Chilling story by Jackie Mac on Ted Johnson

[Seymour93]

Thought I'd bump this thread because its had some quality responses (until this one) and it should be on the front page instead the usual "Hey look at me!!!!" crap.

 

[PATSNUTme]

TJ has been and always will be on of my favorite Patriots. I sincerely wish him well and hope that he is able to get his life in order. He is still a young man.

This stuff about BB, I don't take that as leading to his current condition. Remember that Ted went off and left the team when he learned he was going to be inactive for a game. Now we know why.

TJ my thoughts are with you.

 

[pats1]

I haven't read this thread through yet to see if this has been mentioned, but TJ and his wife did file for divorce last month, about 6 or 7 months after their domestic issue:

http://thetrack.bostonherald.com/moreTrack/view.bg?articleid=175900

 

[NEPat]

Peter King talked about this with Dale and Holley today, and he made some pretty fair comments, I think. He mentioned a lot of the sentiment that's in this thread, including changing his mind a little when the guys read the recent Johnson quotes to him:

PK: My reaction is that if his charges are true, it's a deeply disturbing portrait of life in the NFL and particularly life on the Patriots, without as much regard for a person's health over how much he means to the team at that partuclar point in time.

Having said that, this is the thing I've felt about Belichick a lot of times.
One of the reasons he gets bashed in the side of the head with a baseball bat so often in the press and why a lot of that sticks is because Bill just does not respond (me: did he only read the Times story and not the Globe where Bill does respond?).

Let me tell you this, and I'm not saying this is the right way to do it or the wrong way to do it. Those are incredibly serious allegations being made by Ted Johnson. And to me, if I am the owner of the NE Patriots, if I'm Bob Kraft, I'm saying "I don't care who does or does not want to respond to that, we're going to respond to that and we're going to tell people we are not the kind of organization that does not value human life."

But before we kill the Patriots on this, i think all precincts need to report before we make any final conclusions on this because obviously if this is as one sided as it says, it would be an extremely disturbing portrait of how the Patriots run their business.

I mean call me Pollyanna, but I want to hear the other side of the story before I make any judgement on that.

*Dale reads the Johnson quotes from a month ago saying he wants to play for Bill and the Pats*

Wow. See I didn't know that at all, I had no idea. That does shed light on it, obviously. I think, again, cooler heads need to prevail in this thing, and let's see what happens when all the facts are known.

 

[DaBruinz]

Okay, granted the issue here is the pressure to play hurt... and granted, the different perspectives I'm about to talk about come from different fans... BUT...

Have you guys noticed that relatively "player friendly," "stop-the-insanity" type of talk suddenly makes sense after a story like this, especially affecting one of our own?

But otherwise, any rule that limits the "toughness" factor in football is "making the game into flag football", and is likely the brainchild of Polian.

Obviously there's the rules for receivers and points of emphasis, which are pretty far afield from this, but how many of us wrote in favor of the "hands off the QB" rules that have progressively gone into effect?

This isn't calling out the original poster, just jumping off from that comment...

Secondly, I once posted a general question on "Why the hell are we always injured?" One response was that the Pats play -- and practice -- an extremely physical type of football.

Is what (supposedly) happened here, an outgrowth of toughness in practicing? You know no player really wants to leave the game, regardless of his financial position, except Ricky Williams for about 1 year.... so you would think it could happen on any team.

But really, is it possible that the "me-first" babies who would sit out a season, rather than risk their health while not under contract, have a point? That is, that it's become such an inherently violent and dangerous game, you have to be nuts to play it without milking every dime out of it?

Just opening up the cans of worms here, folks. As for who's thown under the bus here, I don't care right now. Seems the Shlitzstorms keep coming in Pats Country... I just look forward to the day when I can read about free agency and draft picks instead of shoeboxes full of cash and supposed responsibility for tragic concussions.

Sigh. I guess that means waiting until we're "lovable losers" again... screw it. That can wait.

PFnV

PFnV -
I think what you are missing here is that the NFL and NFLPA have got to great lengths to AVOID the discussion of concussions. They have gone to great lengths to EXCLUDE data and basically publish false reports.

The NFLPA under Upshaw has been a disgrace when it comes to taking care of its own.

 

[Patriot Missile]

This kind of article can turn you in alot of directions. I feel bad for TJ and wish him a full recovery. He was a great Patriot and is probably a great DAD.

Doesn't change my opinion on BB in the least. I don't like the way the article displays BB as this heartless monster. It's a business and many times employers push too hard to get employees back to work. It's the nature of the society we live in to take advantage of compensation to help the needy. Disability,sick time,welfare etc. Oh and yes we know some Doctors in this world will write just what an employer doesn't want to hear at the patients request. NO I am not saying TJ was trying to take advantage but I'm sure there have been others who have dogged injuries because they didn't want to experience the pain of the game or were just flat out lazy and wanted some time off. The employers aren't always right and can be true ###holes
to be sure,but there is always another view of a story.

 

[PF1996]

I seem to be the only one but I really don't get what the big deal is about this article. What new information is being reported? Isn't it common knowledge that the average football player suffers from physical ailments after football? Isn't it common knowledge that teams are primarily concerned with winning games? Isn't it common knowledge that concussions are underreported?

Don't know why Belichick allowed him to do full contact practice...but it was PRACTICE and it was FOUR DAYS later. Everyone's acting as though Belichick played him the day after he had his concussion. Also don't understand Ted Johnson's problem. He didn't seem to have any problem playing with concussions yet he's mad he had to practice four days after sustaining one. Whatever.

Call me coldhearted, but I don't understand why this is news. Hopefully Belichick isn't distracted by this silliness.

 

[dhamz]

There appears to be some conflicting information on Johnson's return to practice. His statements put him back in contact at the first practice and getting a second concussion from minimal contact.

Another item to consider is how forceful the hit in practice on J.R. Redmond back in 2002 was. This is the description in the MacMullan article:

In the 9-on-7 drill, running back J.R. Redmond barreled up the middle, where Johnson was waiting. Although the two only made mild contact, Johnson said he immediately began experiencing the warm, hazy sensation of a concussion.

But note how Nick Cafardo reported it the day after it happened, on August 14th, 2002:

Ted Johnson suffered a concussion in last Saturday's 22-19 loss to the New York Giants, which is why he wore a red shirt at Monday's practice. Yesterday, he made quite a hit on J.R. Redmond to stuff him in a goal-line situation.
Was it "mild contact" or "quite a hit?" Who is exaggerating here?

MacMullan's piece leads you to believe that Johnson was placed in full action the very next practice after the hit he took in the Giants game. The Cafardo piece tells us that Johnson was in the red practice jersey on Monday, and then the Redmond hit was on Tuesday.

http://www.bostonsportsmedia.com/

The sad truth of this story is that absolutely nothing out of the ordinary was done. Nothing that doesn't happen doens of times a year across the league. In the Denver/San Fran game, Jay Cutler left the game in the first half after hitting his helmet on the ground. Jake comes in, plays like Jake and they go back to Cutler to start the second half. The announcers, everyone watching the game were commenting on how he was playing in a fog and speculating about a concussion. Yet you heard no outrage about it after the game. Troy Aikman was suffering from severe post concusion syndrome during one of the Cowboys Super Bowl runs does not even remember playing in the Championship game.

“I got knocked out of the 1993 NFC Championship Game (with a concussion),” Aikman said. “I still don’t remember playing in that game. I should not have played in the Super Bowl (which was just a week later). But I didn’t know if I would get another chance to play in a Super Bowl."

http://www.giants.com/news/eisen/story.asp?story_id=5342

Players want to play. The teams and coaches want them to play. The fans want them to play. No one is too concerned about their long term health. Sitting out isn't acceptable to anyone, least of all the injured player. Despite the "players don't lose their job to injury" myth, that is exactly what they all fear. It is why Ted Johnson had 2 DOZEN cocncussions that he didn't report. "Soft" players get benched or cut and with a player's union more concerned with money than the health of its members it will happen and continue to happen.

 

[NEPat]

Don't know why Belichick allowed him to do full contact practice...but it was PRACTICE and it was FOUR DAYS later. Everyone's acting as though Belichick played him the day after he had his concussion. Also don't understand Ted Johnson's problem. He didn't seem to have any problem playing with concussions yet he's mad he had to practice four days after sustaining one. Whatever.

The main thing I see is not the timeline, but that he practiced after the trainer said he wasn't cleared. And Belichick overruled that.

 

[BPF]

http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

I am not buying it, I tend to agree with the story below. Too many questions with Ted Johnson's mental state.

POSTED 8:58 a.m. EST, February 2, 2007

JOHNSON CLAIMS BELICHICK FORCED HIM TO PRACTICE HURT

Former Patriots linebacker Ted Johnson claims that coach Bill Belichick required him to practice, and subjected him to hard hits, while Johnson was recovering from a concussion in 2002.

"There's something wrong with me," Johnson told the New York Times. "There's something wrong with my brain. And I know when it started."

Okay, time out. Because to the extent that the Times or anyone else has decided to anoint Johnson as the new poster child for the very real problem of player health after their playing days end, we don't think Johnson is the right guy to carry the flag.

Because Johnson was contemplating returning to the Patriots in 2006.

So let's be realistic about this. Johnson apparently realizes that the family of former Steelers center Mike Webster recently cashed in (and deservedly so) for a claim that his chronic depression was caused by football injuries. And Johnson, like other former football players who don't make nearly as much money after their playing careers end, could be tempted by the lure of a nice score.

We're not saying the Johnson isn't impaired in some way or that his doctors are embellishing his condition. But there's a danger that someone who really isn't in bad shape will try to get a Mike Webster-type payday via exaggeration and/or fabrication.

And the fact that Johnson is *****ing about Belichick barely a month after he was musing about returning to the team that Belichick coaches fairly calls Johnson's overall motives into question. Why would the guy even consider returning to the Patriots in 2006 after Junior Seau was hurt if he believes that Belichick contributed to Johnson's current plight? And why not mention when explaining that he was expecting to get a call from the Pats that there were some things that happened in the past that might make him uncomfortable about going back?

Maybe Johnson didn't say anything about it because he still hoped his phone would ring. And maybe because it didn't ring Johnson is now mad, and thus is lashing out at the team.

We're not saying that this is what's happening, but the circumstances clearly suggest that these are fair questions to raise.

 

[Brady to Brown]

Its all in the Patriots man games missed due to injuries.

Look at the history Belichick has with the Patriots and injuries. They are near the top of the NFL every year in man games missed. So where is the pressure to play injured?

No way Johnson "had" to play.

I feel bad about Johnson's situation, he should have taken steps to limit it as he became aware it was a problem.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Bruinz, thanks for mentioning the article. I did not get to it, but did click the one on Vyrago's link... it sheds some light. I think I have the gist though -- that the NFL and NFLPA basically have shook hands and called it a day on concussions, under the guise of a committee to "investigate" these "mild" traumas.

So what would you, as a fan of this team and the game, do?

I personally wrote in support of (on another subject) Bruschi feeling free to retire, after the 04/05 stroke. He just did not know the territory he was in.

But would I -- would we -- support a guy after 1 concussion? 2? 5? That is, if it made its way into the media? Or would we talk about how important the Denver game is, or the Indy game, or whatever game he would "leave us in the lurch" on? Wouldn't part of you say "Oh for Christ's sake, walk it off?"

Maybe not.... maybe even if we would think that, we shouldn't. I just see the game's rep and image as part of the problem. It's the ultimate "tough guy" ball game... That's the product we fans consume, and from the League's point of view, the "goose that laid the golden egg." You can not "water down" that toughness past a certain point, but then we read something like the TJ story and, well, here we are.

Maybe that's why the committee studying these "mild" traumas pretty much say "walk it off. Rub some dirt on it!" Maybe team doctors need to run into a hefty malpractice suit or two, for injuries beyond the expected scope of a really violent game, when they willfully and knowingly send a guy back in who needs not to be.

PFnV