'm just starting to worry about how Mac will be after not playing 4 games. The schedule starts to toughen up after the Bears game With the resurgent Jets and the resurgent Colts (Ryan threw for 385 in yesterday's win) for our next 3 games, I'd kind of like to see Mac get some snaps next week. In an ideal world, Mac would get the start next week. We score on our first 2 drives, get a lead and Zappe plays the rest of the game. But that kind of fantasy isn't going to happen. Wednesday will be an interesting day,
 

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Sorry Ken, I usually love your analysis, but now I am totally questioning your analysis abilities when you emulate Peter King. :)
But...where was the King-like poetic waxing about his favorite hoppy pilsner or his go-to morning gluten-free medium Italian roast while perusing the Sunday NY Times for the most current woke jibberish.

Come on PFKing
 

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I was just thinking about that. I'm just starting to worry about how Mac will be after not playing 4 games. The schedule starts to toughen up after the Bears game With the resurgent Jets and the resurgent Colts (Ryan threw for 385 in yesterday's win) for our next 3 games, I'd kind of like to see Mac get some snaps next week. In an ideal world, Mac would get the start next week. We score on our first 2 drives, get a lead and Zappe plays the rest of the game. But that kind of fantasy isn't going to happen. Wednesday will be an interesting day,
I don't want him playing until his ankle is absolutely 100 percent. He had enough trouble escaping the rush when he was healthy.
 

patfanken

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Another thing I wanted to write about but forgot.

I saw a highlight yesterday that had me throwing stuff at the TV. It was a clip of another great run by Lamar Jackson. It was a designed run/pitch option. On the play he ducks inside a defender who looked like he was caught between defending the run or the Pitch and Jackson cuts inside him and has a free run into the 2nd level where he does his thing for a long gain.

Well before my head exploded, my first thought was WTF didn't the defender just cold **** Jackson while he had the chance and let the other 10 defenders play the pitch. Not only can bad things happen when you pitch the ball (just as Josh Allen yesterday) no one else on the ravens is half the threat of Jackson with the ball in his hands in the open field. Remember this wasn't a defender at the end of the line who tried to play both and got neither, Jackson's romp was up the middle.

WHEN are teams going to get it. If you just hit the runner (Jackson) HARD every chance you get, you will force the Ravens to stop running that play since eventually they will get the kid killed.
 

patfanken

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But...where was the King-like poetic waxing about his favorite hoppy pilsner or his go-to morning gluten-free medium Italian roast while perusing the Sunday NY Times for the most current woke jibberish.

Come on PFKing
Well I hope MY "things I think" wasn't Jibberish. ;)

BTW. entirely OT. GOD! where did you find that hallelujah clip on the Easterby thread. That was the worst rendition of one of my favorite songs I've ever heard. You could have found a DOZEN better ones. C'mon man.
 

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I was just thinking about that. I'm just starting to worry about how Mac will be after not playing 4 games. The schedule starts to toughen up after the Bears game With the resurgent Jets and the resurgent Colts (Ryan threw for 385 in yesterday's win) for our next 3 games, I'd kind of like to see Mac get some snaps next week. In an ideal world, Mac would get the start next week. We score on our first 2 drives, get a lead and Zappe plays the rest of the game. But that kind of fantasy isn't going to happen. Wednesday will be an interesting day,
Something else to worry there is I'm hearing from unreliable sources aka talk radio that Mac is still not moving well. This really has me worried he will try to rush back worrying about his job and then things can really go downhill.
 

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Among the things I discovered watching this game is how my TV can record the games.

I wasn't sure that I would get back in time to see the stat of the game, so I decided to record it. I recently discovered I could do that with my remote. So even while I missed most of the first half I got a chance to watch it after the game as well as go over the plays several times (plus skip all the commercials. ;) It is a little embarrassing to admit to something most of you probably take for granted, but while I think of myself as someone who is computer literate, my cell phone is for taking and receiving calls and changing channels on my remote is high technology. So clearly you CAN teach an old dog new tricks. But lets talk about the game.

General thoughts

There were several Key stat lines that stood out. 1. And the most important was: 4 TO's that resulted in 24 points. Without those TO's this obviously would have been a much different game. So as much as I LOVE the fact that we are now starting to win that key stat, it is something that you can't always count on to save your bacon. Sometimes you don't get the bounce so the fumble gets recovered by the offense. Sometimes the ball isn't under thrown or the tip doesn't go to your guy. 2. 3 TDs in 5 attempts in the red zone. Not great, but SOOOOO much better than last week. To put in perspective I heard a stat during the start of the KC/Bills game which stated KC was 19 out of 23 in the red zone. INSANE numbers. I don't know exactly where we stand in that important stat, BUT I sure its near the bottom of the league....still.

As I watched a game that we were clearly in control of, I also saw how precarious even double digit leads are in this game. The onside kick for example. We were VERY lucky the guy whose feet were out of bounds touched the ball first, because if he hadn't Cleveland would have recovered it. Granted it was correctly called, BUT the Pats 18 point lead that was now 9 would have looked very scary as the momentum had changed drastically.

As an aside: I LOVED how the Browns kicker kicked that ball. Standard protocol has the kicker kick the top of the ball which tends to go end over end and then pop up, which ideally gives the KO team a shot at the ball on the pop up. HOWEVER teams in those situations have "hands" guys on the field to cleanly catch the "pop up" So that why only 1 onside kick has succeeded this season. In this case the Kicker "skittered" the ball so the points of the ball were spinning parallel to the ground making it VERY difficult for the front line to field. None of the Pats front line guys seemed to want to take a stab at it. I'd love to see the Pats use that method when WE are in the position.

FYI - It occurred to me that the Pats have had only 2 home games so far, compared to Miami who has had 4. That will come in handy as we start to get more home games. BTW- I think Miami and Tampa have the built in unfair home field advantage in September. More difficult than the supposed home field advantage that we get in December.

Speaking of home field advantage, half the teams in the league will get an extra home game every year. The Pats get 8 this year, but before you get all pissed and righteous like I did when I noticed the extra away game. Remember the Pat GOT 9 home games last year. So I guess or rather hope that means it will alternate every other year.

I thought Miles Garrett had a Great game. He was impactful with 2 sacks and a forced fumble to go with 5 total tackles. He played in constant pain and was a warrior out there. The Pats, for the most part had great protection for Zappe (2 sacks, 2 QB hits compared with 4 and 8 vs Jacobi) so a great majority of that hard pressure came from Garrett.

3-3 and we are dead last in the AFCE, which will now be known as the AFC BEAST a division we still have to play 5 more times

OFFENSE - General- 304 yds passing was well beyond my expectations, But when I look at the box score the thing that popped out to me was the fact we had FIVE offensive plays that were 25 yds and over. Most drives that are more than 60 yds NEED a 20+ yd play to succeed. Drives that take more than 10 plays are HARD to complete. A penalty, a drop, a play for a loss, are all things that kill long drives. Scoring drives have to have at least one"chunk" play. That may sound strange for a fan of team that PERSONIFIED long slow drives, but its true.

My second general offensive thought was CHRIST there were a lot of offensive penalties I think we had 11, if you don't counts the one we took on purpose on a punt. I blame the Browns' crowd for some of those. They were VERY loud. I'm guessing that the Pats might have been using a silent count, which can be harder with a rookie QB. The Pats had 92 yds in penalties, a number that will usually cause you to lose games. It helped that the Browns had 73 yds. I'm hoping that a home crowd will help eliminate a majority of those mistakes.

QB - My initial impression while I was watching the game live was that Zappe was doing a good job hitting the wide open receivers. When I watched the game again I saw about 5 really good throws into tight windows. I'm thinking about that Parker catch on the sideline. QB's NEED to have receivers who can make that kind of 50-50 ball. Great throw, better catch. The throw that impressed me the most was the TD to Thornton. NOT his first target, he bought time and threw a really tough throw in a tight window to the rookie who was just breaking open. Very important play at a very important time.

Now the elephant in the room becomes now Mac or Bailey, assuming Mac is healthy. I still would rather run with Mac. Bailey is a nice shiny penny that everyone wants, but Mac stood the test time of last season. Again what I mentioned last week about high ankle sprains still stands. Now that we look to have a capable QB to play against a bad Bears team, we can afford to wait if Mac is at all limited in practice this week. We shall see. At least the media will have something to talk about. Let the speculation begin.

OL - The Pats managed 96 yds of rushing this week against a team that had a great deal of trouble stopping the run. If you look quickly at the stats that showed Stevenson with 76 yds on 19 carries for a respectable 4ypc. However if you take away his 31 yd TD run, he only averaged 2.5ypc for his other 18 carries. That's NOT going to be good enough against better defenses. We need more consistent plus yardage on runs and that needs to have better blocking More push up front. The kind of push that we saw on that 8 yd TD run at the end of the game.

All that being said, the Browns were playing 8 man fronts on running downs all game. It looked like 4-4 with cover 3 over the top. That is very hard to run against. They usually wind up with one man being unblocked. When we went heavy they had 9 man fronts. One reason Henry was so wide open on his TD pass.. I would like to see more play action passes, especially with the QB under C and more boots. You HAVE to make defenses pay for running 8 man fronts.

OTOH, the pass protection overall was excellent. 2 sacks and just 2 QB hits on 34 attempts is very good. And on the last sack by Garrett late in the game, I thought Zappe could have avoid it, and he almost did, but he was a bit late stepping up. There must have been VERY good pass blocking on the interior since it seemed Zappe few successful interior pass rushes. Most of the time Zappe always had room to step up. Good on - Strange, Andrews and Owenu.

RB - Stevenson is really good. that outside cut he made on his TD run was Sanders-esque. He turned a 6 yd gain into a 31 yd TD. Even with his 2,5 yd average on the rest of his runs, he didn't miss any opportunities and got what was there every time. Nice to see Strong and Harris get bloodied. We really need one or the other to be at least somewhat productive until DHarris comes back.

TE's - That 50 yd run by Smith was what we hoped would be a regular happening when he was signed. Henry was again what we saw last season, with 4 catches. He also had the most targets with 7. So we got 124 yds from the 2 TE's today. Smith with only 2 targets needs to see the ball more. Maybe some screens or slants

WR's - I thought this was going to be a big game for Bourne before he got hurt. I hope it isn't long term. Otherwise the WR's performed admirably with Parker showing he can make the tough catch. I'd like to see him become more of a factor in the red zone. He, Smith and Henry SHOULD be TD machines in the red zone.. We shall see if that continues to improve. I was happy to see 3 guys with catches over 25 yds. I thought the WR corps was going to be more than able this year. Thornton got a lot of run this game. Interesting to see him be used NOT as a deep threat, but more of a precision route runner. I'm very happy to see what he's done thus far, but I hope next week see get to see some of that explosive speed out of him, which might answer the question, "Does he have explosive speed?"

DEFENSE- Well I guess we should be bemoaning the defense because they finally gave up a TD. :rolleyes: breaking a 7 quarter streak of not allowing one. But the most important impression I got this week was just how TIGHT the secondary was in their coverage ALL game. Again even when a Browns receiver caught the ball they were tightly covered and had to make great catches and great throws to make them. This was especially visible on their TD drive, where a 3rd and long play vs Mjones was cover so well I expected a pick. He just slightly misjudged the ball and over ran it by a step. This kid is good enough to run with ANYONE, my only fear is his height and when he has to run against a bigger receiver like that play vs Cooper. Same went for theTD. Bryant was RIGHT in position and the ball went to the ONLY spot it could, and the receiver did a great job of getting his feet inbounds. You don't blame your guys, you just have to tip your cap.



Front 7- DL and LB's played very tough against the best run game in the league. Out of context the stats will look better than they really were. The Pats only allowed 70 total yds rushing against a team that was averaging over TWICE that per game. Here's were the context comes in. Chubb DID average 4.7 ypc but his impact was almost non-existent because he only got just 12 carries because the Browns got behind by over 2 TD by the end of the 3rd quarter, to the point were Chubb became a non-factor. It really helps your run game when a great run team only runs it 18 times all game.



Judon didn't have a sack, but I thought he played a very impactful game putting pressure on Brissett and a rock in the run game. 5 games in and he's still going strong.



We really need to do a reset on our expectations concerning Detrick Wise. He has been just fantastic this year. He has gone from the guy who was a rotational DLman who you hoped would kill you when he was in their. After today he has 5 sacks matching his high he had in his rookie year. I'll bet that no one has played more snaps on the DL than Wise and I'll bet its by a lot. STILL his motor doesn't seem to run down. The fact I love about him is that most of his pressures come from what I call 2nd effort rushes. Few great moves, or stunts designed to free him, but most for just working hard and out working the OLman after the initial contact. The guy just doesn't give up



A nice word here for Godcheaux - He got his first sack of the year and it was HIS pressure and hand in Brissett's face that cause the fumble when Jacobi tried to reset his passing angle to avoid having Devon block the pass. He was also one of the guys who stuffed Brissett on that QB sneak.



CDavis not only had a fumble recovery he also got to show us the best big play dance I've seen in a long while. I needed to see that, especially after seeing that HORRIBLE TD dance, Thornton put us through. Too long Tyquan and kind of icky.



VERY worried about Barmore's knee. Not the fact that he hurt it, but the fact it was the one that's been bothering him most of the season. Maybe THAT's why he's been less explosive so far this season. Now I read a report that he was on the field in his uniform in the 2nd half, BUT......



I'll be interested in seeing how many snaps Sam Roberts got. I thought I saw Daniel Ekuele on the field a lot too. I thought Daniel made a couple of decent rushes to flush Brissett and had 3 tackles including one for a loss. Be interesting to see the snap chart list when it comes out. We may have to see more of these guys if Barmore and Guy are out for the next few weeks.



DB's - Again my constant impression when the other team throws the ball is there is CONSISTENTLY close coverage on most every pass, AND when a pass is caught the YAC is hard to get. It seems all our DB's are also excellent tacklers. The Pats seemed to use a LOT of man coverages, especially underneath to make the short throws Jacobi likes to throw harder to make. Both our Jones seem to be glued to their men, Cooper who all the WR nerds would be drooling over as "a true #1 receiver" had just 4 catches on TWELVE targets for just 44 yds and that GREAT catch for their TD on 4th down



I also liked the fact that while I thought Mills got the calla majority of the time with Cooper. Steve/Jerad weren't afraid to put J Jones MJones or MBryant on him as well. While I'm sure there will be the chorus that will howl about MBryant "giving up" the TD; I thought he had pretty good coverage on the play. I have a soft spot for him, because I see a bit of myself in him. I played just one year as DB, actually my last year playing. I was NOT a good pass defender, but not because I couldn't run with the guy I was supposed to cover (mostly TE's and RB's) but because I didn't have the elite athleticism to make the minor adjustments in mid-air to put myself in the BEST position to defend the pass. Unfortunately for me a lot of the RB's and TE's DID have that ability. So basically I'd be right there, they'd jump up, I'd jump up, they'd catch the ball and I'd tackle them. Now Miles Bryant is WAY better athlete than I am, but when I saw him on that TD play I saw myself. Right THERE to make a play, but not quite able to get my body into a position to actually do it. Now Bryant has time to get better at it, because even if the chorus doesn't believe it I on the other hand was in a classroom the next week. ;) He's better this year than last year
Seeing Bryant play also reminds me of myself and why I never made it to the nfl
 

borg

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Well I hope MY "things I think" wasn't Jibberish. ;)

BTW. entirely OT. GOD! where did you find that hallelujah clip on the Easterby thread. That was the worst rendition of one of my favorite songs I've ever heard. You could have found a DOZEN better ones. C'mon man.
This one goes out to PFK .....
plus a haunting bonus cover song



 

patfanken

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This one goes out to PFK .....
plus a haunting bonus cover song




Nothing beats Leonard Cohen's but this was a LOT better than the insult you posted earlier. As for the Sounds of Silence bonus, it was chilling. A great version that was also matched by the visuals. Thanks a lot.
 

rochrist

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Something else to worry there is I'm hearing from unreliable sources aka talk radio that Mac is still not moving well. This really has me worried he will try to rush back worrying about his job and then things can really go downhill.
Well, he can't play if they don't LET him play, and they shouldn't until he's 100 PERCENT. Not 90. Not 95.
 

AQPE

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My biggest worry with Mac now is about what’s between his ears and not his ankle or his arm. He was not processing nearly as well as I was thinking/hoping he would for Year 2. I get that based on how his season ended last year he needed to be more aggressive but from my perspective he was overdoing it, and neither.his OL nor his “weapons” (other than Meyers I guess) were doing much to help. I like Mac but don’t think he has the talent to put the team on his back and carry them to wins at this point. That doesn't mean he is a lost cause, he is still a work in progress and when his teammates aren’t upping their games enough his coaches need to do so.
 

patfanken

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My biggest worry with Mac now is about what’s between his ears and not his ankle or his arm. He was not processing nearly as well as I was thinking/hoping he would for Year 2. I get that based on how his season ended last year he needed to be more aggressive but from my perspective he was overdoing it, and neither.his OL nor his “weapons” (other than Meyers I guess) were doing much to help. I like Mac but don’t think he has the talent to put the team on his back and carry them to wins at this point. That doesn't mean he is a lost cause, he is still a work in progress and when his teammates aren’t upping their games enough his coaches need to do so.
You are correct in your thinking. We ALL expected this great 2nd year leap from Mac. But remember he got hit with a number of things that might have held him back.

After being cocooned for a year under Josh, I imagine it was an abrupt change in the coaching staff with so many coaches he had never worked with. Only Troy, Billy Yates and Nick Calley had been here before. Mac had NEVER worked with Bill and only peripherally with Troy and Calley. Now Matt Joe and Bill were is primary coaches. Very different when in your only year in the offense you had just one voice in your ear.

To my mind the whole "simplification" of the offense was a non-factor. I think that was just all about changing a language that had evolved into something very complex over 20 years of changes and additions. Semantics are critical to the game of football. The ability of being able to tell a LOT of information in the fewest amount of words can make or break game. Miscommunication is the biggest excuse for mistakes.
So the Pats. in the off season worked very hard to make it easier for everyone to be able to talk football to each other. But any changes, even ones that make things easier long term, take time to be absorbed by everyone who had been doing it differently before.

These and the fact that they had only 2 take aways over those first 3 games hurt their chances. Of course on our side there were 5 picks and 4 fumbles that hurt our chances of winning . Mac, I believe was trying to do too much and he made 4 really bad throw on those picks.. IIRC one was a deflected ball off of a receiver into the hands of the DB. btw- I can remember a few FIVE pick games by TB over the years. They happen. All that matters is can they learn from those mistakes and get better. Mac didn't have that chance after the Ravens game.

Anyhow. as I wrote in my other thread the 8 TO's as well as the 6 4th down stops, AND playing against to of the worst defenses in the game CAN make a QB's job a lot easier. I hope they don't play Mac until he is fully healthy (maybe next week, maybe after the bye. They have the luxury of having a seemingly capable back up.
 

AQPE

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You are correct in your thinking. We ALL expected this great 2nd year leap from Mac. But remember he got hit with a number of things that might have held him back.

After being cocooned for a year under Josh, I imagine it was an abrupt change in the coaching staff with so many coaches he had never worked with. Only Troy, Billy Yates and Nick Calley had been here before. Mac had NEVER worked with Bill and only peripherally with Troy and Calley. Now Matt Joe and Bill were is primary coaches. Very different when in your only year in the offense you had just one voice in your ear.

To my mind the whole "simplification" of the offense was a non-factor. I think that was just all about changing a language that had evolved into something very complex over 20 years of changes and additions. Semantics are critical to the game of football. The ability of being able to tell a LOT of information in the fewest amount of words can make or break game. Miscommunication is the biggest excuse for mistakes.
So the Pats. in the off season worked very hard to make it easier for everyone to be able to talk football to each other. But any changes, even ones that make things easier long term, take time to be absorbed by everyone who had been doing it differently before.

These and the fact that they had only 2 take aways over those first 3 games hurt their chances. Of course on our side there were 5 picks and 4 fumbles that hurt our chances of winning . Mac, I believe was trying to do too much and he made 4 really bad throw on those picks.. IIRC one was a deflected ball off of a receiver into the hands of the DB. btw- I can remember a few FIVE pick games by TB over the years. They happen. All that matters is can they learn from those mistakes and get better. Mac didn't have that chance after the Ravens game.

Anyhow. as I wrote in my other thread the 8 TO's as well as the 6 4th down stops, AND playing against to of the worst defenses in the game CAN make a QB's job a lot easier. I hope they don't play Mac until he is fully healthy (maybe next week, maybe after the bye. They have the luxury of having a seemingly capable back up.

Great insight as always PFK, thanks for the reply
 


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