Green, Banta Cain return

[Mack Herron]

Extra Points - New England Patriots News and Analysis - Boston.com

Good for pass rush. Also Morris is practicing.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Yeah, good, that's huge. Only Taylor, Ninko and Neal are out - hopefully Neal isn't too far away.

 

[JSn]

Yeah, good, that's huge. Only Taylor, Ninko and Neal are out - hopefully Neal isn't too far away.

I think it would be ok if they played this game without Neal. That sounds crazy, but a week of practice and a full game for the back-up could serve VERY handy down the road here. Just popping him in there didn't work out super-great.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Loving this. Get the kids their playing time. Get the vets back for the stretch drive. Continue to develop continuity and confidence.....

It's all coming together at the right time.

 

[SVN]

i dont think green and banta cain will play..more like mayo during the ravensweek. next week they will be back.

 

[Kontradiction]

Loving this. Get the kids their playing time. Get the vets back for the stretch drive. Continue to develop continuity and confidence.....

It's all coming together at the right time.

Was there any doubt that it would?

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Neal's absence has me worried. It's too coincidental that the OL play degrades rapidly when he's out. SB42 was the first time we noticed this, but it was too soon to make a connection. Then the first half of 2008 the line was up-and-down without him, then played great in the 2nd half after his return. Then he goes out at the end of the 3rd quarter last Sunday and everything falls apart. I don't study OL play, but I'm pretty sure there's causation.

Has anyone here studied the OL play with and without Neal and can point to why the OL at least appears to play better with him in there?

Regards,
Chris

 

[Patspsycho]

Neal's absence has me worried. It's too coincidental that the OL play degrades rapidly when he's out. SB42 was the first time we noticed this, but it was too soon to make a connection. Then the first half of 2008 the line was up-and-down without him, then played great in the 2nd half after his return. Then he goes out at the end of the 3rd quarter last Sunday and everything falls apart. I don't study OL play, but I'm pretty sure there's causation.

Has anyone here studied the OL play with and without Neal and can point to why the OL at least appears to play better with him in there?

Regards,
Chris

I think Neal will be DNP this Sunday. They are calling it an "head injury" but something that keeps him out of practice all week is not good at all.

Ohrnberger may be activated.

EDIT: Neal is one of the best at pulling and kickouts on screens and traps. They like to run behind him.

 

[Kontradiction]

Neal's absence has me worried. It's too coincidental that the OL play degrades rapidly when he's out. SB42 was the first time we noticed this, but it was too soon to make a connection. Then the first half of 2008 the line was up-and-down without him, then played great in the 2nd half after his return. Then he goes out at the end of the 3rd quarter last Sunday and everything falls apart. I don't study OL play, but I'm pretty sure there's causation.

Has anyone here studied the OL play with and without Neal and can point to why the OL at least appears to play better with him in there?

Regards,
Chris

Because he's a mauler and a great guard. His replacements are obviously not as good.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Neal's absence has me worried. It's too coincidental that the OL play degrades rapidly when he's out. SB42 was the first time we noticed this, but it was too soon to make a connection. Then the first half of 2008 the line was up-and-down without him, then played great in the 2nd half after his return. Then he goes out at the end of the 3rd quarter last Sunday and everything falls apart. I don't study OL play, but I'm pretty sure there's causation.

Has anyone here studied the OL play with and without Neal and can point to why the OL at least appears to play better with him in there?

Regards,
Chris

No numbers but this article may lead you down to the right answer.

Scout.com: Stephen Neal Profile

Plus, if you look at the numbers once he returned to the lineup, the running game at least statistically took off.

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Because he's a mauler and a great guard. His replacements are obviously not as good.

Considering he's a starter, I'd assume the backups are not as good. What gets me is how striking the difference is in the performance of the OL with him in and out.

Remember the 2003 postseason when Woody went down right before the playoffs began? In stepped Hochstein and the OL didn't miss a beat. In 2005, rookie Kaczur did a great job filling in for Light. Ditto Vollmer this year (although I think Vollmer is a stud-in-waiting). O'Callaghan did a good job for Kaczur in the 2007 season finale vs. NYG. It seems that when anyone else goes down on the Pats' OL, the Pats have people to step in and get the job done...except for Neal. When Neal goes out, it seems things fall apart at least against the good teams. I was curious if anyone had paid close attention to the details that would clearly explain this instead of a generic "He's really good."

Regards,
Chris

 

[Patspsycho]

Considering he's a starter, I'd assume the backups are not as good. What gets me is how striking the difference is in the performance of the OL with him in and out.

Remember the 2003 postseason when Woody went down right before the playoffs began? In stepped Hochstein and the OL didn't miss a beat. In 2005, rookie Kaczur did a great job filling in for Light. Ditto Vollmer this year (although I think Vollmer is a stud-in-waiting). O'Callaghan did a good job for Kaczur in the 2007 season finale vs. NYG. It seems that when anyone else goes down on the Pats' OL, the Pats have people to step in and get the job done...except for Neal. When Neal goes out, it seems things fall apart at least against the good teams. I was curious if anyone had paid close attention to the details that would clearly explain this instead of a generic "He's really good."

Regards,
Chris

Did you read any of the post preceding yours? I gave an explanation and so did one or two people. Are you obtuse or something?

 

[bigcountry75]

As playing the O-line for 8 years I would have to say it has to do with continuity and trust......Those are the biggest attributes for a good O-line......Continuity - Playing with the guys around you and knowing what each other is going to do on each play......Mainly you don't have to think about who's going to block who and can just play football....Trust - goes along with that same concept of trusting the guy next to you to do his job and not having to worry about trying to help cover him too.....The more thinking you do on the O-line the more trouble you get yourselves into........I play OT but in one of my semi-pro games this year I had to fill in at guard due to injury and a LB came up in the A gap between me and the center so I pointed him out and told the center to pick him up because I had a man head up on me......The ball gets snapped and our QB is on his back before he can blink.....I started yelling at the center and he told me that they had made up a call between the Center and guards about sliding the protection inside and I had no clue about it......Basically I say that to say that guys get "comfortable" playing next to each other and have little things that they do that may turn into huge things and help with the blocking and plugging someone else in there definitely isn't the same.......Plus it doesn't hurt that when Neal is healthy he is a monster.....

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Did you read any of the post preceding yours? I gave an explanation and so did one or two people. Are you obtuse or something?

:nono: Don't do that again.

I read the comments. Is he *really* one of the best at pulling and kickouts on screens and traps? That good to the point where things go south horribly when he's out? I'm curious if anyone has analysed OL play both with him in and out and can pinpoint the difference.

Regards,
Chris

 

[Patspsycho]

:nono: Don't do that again.

I read the comments. Is he *really* one of the best at pulling and kickouts on screens and traps? That good to the point where things go south horribly when he's out? I'm curious if anyone has analysed OL play both with him in and out and can pinpoint the difference.

Regards,
Chris

Why else would they choose to run behind his screens?

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Why else would they choose to run behind his screens?

He's obviously good, but so are the other guys who have missed time with injuries (Light, Woody, Koppen...who I didn't mention earlier), yet for some reason the Pats have done well with replacements when those guys went out. Yet when Neal goes out, things *really* go bad. I'm curious if anyone has every really looked into it. We have a lot of great posters and maybe someone has the technical answer.

Regards,
Chris

 

[NYCPatsFan]

Maybe he is not obtuse?

sorry Chris, couldn't resist it.

 

[PATSNUTme]

Just imagine the what difference would have been last Sunday with both Green a Warren.

OK, I'm moving on now.

 

[Xplicit]

dirty sanchez needs to be on his back all game.

 

[RoughingthePasser]

Just imagine the what difference would have been last Sunday with both Green a Warren.

OK, I'm moving on now.

That's a great point PatsNut. Those are two of the best players on the team and we sure need them back at their positions.

I have good vibes for our defense the rest of the season.