do the Pats take another running back high

[Handel]

no , there are other pressing needs like linebacker, cornerback, and receiver

First pick should be ILB or S.

 

[ATippett56]

Safety. 10 characters.

Name: LaRon Landry
College: LSU Number: 30
Height: 6-2 Weight: 205
Position: FS Pos2:
Class/Draft Year: Sr/2007
40 Time: 4.48 40 Low: 4.44 40 High: 4.52
Projected Round: 1 Stock:
Rated number 1 out of 124 FS's

Overview

Played and started all 13 games at free safety for the Tigers ... Named a third-team All-America by the Associated Press after recording 69 tackles, 4 tackles for loss and a sack ... Earned first-team All- SEC honors from the league's coaches and was a second-team all-league pick by the AP ... Intercepted 3 passes to run his career total to 9, which ranks as the highest total among active players in the SEC ... Recorded season-high 11 tackles in overtime win over Auburn ... Add 7 tackles and a sack for a 10-yard loss against Alabama ... The sack on Alabama quarterback Brodie Croyle came early in the third quarter following an LSU touchdown that changed the complexion of the contest ... Intercepted a pass to stop an Arkansas drive late in the fourth quarter to ice the win for the Tigers ... Ranked among the SEC leaders in 2005 with 8 pass breakups.

2005 Season

Opted to return to school for his senior season in 2006 ... By all accounts, would have been a first round draft pick in last year's NFL Draft ... Goes into his final year with the Tigers rated as one of the nation's top defensive backs and has been projected as an early first round pick in the 2007 NFL Draft ... ESPN ranks him as the No. 1 defensive back in college football, Athlon's tabs him as the No. 1 safety and The Sporting News lists him as the No. 2 free safety ... Has been named to virtually every preseason All-America team going into the 2006 season ... Also on the watch list for the Ronnie Lott Trophy, the Bednarik Trophy and the Nagurski Trophy.

Leader of an LSU secondary that has been ranked the best in college football by Athlon Magazine going into the 2006 season ... Could go down as the best defensive back to ever play at LSU ... Brings a fierce and intimidating style to the LSU secondary ... A ferocious hitter with a knack for finding the football ... Has led LSU in tackles two of the past three seasons ... Carries a string of 35 consecutive starts in 2006, which began with 10 straight starts as a true freshman to cap LSU's National Championship season in 2003 ... Goes into the 2006 season with 241 career tackles, 12.5 tackles for loss, 9 interceptions and 7 sacks.

 

[BradyManny]

The Pats will take the best player available at either OL, WR, TE, DB, DL or LB. Basically I'd say anything except RB and QB.

 

[ATippett56]

Have you also seen Dave Ball from UNH??? Great later round project.

Name: David Ball
College: New Hampshire Number: 3
Height: 6-1 Weight: 195
Position: WR Pos2:
Class/Draft Year: Sr/2007
40 Time: 4.59 40 Low: 4.52 40 High: 4.65
Projected Round: 4 Stock:
Rated number 18 out of 278 WR's

 

[Keegs]

I wouldn't be surprised at all if they went O-Line or D-Line with the first pick.

It's hard to guess so i don't even want to try. Of course there are guys you would like though.

Whoever the most badass safety is in college after this year, i want that guy.... will we draft him?? most likely no.

 

[ATippett56]

Whoever the most badass safety is in college after this year, i want that guy.... will we draft him?? most likely no.

Without a doubt, LaRon Landry from LSU is the best safety prospect in the 2007 NFL draft. He probably will not be available for the New England Patriots unless the Seattle Seahawks tank the season.

 

[mgteich]

Dillon should be clock-killing Corey Dillon for 3 more years. Faulk should be our 3rd back for that long. There should be no 1st or 2nd round RB pick by the patriots.

We might consider a FB, but I don't think so. The upgrade would be better taken from the free agent market. It takes a while to learn how to transition to NFL FB.

 

[amazinPats]

Dillon could be used as Bettis was used for the last few years of his career: come in for Red Zone situations and short yardage situations. The big powerback gets preserved and protected that way; and his energy is conserved for the short critical plays.

I hope we go cb and safety with the two first rounders.

 

[Digger44]

Your comment "but these guys are slow for a traditional Pats guy" is a load of crap when aforementioned wide receivers are quite faster than the typical wide receiver prospect. As a footnote:

Name: Deion Branch
College: Louisville Number: 9
Height: 5-09 Weight: 191
Position: WR Pos2:
Class/Draft Year: Sr/2002
40 Time: 4.47 40 Low: 40 High:
Projected Round: 3 Stock:
Rated number 10 out of 61 WR's

Combine Invite: yes
Height: 5091
Weight: 191
40 Yrd Dash: 4.47
20 Yrd Dash: 2.56
10 Yrd Dash: 1.51
Vertical Jump: 36
Broad Jump: 9'9"
20 Yrd Shuttle: 3.76
3-Cone Drill: 6.71
Wonderlic: 26

It's a shame that all you base your data on is stats and you cannot logically reads through my original post. Will you please read it in context and catch the idea instead of looking for one thing to argue about. Go back and read the freaking thread again and see the point instead of pushing your one subject wonder agenda.

 

[ATippett56]

You are right, yes he was. What the heck am I talking about? You have no clue if the two guys you listed are the next Boldin. That is a pretty big statement. For every 1 Boldin who makes it there are 1000 who don't.

No, I was just pointing out that 40 yard combine times are overrated. As for the New England Patriots 2002 NFL draft, the scouting department obviously did their homework:

Wide receivers
Because of individual passing drills between receivers and quarterbacks, neither group performs the bench-press test. In this most athletically gifted group, 40-times ranged from 4.34 to 4.76, with Auburn WR Tim Carter being at the low end of the spectrum and Jackson State WR Thomas Taylor at the other. In Taylor’s defense, he was the biggest wide receiver (6-3 3/4, 219) to run at the Combine. Kansas State WR Aaron Lockett also ran a 4.35, but his diminutive size (5-7 3/8, 155) may discourage some suitors. Florida State WR Javon Walker was the only other receiver to run under a 4.4 electronically. Florida WR Reche Caldwell showed his explosiveness in the vertical jump with a mark of 41 1/2 inches. Notre Dame WRs Javin Hunter (41) and David Givens (40 1/2) also surpassed the 40-inch barrier. Caldwell turned some heads again when he broad-jumped 10 feet 10 inches — the best broad jump recorded at the Combine. The best 20-yard pro shuttle belonged to Louisville’s Deion Branch, who zipped through the drill in 3.76 seconds. Branch also led all wideouts in the 60-yard shuttle, which measures crispness in changing direction over an extended length, recording a time of 10.66. Michigan State WR Herb Haygood and Richmond WR Ryan Tolhurst opened some eyes when they posted times of 6.65 in the three-cone drill.

Averages for wide receivers:

Ht. Wt. Reps 40 Vert. Broad Shuttle Cone
6-0 1/2 198 Not tested 4.52 37" 9’11" 4.11 6.93

http://archive.profootballweekly.com/content/archives2001/draft_2001/combine_analysis_032802.asp

 

[ATippett56]

It's a shame that all you base your data on is stats and you cannot logically reads through my original post. Will you please read it in context and catch the idea instead of looking for one thing to argue about. Go back and read the freaking thread again and see the point instead of pushing your one subject wonder agenda.

While I'm posting useful information in this thread, you're just riding my ass from the word go. First, I never stated the two aforementioned wide receivers would be better than Anquan Boldin. Second, Deion Branch's 40 yard combine time is nearly identical with Paul Williams and Dwayne Bowe.

 

[Mike the Brit]

BB explains his draft strategy

Over the years that I've been reading this board there have been hundreds of threads speculating on the Patriots' draft strategy, including this one (and RookBoston's memorable Value Groupings theory). Part of what has fuelled it is that we have had little guidance from the Pats regarding the way that they see it.

But for once BB has opened up and told us.

Read the following answer from his press conference this Friday and it's very clear: he believes radically in drafting the Best Player Available, regardless of position, except in very unusual circumstances (wouldn't take a first round quarterback -- now there's a surprise!)

http://www.patriots.com/mediacenter/index.cfm?ac=audionewsdetail&pid=21617&pcid=85&searchstring=

Q: Since you've been here, you've only drafted five wide receivers out of 61 picks. How much of that is by happenstance and how much of that is by design?

BB: On the draft, I'd say hardly any of it is by design. You evaluate the draft class. You go to the draft and you pick where you pick. You have a little bit of, sometimes, ability to move depending on how you have the players rated. We try to draft the players that we feel like are best for the organization and best for the team and have the best value where we pick. Whoever that is, that's who it is. We need players at every position. I think there's only a couple of positions that you're really locked out of. That usually has to do with who else is on your team or who else you drafted. I heard Nick [Saban] say, and Nick and I have talked about it, they drafted Ronnie Brown with the second pick of the draft last year. Well it would be pretty hard to come back and take a running back in the middle of the [first] round this year. Tom Brady is your quarterback, it would be pretty hard to take a quarterback in the middle of the first round when you have Tom Brady as your quarterback. I don't think that's really good team management. Other than a couple of those isolated type of situations, the rest of it, we've drafted based on who we feel is the best person, the best player that we can add to our team based on a) what is on the board where we are picking and b) what value we place on the players that we are drafting.

By the way, this is the consequence of the list of players whom Belichick liked in the draft that Holley gives in Patriots Reign -- players at a number of different positions.

So the questions that we've all been asking: when are they going to take a line-backer early? why do they seem to spend so many early picks on tight ends? does drafting David Thomas mean that Daniel Graham won't be back? will we draft another running back high to replace Corey Dillon? have a simple answer: it's just the way that the draft has worked out and their ranking of the player -- and the wild speculation can stop (some hope! )

 

[Patriotic]

Re: BB explains his draft strategy

Over the years that I've been reading this board there have been hundreds of threads speculating on the Patriots' draft strategy, including this one (and RookBoston's memorable Value Groupings theory). Part of what has fuelled it is that we have had little guidance from the Pats regarding the way that they see it.

But for once BB has opened up and told us.

Read the following answer from his press conference this Friday and it's very clear: he believes radically in drafting the Best Player Available, regardless of position, except in very unusual circumstances (wouldn't take a first round quarterback -- now there's a surprise!)

http://www.patriots.com/mediacenter/index.cfm?ac=audionewsdetail&pid=21617&pcid=85&searchstring=

Q: Since you've been here, you've only drafted five wide receivers out of 61 picks. How much of that is by happenstance and how much of that is by design?

BB: On the draft, I'd say hardly any of it is by design. You evaluate the draft class. You go to the draft and you pick where you pick. You have a little bit of, sometimes, ability to move depending on how you have the players rated. We try to draft the players that we feel like are best for the organization and best for the team and have the best value where we pick. Whoever that is, that's who it is. We need players at every position. I think there's only a couple of positions that you're really locked out of. That usually has to do with who else is on your team or who else you drafted. I heard Nick [Saban] say, and Nick and I have talked about it, they drafted Ronnie Brown with the second pick of the draft last year. Well it would be pretty hard to come back and take a running back in the middle of the [first] round this year. Tom Brady is your quarterback, it would be pretty hard to take a quarterback in the middle of the first round when you have Tom Brady as your quarterback. I don't think that's really good team management. Other than a couple of those isolated type of situations, the rest of it, we've drafted based on who we feel is the best person, the best player that we can add to our team based on a) what is on the board where we are picking and b) what value we place on the players that we are drafting.

By the way, this is the consequence of the list of players whom Belichick liked in the draft that Holley gives in Patriots Reign -- players at a number of different positions.

So the questions that we've all been asking: when are they going to take a line-backer early? why do they seem to spend so many early picks on tight ends? does drafting David Thomas mean that Daniel Graham won't be back? will we draft another running back high to replace Corey Dillon? have a simple answer: it's just the way that the draft has worked out and their ranking of the player -- and the wild speculation can stop (some hope! )

Mike, great analysis but it depends on the question.

Who do you think BB will draft? The best player BB thinks is available {kind of a boring discusion}.

Who do you think the Pats should draft? An ILB or a DB. IMO, that's a more interesting discusion.

 

[kptmorgan04]

I firmly would say LB/CB/Safety.
I dont know why you would say WR at this point with going into next year you will have Gabriel, Caldwell and Jackson as your 1-3. Maybe a WR in rounds 2-3 or if the top one or two slip to the last pick in the first round, but other than that I see building the youth on defense with the best available player.

 

[ironwasp]

I firmly would say LB/CB/Safety.
I dont know why you would say WR at this point with going into next year you will have Gabriel, Caldwell and Jackson as your 1-3. Maybe a WR in rounds 2-3 or if the top one or two slip to the last pick in the first round, but other than that I see building the youth on defense with the best available player.

A good majority of opinion on this board felt we'd go LB/CB/S this year - and it made a hell of a lot of sense. I was certain it would be Manny Lawson at 21 when we got on the clock. And boy was I wrong - about the pick and about him.

Instead BB drafted in a position few of us thought he would or should, but he confounded our expectations and look what happened. We now have the best (more or less) ground attack in the league.

So while I would have thought the S/CB/LB/WR might be at the top of the list in April, I wouldn't be remotely surprised if we picked up another lineman.

 

[Mike the Brit]

Re: BB explains his draft strategy

Mike, great analysis but it depends on the question.

Who do you think BB will draft? The best player BB thinks is available {kind of a boring discusion}.

Who do you think the Pats should draft? An ILB or a DB. IMO, that's a more interesting discusion.

I guess BB has done pretty well so far.

We can talk about where we have holes and how we'd like the team to play, but the question BB obviously asks is: is this the guy of those available who we think has the highest possible chance of succeeding in the NFL? Since most of our discussions are attempts to second guess the Patriots, I think it's worth bearing that in mind. You can bet that that was what BB was telling Corey when he rang him from the draft.

(Mind you, I don't suppose that we'd have drafted Gostkowski if it hadn't been for some off-season events ...)

 

[Digger44]

While I'm posting useful information in this thread, you're just riding my ass from the word go. First, I never stated the two aforementioned wide receivers would be better than Anquan Boldin. Second, Deion Branch's 40 yard combine time is nearly identical with Paul Williams and Dwayne Bowe.

This is just amazing. I hope you learn how to read sometime soon. As I will once again point to my original post, I said I wouldn't mind either of these guys. Did you read that? hmmmm guess not. I also posted that I did not put a whole lot of weight into the 40 time. Did you read that? hmmmm guess not.

As far as DB's 40 time against PW & DB there is a large difference that you cannot seem to comprehend. There is a large difference between speed and quickness. That is the difference between DB and these other guys.

When you bring up Boldin and say that he was slow so these guys may make it like Boldin, you are making a big jump. You can't compare these guys to Boldin.

I am not riding you all. Let's see if you can get the whole point that I made once again in the original post. Didn't I mention that before somewhere?

Gabriel & Jackson are going to make a solid BIG WR duo (that means two). As I originally posted, a posession type receiver (like Branch) would be a great WR to have with DG & CJ. Then add a burner (under a 4.3 40 time) that can stretch the field. That would be a balanced WR core.

Instead of discussing this type of formation, you wanted to make yourself into a victim/marter for one single comment that wasn't the point of the whole post. That is why I refered you to the original thread multiple times. I don't know how else to state it. Do you need it drawn in cartoons?

 

[ATippett56]

This is just amazing. I hope you learn how to read sometime soon. As I will once again point to my original post, I said I wouldn't mind either of these guys. Did you read that? hmmmm guess not. I also posted that I did not put a whole lot of weight into the 40 time. Did you read that? hmmmm guess not.

First you contradict yourself right off the bat: "I dont put a lot of stock into 40 times, but these guys are slow for a traditional Pats guy. With DG & CJ as big boys, we need a posession threat and a burner to stretch the field."

As for Chad Jackson, he is the burner to stretch the field or you didn't bother researching his combine results:

Name: *Chad Jackson
College: Florida Number: 8
Height: 6-1 Weight: 213
Position: WR Pos2:
Class/Draft Year: Jr/2006
40 Time: 4.32 40 Low: 40 High:
Projected Round: 1 Stock:
Rated number 1 out of 212 WR's 17 / 1727 TOTAL

Prior to the implementation of the spread offense by Urban Meyer, Chad Jackson was the deep threat at Florida:

2004 Season

Played in every game with three starts (Mississippi State, South Carolina and Miami) at flanker...Saw time on the kickoff coverage, kickoff return, punting and punt return teams throughout the season...Third on the team for the most plays by a Gator at wide receiver (583 plays)...Was the second-most prominent special teams member with 164 total plays... Set a school record with his team-best 22.3 yards per catch (old record was a 22.0-yard average by Wes Chandler in 1976), which ranked third nationally for receivers with at least 25 catches...Ranked fourth on the team with 29 receptions for 648 yards and six touchdowns...Eight of his catches were for 20 yards or longer...Caught 25 of his passes over the last nine games of the season...Five of his six touchdown receptions came in the last seven games of the year...One of only two UF receivers to catch a pass in all 12 games...Was the first UF receiver since 1999 to record two catches of over 60 yards in the same season when he caught a 65-yard pass vs. Kentucky and a career-long 81-yard touchdown vs. Tennessee...Carried once for a 1-yard gain and recorded a pair of solo tackles...Returned seven kickoffs for 135 yards (19.3 avg) and five punts for 17 yards (3.4 avg)...Averaged 66.75 all-purpose yards per game.

As for Doug Gabriel, he essentially replaces David Givens as the possession receiver on the New England Patriots.

 

[D-cleater]

ATippett, thanks for posting the data. Also, you can argue with Digger all you won't but please stop quoting him, its defeating my ignore list ;-) .

Who do you like at LB?

 

[Digger44]

First you contradict yourself right off the bat: "I dont put a lot of stock into 40 times, but these guys are slow for a traditional Pats guy. With DG & CJ as big boys, we need a posession threat and a burner to stretch the field."

As for Chad Jackson, he is the burner to stretch the field or you didn't bother researching his combine results:

Name: *Chad Jackson
College: Florida Number: 8
Height: 6-1 Weight: 213
Position: WR Pos2:
Class/Draft Year: Jr/2006
40 Time: 4.32 40 Low: 40 High:
Projected Round: 1 Stock:
Rated number 1 out of 212 WR's 17 / 1727 TOTAL

Prior to the implementation of the spread offense by Urban Meyer, Chad Jackson was the deep threat at Florida:

2004 Season

Played in every game with three starts (Mississippi State, South Carolina and Miami) at flanker...Saw time on the kickoff coverage, kickoff return, punting and punt return teams throughout the season...Third on the team for the most plays by a Gator at wide receiver (583 plays)...Was the second-most prominent special teams member with 164 total plays... Set a school record with his team-best 22.3 yards per catch (old record was a 22.0-yard average by Wes Chandler in 1976), which ranked third nationally for receivers with at least 25 catches...Ranked fourth on the team with 29 receptions for 648 yards and six touchdowns...Eight of his catches were for 20 yards or longer...Caught 25 of his passes over the last nine games of the season...Five of his six touchdown receptions came in the last seven games of the year...One of only two UF receivers to catch a pass in all 12 games...Was the first UF receiver since 1999 to record two catches of over 60 yards in the same season when he caught a 65-yard pass vs. Kentucky and a career-long 81-yard touchdown vs. Tennessee...Carried once for a 1-yard gain and recorded a pair of solo tackles...Returned seven kickoffs for 135 yards (19.3 avg) and five punts for 17 yards (3.4 avg)...Averaged 66.75 all-purpose yards per game.

As for Doug Gabriel, he essentially replaces David Givens as the possession receiver on the New England Patriots.

Yup I agree you are an idiot.