Game Thoughts: Brady is back and likes playing with his shiny new toys edition

[Rob0729]

Here we go:

• I didn't think Brady would be rusty like most (see how well he played opening game last year), but I didn't think he would be that sharp as he was off the bat. He was in midseason form.
• It is clear that he loves his new weapons utilizing both Bennett and Hogan extensively this game. Hogan continues to live up to his 24-7 nickname because he was always open today. He gives Brady that somewhat deep threat off the bench that he hasn't had since Stallworth. Not something this offense needs, but it is an added benefit. Bennett is uncoverable like Gronk especially in the red zone. Sorry Gronk, but Brady may have a new red zone binkie.
• Back to Hogan. I am surprised by the guy's speed. I guess I always had the impression that the guy was another quick, not fast guy that the Pats love. But the guy is a burner down the field.
• I think we found out that the o-line issues of last year were more coaching than talent. I don't think other than LT, this o-line isn't worlds more talented than last year. But they were incredible in pass protection yesterday. See how an o-line can gel if they aren't changing the starting line up every game. They definitely need to work on their run blocking, but this offense is all about Brady and keeping him upright is the most important thing the o-line needs to do.
• This was a breakout game for Malcolm Brown. The guy did a little of everything yesterday even dropping back in coverage. Hopefully this mirrors Big Vince's breakout second year after a disappointing rookie season (Brown had a far better rookie season).
• Lost in all the Brady hype was the return of Rob Ninkovich. He wasn't on the field a huge amount and didn't really show up in the stats column, but he did really seem to make an impact to the defense. He definitely helped out against the best running offense in the League.
• I know I may be biased, but I am glad the Pats got McCourty over Joe Haden. I know they don't play the same position anymore, but they were compared to each other a lot early in their careers. McCourty has turned into one of the best safeties in the game while Haden has turned into a above average CB after showing promise to be an elite one. I think Cleveland may have broke him or he lost his fire being on such a loser team.
• Cyrus Jones has been a major disappointment this season thus far. He has had a few moments here and there, but he has stood out mostly for the bad stuff. His actions yesterday were just inexcusable. I think he will be working for a lot over the next weeks or months to get out of the doghouse.
• One thing I felt over the first month of the season (minus the Miami game) is that James White was being underutilized. He is a great receiving threat. Brady seems to like the guy. I know I got crap about this before, but White has been a better receiver the last half dozen games or so when Brady was under center than Dion Lewis was. Lewis is more rounded because he is a great runner too.
• Had next to no idea who Elandon Roberts was (typically don't pa much attention to late round picks because they have such trouble making this team). In fact, I forgot he was on the team. Certainly know who he is now. Hopefully he can build on yesterday's play and become a solid contributor.

 

[VrabelJr]

After watching yesterday's game there are only two facts from Brady'a time off

1. He was tanning his cheeks in Italy
2. He must have been only practicing his deep ball!

 

[Dagg]

Agree with most points. I do know Cleveland was is on their fourth string center so while Brown played well I think we should pump the brakes a little until he does it vs better talent.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Team looks good, but there's work to be done

 

[everlong]

My favorite moment from the game was when Bennett caught a ball on the right sideline and both he and Gronk were open. Gronk started hopping up and down and pointing towards the endzone urging Bennett. on. A lot of all world players would have been jealous over the type of success their counterpart had but Gronk was gleeful.

I can't until TY Hilton or somebody else who had a decent week gets the AFC player of the week award over Brady and the board explodes.

 

[BobDigital]

I love how our O looks. Gronk/Bennett where not 100% but still dominated and the best part is if the OL protects Brady no opposing D will have an answer to them. Covering one is hard enough but both at once? I don't see it happening much.

People use to talk about the weakness of the WR core but not anymore. Hogan/Edelman while not elite are plenty good enough with the TEs we have and solid depth like Amendola/Mitchel is behind them incase one goes out for a bit.

I hope we never need to hear about cutting White. His running has improved it seems but as a pass catching back he is just to valuable. Also i took heat at one point saying he is better than Vereen. He is. Not as athletic but he is smoother he can run any route. While he is not Lewis he makes you not miss him as much as you would otherwise and if Lewis can't be there for the playoffs if White is with the above cast i feel more than comfortable. When Lewis comes back rotating these 2 will be deadly and you will never give the D a chance to catch their breath. I would love to see more from Foster but once Lewis comes back I don't see how he sees snaps.

The OL has been the story of the year for the Pats though. Expected to be a weakness it has carried them when down at times and now with Brady things appear sharper. Mistakes will happen and the youth is an issue but they will improve. Andrews will hopefully grow as the year goes on to be more consistent. RG has barely been an issue which is the biggest surprise and it seems that spot has settled well with Mason taking a noticeable year 2 jump imo. Cannon... well he has earned his money to this point. What can you say. Flemming has done very well this year BTW in his 2 wire to wire starts. When asked to fill in Karras has done well too.

 

[KCSVEN]

Here we go:
I think we found out that the o-line issues of last year were more coaching than talent. I don't think other than LT, this o-line isn't worlds more talented than last year. But they were incredible in pass protection yesterday. See how an o-line can gel if they aren't changing the starting line up every game. They definitely need to work on their run blocking, but this offense is all about Brady and keeping him upright is the most important thing the o-line needs to do.

Some good points by OP...I agree Dante is a superior coach but not sure talent is as equal. Considering the Broncos Game that ended last year the starters were Vollmer (who could not get used to the left tackle spot), Cannon(out of shape), Brian Stork(15 yard head butt penalty and giving away snap count), Josh Kline and Shaq Mason (Rookie).
So, Thuney and Solder are HUGE upgrades as they did not have an NFL caliber left tackle last year (they were still swapping Cannon and Vollmer in the middle of the Denver game because they both sucked at LT) and the guards were below average where Thuney is above average so 40% of the line is massively more talented. You can see they run FAR better to the left than the right. Some is coaching, like the giving away the snap count, perhaps Cannon being out of shape last year. But Thuney vs. Kline? Mason a rookie vs Mason year 2? Fleming in year 3 or in shape Cannon vs Cannon last year?
I give Dante huge props, he is the best in the NFL IMO and gets the most out of the talent but he does have a lot more talent this year than the Pats had at the end of last year when they struggled.

Can McDaniels please stop loading the left side with blockers and the running behind the weaker blockers on the right side for 1 yard. I know through 3 games they averaged 57% more Yards per carry to the left. 5.61 to 3.56. Have not seen stat updated last two games but I looked at the last 6 drives(When they had a lead and were trying to run and Cleveland knew it):

15 Runs: 8 Right and 7 Left
Average YPC Right: 1.38
Average YPC Left: 3.43
No gain or loss right: 3 carries or 37.5%
No gain or Loss Left: 1 carry 14.2% ( Holding on that play by Gronk but I counted the zero yards gained)
4 yards or more left: 3 carries or 42.8%
4 yards or more right: 1 carry or 12.5%

I think this also adds to the left side talent increase being a bigger factor than people realize.

Solder and Thuney are the key to the line insurgence followed by the return of Dante.

 

[archstanton543]

• Cyrus Jones has been a major disappointment this season thus far. He has had a few moments here and there, but he has stood out mostly for the bad stuff. His actions yesterday were just inexcusable. I think he will be working for a lot over the next weeks or months to get out of the doghouse.

What? Reacting to a guy hitting him late? That's inexcusable? The problem with that play is that most of the refs were looking at the actual play across the field and not where the Browns player took a cheap shot a Jones. Another problem was that the Browns player fell down just Jones started to push back and, maybe the refs, since they were looking elsewhere initially thought that Jones threw a punch when in reality he was just reacting to a cheap shot.

 

[AtomicDawg]

Hogan continues to live up to his 24-7 nickname

Minor correction....his nickname is...

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Some good points by OP...I agree Dante is a superior coach but not sure talent is as equal. Considering the Broncos Game that ended last year the starters were Vollmer (who could not get used to the left tackle spot), Cannon(out of shape), Brian Stork(15 yard head butt penalty and giving away snap count), Josh Kline and Shaq Mason (Rookie).
So, Thuney and Solder are HUGE upgrades as they did not have an NFL caliber left tackle last year (they were still swapping Cannon and Vollmer in the middle of the Denver game because they both sucked at LT) and the guards were below average where Thuney is above average so 40% of the line is massively more talented. You can see they run FAR better to the left than the right. Some is coaching, like the giving away the snap count, perhaps Cannon being out of shape last year. But Thuney vs. Kline? Mason a rookie vs Mason year 2? Fleming in year 3 or in shape Cannon vs Cannon last year?
I give Dante huge props, he is the best in the NFL IMO and gets the most out of the talent but he does have a lot more talent this year than the Pats had at the end of last year when they struggled.

Can McDaniels please stop loading the left side with blockers and the running behind the weaker blockers on the right side for 1 yard. I know through 3 games they averaged 57% more Yards per carry to the left. 5.61 to 3.56. Have not seen stat updated last two games but I looked at the last 6 drives(When they had a lead and were trying to run and Cleveland knew it):

15 Runs: 8 Right and 7 Left
Average YPC Right: 1.38
Average YPC Left: 3.43
No gain or loss right: 3 carries or 37.5%
No gain or Loss Left: 1 carry 14.2% ( Holding on that play by Gronk but I counted the zero yards gained)
4 yards or more left: 3 carries or 42.8%
4 yards or more right: 1 carry or 12.5%

I think this also adds to the left side talent increase being a bigger factor than people realize.

Solder and Thuney are the key to the line insurgence followed by the return of Dante.

I agree with your point on principle. If it was just the coaching, the only move would have been Dante this past offseason. But instead, they also went out and traded for Cooper, drafted Thuney, and drafted Karras. They clearly felt there were issues on the interior of the line last year that was more than just coaching. Whereas they made no personnel additions at tackle.

Regarding Cannon though -- remember that he broke his toe in the 1st quarter against Indy last year (game 5). He generally looked ok through that point. He looked terrible once he came back. I don't think it was "out of shape" Cannon so much as "injured who probably shouldn't have been playing" Cannon.

 

[patchick]

My favorite moment from the game was when Bennett caught a ball on the right sideline and both he and Gronk were open. Gronk started hopping up and down and pointing towards the endzone urging Bennett. on. A lot of all world players would have been jealous over the type of success their counterpart had but Gronk was gleeful.

Every sign both Gronk and Bennett give off is that they genuinely enjoy playing together. I think they're reveling in the potential of two monster TEs taking the field together -- in a versatile offense with all of the pieces in place to take advantage of them.

I also suspect they're just plain having fun. That's two very big men with two very big personalities. Hopefully it bodes well for a longer-term deal.

 

[aluminum seats]

Nice round-up. Look, this roster is just loaded, as evidenced by the hand wringing over how to get Brady and Ninkovich back on—most teams, it’s yeah, we have to cut a couple guys…just take any from the bottom (it’s like the toothpaste—squeeze tube from the bottom and flatten it as you go up...) Virtually every guy on this roster is bringing value, and there are other guys waiting in the wings still to make an impact.

Health and execution. Pats usually know how to execute, and god knows they’re due for some good fortune on the injury front.

Slightly OT, it occurs to me that the way the first four games went down were ideal from a personal (and/or legacy) standpoint for Belichick and Brady. For Belichick, the team goes 3-1 and has first place without Brady, using not just a back-up but the back-up’s rookie back-up. Wow. And for Brady, he comes back to a solid 3-1 record, with any whispers about “system quarterback” (asinine, of course) that may have been starting sometime during the Miami game long since silenced.

So perfect for both of them. And they got the first loss out of the way, to prevent any undefeated chatter—just not in the mood for that this year. Just #5…please & thank you.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Slightly OT, it occurs to me that the way the first four games went down were ideal from a personal (and/or legacy) standpoint for Belichick and Brady. For Belichick, the team goes 3-1 and has first place without Brady, using not just a back-up but the back-up’s rookie back-up. Wow. And for Brady, he comes back to a solid 3-1 record, with any whispers about “system quarterback” (asinine, of course) that may have been starting sometime during the Miami game long since silenced.

So perfect for both of them.

In my opinion, it's even better than that. Not only did they go 3-1 during the absence and are 4-1 now, but there was a noticeable difference in all 3 quarterbacks. I don't think any person can reasonably say that "it's the system" about any of them, because all 3 of them played different games and had different degrees of effectiveness and different reasons for success. More specifically, Garappolo looked a lot more polished and ready than Brissett, and yet the Pats were able to go 1-1 in Brissett's two starts. It allows the possibility of Garappolo being able to fetch the team something of major value in the offseason should they so choose, possibly an additional first round pick, although the Dak Prescott / Tony Romo dynamic could be adding to the offseason QB supply market.

 

[Le Numéro Douze]

In my opinion, it's even better than that. Not only did they go 3-1 during the absence and are 4-1 now, but there was a noticeable difference in all 3 quarterbacks. I don't think any person can reasonably say that "it's the system" about any of them, because all 3 of them played different games and had different degrees of effectiveness and different reasons for success. More specifically, Garappolo looked a lot more polished and ready than Brissett, and yet the Pats were able to go 1-1 in Brissett's two starts. It allows the possibility of Garappolo being able to fetch the team something of major value in the offseason should they so choose, possibly an additional first round pick, although the Dak Prescott / Tony Romo dynamic could be adding to the offseason QB supply market.

Considering that Romo is damaged goods at this point and that Prescott is winning game after game without major making mistakes, Jones would have to be a major idiot to trade Dak Prescott - no one is trading anything of value for the corpse of a once great QB. That being said, we are talking about Jerruh.

 

[PScottman]

Back to Hogan. I am surprised by the guy's speed. I guess I always had the impression that the guy was another quick, not fast guy that the Pats love. But the guy is a burner down the field.

Will be interested if this dulls the constant call for a massive cap hit 6'4" outside the numbers WR?

(especially since we have TWO 6'5"+ outside the numbers and inside the numbers TEs)

 

[RobertWeathers]

Considering that Romo is damaged goods at this point and that Prescott is winning game after game without major making mistakes, Jones would have to be a major idiot to trade Dak Prescott - no one is trading anything of value for the corpse of a once great QB. That being said, we are talking about Jerruh.

They are in the same boat as the Pats. Both TB12 and Romo have big cap hits in 2017.

The difference is Tb12 is durable (knock on wood) and still elite and Romo is fine china that you are afraid to take out during the holidays because the kids will drop it.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

My favorite moment from the game was when Bennett caught a ball on the right sideline and both he and Gronk were open. Gronk started hopping up and down and pointing towards the endzone urging Bennett. on. A lot of all world players would have been jealous over the type of success their counterpart had but Gronk was gleeful.

I can't until TY Hilton or somebody else who had a decent week gets the AFC player of the week award over Brady and the board explodes.

I remember reading that GRONK supposedly enjoys blocking even more than he does receiving.

 

[RobertWeathers]

After watching yesterday's game there are only two facts from Brady'a time off

1. He was tanning his cheeks in Italy
2. He must have been only practicing his deep ball!

Gisele has 4.2 40 speed.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I remember reading that GRONK supposedly enjoys blocking even more than he does receiving.

He did say that.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I agree with your point on principle. If it was just the coaching, the only move would have been Dante this past offseason. But instead, they also went out and traded for Cooper, drafted Thuney, and drafted Karras. They clearly felt there were issues on the interior of the line last year that was more than just coaching. Whereas they made no personnel additions at tackle.

FWIW, I think Karras was a "He's the best player on our board, let's take this guy" pick rather than a guy they were specifically targeting late (see: Edelman, Cassel).