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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Kid~Brady, Dec 4, 2019.

  1. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady In the Starting Line-Up

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    ..... at drafting and/or developing Wide Receivers?

    From players like Bethal Johnson, Taylor Price, Aaron Dobson, David Givens and we all remember the Chad Johnson debacle. Remember the Brandon Tate pick, wasn't he picked literally right before Mike Wallace by the Steelers? The same team that ALWAYS seems to have a good grasp on how to draft WRs.

    I will give them credit for Edelman and D. Branch, Troy Brown and of course Gronk and Hernandez but other than these guys, who have they really drafted and developed into superstars? Why are the patriots so below average in this state? I see all these other teams, including the Buccaneers (I live in Florida) draft all of this amazing wide receivers and offensive talent. Why has Bill missed on these same talents?

    Anyone else feel this way?
     
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  2. maust1013

    maust1013 Just Another Guy PatsFans.com Supporter Weekly Picks Winner

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    Oh good another clickbait style thread title...

    Anyone else feel this way?
     
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  3. Tunescribe

    Tunescribe PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter Weekly Picks Winner

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    Cliffhanger thread titles are the worst. Except for the one I did today in my AB thread, which no one seemed to appreciate.
     
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  4. Clonamery

    Clonamery PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Anyone? Or...”everyone?”
     
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  5. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady In the Starting Line-Up

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    haha sorry. It crossed my mind and it's just one of those days ;)
     
  6. 203Pat

    203Pat In the Starting Line-Up

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    I’m not out on Harry yet as he’s only played two games but I’ll admit so far I’m not liking what I’m seeing. He’s not a fluid route runner and seemed to just give up after Roby tugged him on the INT.
     
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  7. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady In the Starting Line-Up

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    Not sure. I'm an accountant, I like numbers :cool:
     
  8. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady Pro Bowl Player

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    I'm enraged that you do not consider David Givens a success. Dude was a beast for us got paid and then he got a brutal injury. Givens was awesome.
     
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  9. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    David Givens was a fantastic pick. Excellent. You'd be hard-pressed to do any better.

    50 receptions per year for 2 or 3 years and 15 yards per catch for a 7th rounder? Not going to do any better than that.

    As for Troy Brown, he was not picked by the Belichick front office.

    Also don't forget Ben Watson. He's had a very long and productive career.

    Many receivers do not pan out, but the Patriots have been consistently bad. Between Price, Dobson, Jackson, Tate, Mitchell and Bethel, only Mitchell worked out--though his career was ended by his injuries. This is bad.

    We know Brady can play with the Reche Caldwell's and Jabar Gaffney's of the world, but most of the drafted receivers aren't even of that quality.

    And we know this is true since none of these receivers have excelled when they left for other teams. So the method of evaluation is flawed.

    Which is bizarre since the Patriots have usually done well when taking under-regarded players from other teams like David Patten or Wes Welker or Chris Hogan and allowing them to flourish here.
     
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    Last edited: Dec 5, 2019
  10. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady In the Starting Line-Up

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    You're right and thats my mistake. I definitely take that name back
     
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  11. maust1013

    maust1013 Just Another Guy PatsFans.com Supporter Weekly Picks Winner

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    Bro, if I had feelings they'd be hurt. I'm married with children, as such I readily accept being relegated to nobody status. Getting dropped down to being 'no one' here of all places...
    Well that's just like salt in a wound right there or maybe more like...

    [​IMG]
     
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  12. 203Pat

    203Pat In the Starting Line-Up

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    Bill claiming he would rather have Johnathan Baldwin over Julio in that draft shows he has an odd way of evaluating receivers.
     
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  13. oldrover

    oldrover "You're gonna have to serve somebody..." PatsFans.com Supporter

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    One reviewer did... he featured you on his show.

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. PatsFan2

    PatsFan2 Pro Bowl Player Weekly Picks Winner

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    Yikes heard that too with lack of success at that specific position BB shouldn't be shopping for the groceries there.:oops:
     
  15. KontradictioN

    KontradictioN Florida Man PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Harry has played in a total of two games and has never had the speed to create separation. His ceiling will be Boldin and his floor will be complete trash. But he’s a guy that the game is currently moving at a million miles per hour for on the field and he’s forgetting to do some of the little things (like running a route correctly) because of that. In other words, a rookie. A rookie playing in the hardest offense in the NFL to learn. He’ll have to learn to use that big body of his to pull down the ball. Hopefully he will, and quickly. But don’t blame him for the growing pains of the offense that are brought on because they’re trying to work in rookies at the WR positions. Blame the people who decided that this was the way to go while hoping they’ll eventually end up being right.
     
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  16. luuked

    luuked Pro Bowl Player

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    That is a myth that has been debunked so many times. I don't understand how the Steelers being this supposedly amazing WR drafting team keeps coming up. They have had their fair share of duds. But they also take many more swings at it.

    Here is the list of WR the Pats have taken in the first four rounds in the BB era:

    Branch 02, Johnson 03, Jackson 06, Tate 09, Price 10, Dobson 13, Boyce 14, Mitchell 16, Harry 19

    Steelers:

    Burress 00, Randle 02, Gibson 05, Holmes 06, Reid 06, Sweed 08, Wallace 09, Sanders 10, Wheaton 13, Archer 14, Bryant 14, Coates 15, Schuster 17, Washington 18, Johnson 19

    It is 9 picks vs. 15 picks. And if you look at the list of their WRs I think it is obvious why I refer to them ALWAYS having a good grasp to be a myth.


    The complexity to learn the Pats offense on a rookie who comes into the league has been well documented. Unlike veterans they come in and are not only trying to understand the playbook, but have to upgrade their physique, polish and clean up their fundamentals (route running, how to use your body, ect.) and figure out life as a pro.

    It doesn't help that projections from college to the pros are a crapshoot even if some snake oil salesmen want to tell you differently. If they weren't then we would not have as many busts every year through the league.

    Also in the end -- and maybe most importantly -- roster building doesn't exclusively consist of the draft. If you can find pieces that can do specific roles for you -- based on proven NFL level film -- for a reasonable price (be it FA or a trade) then your assets are often better spend on other positions in the draft.

    And lets not get started how much of it also is affected by long term thinking in terms of having continuity for players that will leave through FA.

    The last point is why the lack of TE picks has been so baffling. The pipeline there has been ignored for too long. But as with everything I am sure there was a reasonable logic behind prioritizing other positions. I am sure nobody just "forgot" about it or thought it was "unimportant".

    Ultimately roster building is a bunch of compromises given the constraints set by the league in terms of roster size and cap space.
     
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  17. nabwong

    nabwong Vice President of Boycott NFL Club PatsFans.com Supporter Weekly Picks Winner

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    Jury remains out for Harry. He runs a similar 40 to Larry Fitzgerald so it’s not a given he can’t get separation. Right now, it’s a mental thing for him. He doesn’t know the offense.
     
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    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019
  18. condon84

    condon84 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Myers looks like he can be a productive receiver in this offense.

    Agree with @KontradictioN regarding Harry.

    As for other receivers picked, they just weren't good. None of them have gone on to different teams and been productive. Our FO simply misfired on them.
     
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  19. 203Pat

    203Pat In the Starting Line-Up

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    I’d be extremely happy if he ended up like Anquan Boldin.
     
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  20. KontradictioN

    KontradictioN Florida Man PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I’d even be happy if he ended up like Michael Bolton.
     
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