Are Colts more formidable than Broncos?

[BobDigital]

People seem to underrate Hilton and overrate D. Thomas IMO.

Both are top 10 WRs of course but maybe you built up Thomas to be something he isn't due to his stats and playing with Manning.

Thomas is good but he can be stopped a number of ways. He is jammable at the line and his speed/quickness though good is not elite. He has size but is not overly physical.

Basically he is an all round good WR. However we saw him being taken away by Revis and Browner 1v1 at times. The different here is that is not possible with Hilton. I am not sure right now anyone can contain him 1v1. He is too quick for CBs who like to lose strength and jam and too quick for CB who try to stay with him and cover.

Though he might not be as likely to catch a 50/50 ball as Thomas due to his size his ability to consistently get separation against top CBs i think is better. So i think overall he is more dangerous at least in today's game when holding is called so easily.

 

[Deus Irae]

People keep saying that about Luck while he keeps throwing bonehead pass after bonehead pass. Maybe it will happen for him, but he's in, what, year 3? He strikes me as closer to Drew Bledsoe (except for the mobility) than Peyton Manning.

Luck's got a 26:9 TD:INT ratio (which is basically 3:1), is completing more than 63.5% of his passes, has a QB rating of over 100, is #1 in the NFL in passing yardage, #2 in TDs and #9 in yards/pass attempt. He's doing just fine, and the only thing he really has in common with Bledsoe is the ability to shrug off a hit.

 

[ausbacker]

People seem to underrate Hilton and overrate D. Thomas IMO.

Both are top 10 WRs of course but maybe you built up Thomas to be something he isn't due to his stats and playing with Manning.

Thomas is good but he can be stopped a number of ways. He is jammable at the line and his speed/quickness though good is not elite. He has size but is not overly physical.

Basically he is an all round good WR. However we saw him being taken away by Revis and Browner 1v1 at times. The different here is that is not possible with Hilton. I am not sure right now anyone can contain him 1v1. He is too quick for CBs who like to lose strength and jam and too quick for CB who try to stay with him and cover.

Though he might not be as likely to catch a 50/50 ball as Thomas due to his size his ability to consistently get separation against top CBs i think is better. So i think overall he is more dangerous at least in today's game when holding is called so easily.

If someone doesn't agree with your assessment, that doesn't mean one player is overrated or one player is underrated. Hilton is becoming a very good WR but he doesn't pose the dual threat that Thomas does. Thomas can beat you with size and speed were Hilton generally beats you with speed.

Thomas is the superior WR at this stage of their careers but the Colts should be encouraged by the development of Hilton.

 

[BobDigital]

BTW so you can criticize me with knowing where i stand. my current top 10 pass catchers in the NFL when healthy

Edit: Now that i look at it i think Julio is too low so i changed it.

1) Gronk 2) Calvin Johnson 3) Josh Gordon 4) AJ Green 5) Dez Bryant 6) Julio Jones 7) Antonio Brown 8) Jimmy Graham 9) TY Hilton 10) D. Thomas

I am pretty sure putting Hilton and Brown on this list will piss people off as they are not seen as physical freaks and are not 6'3+ However i don't think you need to be tall to be an elite WR if your quickness/speed is good enough.

Also keep in mind this is regular season rankings as the playoffs are a bit of a different game.

 

[rochrist]

Luck's got a 26:9 TD:INT ratio (which is basically 3:1), is completing more than 63.5% of his passes, has a QB rating of over 100, is #1 in the NFL in passing yardage, #2 in TDs and #9 in yards/pass attempt. He's doing just fine, and the only thing he really has in common with Bledsoe is the ability to shrug off a hit.

And up to this year, his quarterback rating was 81.5. His rating for his first 3 playoff games is 68 (with 8 interceptions in those three games). You may have missed the part where I said it may happen for him. Perhaps it's this year. The jury is still out until they play some real teams.

 

[BobDigital]

If someone doesn't agree with your assessment, that doesn't mean one player is overrated or one player is underrated. Hilton is becoming a very good WR but he does't pose the dual threat that Thomas does. Thomas can beat you with size and speed were Hilton generally beats you with speed.

Thomas is the superior WR at this stage of their careers but the Colts should be encouraged by the development of Hilton.

I think you took that the wrong way. I am not trying to sound vain. I do believe right now Hilton is more dangerous overall as a player than D. Thomas. I am aware that it is an opinion a lot of people won't share. Therefore what am i to say except that people think Thomas is better than i do and Hilton is worse that I do. I am not calling them wrong i am just saying i disagree and think different. I was not trying to talk down to anyone or act like they are dumb cause they don't agree.

 

[Deus Irae]

And up to this year, his quarterback rating was 81.5. His rating for his first 3 playoff games is 68 (with 8 interceptions in those three games). You may have missed the part where I said it may happen for him. Perhaps it's this year. The jury is still out until they play some real teams.

I didn't miss anything. I responded to your post:

People keep saying that about Luck while he keeps throwing bonehead pass after bonehead pass.

That's you, with your words, talking about what Luck's doing now, not last year or in past playoff games.

 

[mayoclinic]

BTW so you can criticize me with knowing where i stand. my current top 10 pass catchers in the NFL when healthy

1) Gronk 2) Calvin Johnson 3) Josh Gordon 4) AJ Green 5) Dez Bryant 6) Antonio Brown 7) Jimmy Graham 8) TY Hilton 9) Julio Jones 10) D. Thomas

I am pretty sure putting Hilton and Brown on this list will piss people off as they are not seen as physical freaks and are not 6'3+ However i don't think you need to be tall to be an elite WR if your quickness/speed is good enough.

I LOVE Antonio Brown. Next to Julio Jones, probably my favorite receiver in the NFL.

It's a matter of personal preference and judgment. JMHO, but I think you seriously overrate AJ Green. And while Josh Gordon was a beast last year, he has serious issues, and a smaller body of work, though I agree the talent level is there. I'd take Julio Jones, Demaryius Thomas and Antonio Brown atop the WR list, personally.

I think a lot of things go into making a complete receiver: running good routes, getting in and out of their breaks, getting separation, tracking the ball, hands, YAC. Being able to run the entire route tree. Also things like physicality, blocking. One reason that I like Julio Jones so much is that he excels in all those aspects, including blocking. He's a much, much more complete player than Josh Gordon or AJ Green, IMO.

Having a different opinion does not equal criticizing you.

 

[ausbacker]

I think you took that the wrong way. I am not trying to sound vain. I do believe right now Hilton is more dangerous overall as a player than D. Thomas. I am aware that it is an opinion a lot of people won't share. Therefore what am i to say except that people think Thomas is better than i do and Hilton is worse that I do. I am not calling them wrong i am just saying i disagree and think different. I was not trying to talk down to anyone or act like they are dumb cause they don't agree.

That's fine, but not one pundit is going to throw T.Y. Hilton into a discussion for the elite Wide Receivers in the game. As @mayoclinic eloquently put it, there's a list of at least 5-10 guys vying for the top 3 positions. Hilton is not one of them but he may well be in the future.

 

[mayoclinic]

That's fine, but not one pundit is going to throw T.Y. Hilton into a discussion for the elite Wide Receivers in the game. As @mayoclinic eloquently put it, there's a list of at least 5-10 guys vying for the top 3 positions. Hilton is not one of them but he may well be in the future.

I think that TY Hilton is a bit like DeSean Jackson - a very, very dangerous guy who can burn you at any time. Hilton has been on fire so far this season and is playing better than Jackson right now, but Jackson has a greater body of work. Both very, very fine receivers, but I wouldn't personally take them in the top 5.

 

[BobDigital]

I LOVE Antonio Brown. Next to Julio Jones, probably my favorite receiver in the NFL.

It's a matter of personal preference and judgment. JMHO, but I think you seriously overrate AJ Green. And while Josh Gordon was a beast last year, he has serious issues, and a smaller body of work, though I agree the talent level is there. I'd take Julio Jones, Demaryius Thomas and Antonio Brown atop the WR list, personally.

Having a different opinion does not equal criticizing you.

Oh i didn't mean criticize in a really bad way : P But this is a message board so please feel free to share your differences. That is why we are here right : P

I saw that list after i was done and also thought JJ was too low so i changed it. I might change it in a few weeks again depending on if my impressions change. You are right about AJ Green. He has a few holes in his game and is a bit soft. Also i am aware Gordon has a small body of work and I am basing a lot off of just 12 games really. However I just really like AJ Green but if i was to suddenly drop a WR down 4 weeks from now it be him depending on how he does.

 

[BobDigital]

I think that TY Hilton is a bit like DeSean Jackson - a very, very dangerous guy who can burn you at any time. Hilton has been on fire so far this season and is playing better than Jackson right now, but Jackson has a greater body of work. Both very, very fine receivers, but I wouldn't personally take them in the top 5.

Anyway I don't want to get too much off topic and make the thread about me.

I do think Hilton has near the pure speed of Jackson. Maybe just a half step slower but his quickness IMO looks a full step better within 10 yards. His get off the line is REALLY good from what i have seen of him. I think Browner/Revis will have a have hard time jamming him. Maybe I am wrong and if proven so will be happy cause it means this will be an easier game than i think.

McCourty should play an extra few yards deeper than usual this game and the CBs should not be afraid to hold him if they get beat bad off the line. This is a WR that if he gets the ball in the open field can turn 5 yards in a 20 before the safety cuts off the angle. Better off taking a few extra holding and PI calls instead.

 

[CaffeineMan]

Statistically, Hilton is having a slightly better year than D. Thomas. It doesn't address the scouting items (blocking, physicality) but his stats I think put him in the conversation this year, both for normal stats and advanced stats. Top 5 in Outsiders stats, slightly higher than D. Thomas in Burke's advancedfootballanalytics.com stats.
Somebody to account for in the game plan next week, for sure. The advantage is that Indy doesn't have the other options like Denver does. Wayne is way down the list this year.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Not even close. Denver's D is still legit. We put up forty on them but fourteen came off two picks letting us start deep in their territory. Seven on a punt return, and three more on a FG where the drive started in their territory. That adds up to twenty-four points you can't really pin on their D in that game.

Whenever I've seen the Colts D play in a spotlight game the other team pretty much had their way with them.

Both offenses are oustanding but the defenses aren't even close IMO.

 

[rochrist]

I didn't miss anything. I responded to your post:



That's you, with your words, talking about what Luck's doing now, not last year or in past playoff games.

You know, how about you man up and disagree instead of just hitting dislike over and over again. I tried to be fair to you, I've agreed with you at time, even liked some of things you post. But you're just fixated on being a ****, so I am done with you. You aren't worth the effort.

 

[Deus Irae]

You know, how about you man up and disagree instead of just hitting dislike over and over again.

How do you not see the irony of your post?

Of course

Dislike x 2 frongi rochrist

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

BTW so you can criticize me with knowing where i stand. my current top 10 pass catchers in the NFL when healthy

Edit: Now that i look at it i think Julio is too low so i changed it.

1) Gronk 2) Calvin Johnson 3) Josh Gordon 4) AJ Green 5) Dez Bryant 6) Julio Jones 7) Antonio Brown 8) Jimmy Graham 9) TY Hilton 10) D. Thomas

AJ Green wayy too high. Overrated IMO. DT is better then Hilton IMO

 

[Boogs]

The colts are inconsistent. They started slow and have been playing well on both sides of the ball. The Steelers put it to them a couple of weeks ago. But we know the Steelers are hot right now too.

The Colts are a very dangerous team, but the Broncos are better and more talented.

 

[Boogs]

Not even close. Denver's D is still legit. We put up forty on them but fourteen came off two picks letting us start deep in their territory. Seven on a punt return, and three more on a FG where the drive started in their territory. That adds up to twenty-four points you can't really pin on their D in that game.

Whenever I've seen the Colts D play in a spotlight game the other team pretty much had their way with them.

Both offenses are oustanding but the defenses aren't even close IMO.

I agree. Denver's defense is very talented and Denver's D is better than the colts. The Colts D has been playing well lately except for Big Ben who tore them up 2 weeks ago.

 

[kennyb]

Colts are tough. Definitely tougher to win there than beat denver here.