PatsFans.com - Mobile
PatsFans.com
Search

4 games in (EDIT Now HALF)/, let's talk spending spree (SUPER EDIT Regular season ending extravaganza)

Current Patriots Twitter Feed:

50-yard-line

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Huh? Davis has 257 yards and 3 touchdowns through 4 games
JAGholor has 165 yards and 1 touchdown through 4 games.

There will be more bombs Corey will catch. He's bigger, stronger, and faster than Nelson. He also has far better hands and crisper route running.
And Davis is playing in an offense that's going to air it out all the time and take shots down the field. He's being targeted more than Agholor and is getting about a yard per target more because of one play, really. He has almost no competition for the ball over there - Berrios? Please.

Is he a "better" receiver? I'd say yes, and like I said, I really like his game. Is he a better receiver for the money in a New England offense as they constructed it? I don't know. I'd have been thrilled with Davis, sure, but he's not head and shoulders above Agholor.

Patriots shut him down to nothing.

If you switched the teams for the two, you'd probably be seeing very different numbers.
 

203Pat

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Judon has been a stud and Mills has been a pleasant surprise. The rest of them have been average to bad.
 

captain stone

Hall of Fame Poster
Jonnu Smith is a ****ing Disgrace. He should've been benched for the TB game if Bill still actually cared about the t-e-a-m.
 
Last edited:

jah

Degeneracy Expert
PatsFans.com Supporter
These aren't my evaluations of the players straight up, but rather my evaluations of how they've justified the new contracts:

Underpaid: Judon, Karras
Seems about right: Bourne, Mills, Van Noy
Minor overpay:
Henry, Godchaux, Anderson
Comical overpay: Agholor, Smith

This isn't to say even Agholor or Smith are lost causes. In camp, reports were that Agholor looked like our best WR at times, and I certainly liked what I saw from Smith over Henry before the real games were played (after which my opinion turned around completely).

I think some people will take offense that I placed Henry in one of the "overpaid" tiers. I just don't think 600 yards and 10 TD (roughly his full season projection), without elite blocking ability, is worth $12.5M/year.
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Wasted money on Jonnu, Godchaux, Mills, Agholor. Jonnu is actually good and a elite run after catch guy but didn't make sense to sign 2 TEs with an oc who has no clue how to use 2 TEs. Jonnu is being used as a fullback and 6th OLineman, it's silly. Agholor isn't an elite WR and always had butterfingers, don't know why anyone is even surprised by his numbers. BB is surrounded by a mediocre front office staff.
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
These aren't my evaluations of the players straight up, but rather my evaluations of how they've justified the new contracts:

Underpaid: Judon, Karras
Seems about right: Bourne, Mills, Van Noy
Minor overpay: Henry, Godchaux, Anderson
Comical overpay: Agholor, Smith

This isn't to say even Agholor or Smith are lost causes. In camp, reports were that Agholor looked like our best WR at times, and I certainly liked what I saw from Smith over Henry before the real games were played (after which my opinion turned around completely).

I think some people will take offense that I placed Henry in one of the "overpaid" tiers. I just don't think 600 yards and 10 TD (roughly his full season projection), without elite blocking ability, is worth $12.5M/year.

To your last sentence.... On some plays they're using Henry and Jonnu wrong. When not in red zone, Hunter should be staying in to block and have Jonnu run the route . They have these dumb plays where Jonnu is expected to block the defensive right end all by himself, a schematically moronic design.
 

Scotty

In the Starting Line-Up
From the NFL stat site......

Jonnu Smith at Tennessee in 2020 , 15 games , 41 receptions , 448 yards and 8 touchdowns
Jonnu Smith at Patriots in 2021 so far , 9 games , 21 receptions , 193 yards and 1 touchdown

So in 2021 , is this how he is being used or has he gone backwards in performance ?
 

50-yard-line

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
SSS - Small sample size. Pure eye test from a TV watcher:
Revisiting my original post.
Bourne was a steal at $5/per.

Yup, staying with this. An absolute steal at 5per.
Henry and Smith will only get better. Glad they're here - Henry looks like the more complete player, but Smith might well prove to be the most explosive YAC guy on the team.
Henry's numbers are pretty much as advertised - he's playing the same as he did in SD (more TDs), and I'm okay with that in a new offense, on a team with 24 new players, with a rookie QB and an OL that hasn't quite stabilized yet.

Smith has been disappointing, indeed. Haven't given up on him, though, as he's shown flashes and battled injuries.

A post earlier said that BB got ahead of the market, and I agree with that. TE is a tough gig and an important piece that teams are leaning on more and more, and looking around the league now, I think it's safe to say that by the time we're into year 3 of these deals, neither of these two will be paid anywhere near top 5 TE money. Still glad they're here, just want to see Smith kick it up about 5 notches.

Agholor is being paid what he's worth. He's not being paid like a top WR, and he's not. Might have been too much $$$ for what the Pats want him to do, this far at least - hopefully we'll see some 40-50 yarders as the team settles in. Still, very glad he's here.

He's not being used as a #1 (not paid as 1, either) but the philosophy here doesn't call for a #1, pretty clearly. The true #1's are getting 17+/year and are demanding the ball often (when healthy - and their teams are crippled when they're not).

The Pat are obviously looking to spread it around - three WRs, two TEs, and an RB are going to get 4-8 targets/game. So none are typically going to stand out compared to the go-to guys on other teams.

Even Harry is going to get his plays in this offense (heads explode!). He had 15 snaps the other night and was targeted twice. On the first, drew a PI for a first down in the first TD drive. The second was a 10-yard reception for a first down in the second TD drive.

That's the way they're going to play it, and they've got a QB who can handle that very well. They're going to look for the mismatches and demand that no defense can take X player away.
Standing by this 100%. Agholor is being paid like a #2, which is what he is.

Agholor has 22 for 335 and 2tds. 11million/year/2years

Look at the other guys that came out:

Davis has 24 for 349 and 4tds. 12.5million/year/3years
Curtis Samuel is hurt and doing nothing - 2 for 19. 11.5million/year/3years
Golladay has 19 for 310 and 0tds. 18million/year/4years

Agholor stays on the field and does what he's asked to do. His attitude has been great, from all I've heard. No complaints, doing his job. No regrets from me on this signing.

Andrews is looking really rough so far. Not sure what's going on there, but he really needs to be better. he's not making a lot of money, and I have full faith in the guy helping Mac and that line getting where they need to be.
Had faith in the guy (maybe it was the baby) - great value!

On Defense: PFF be damned, Judon was the key here, and he's a steal at 14/per.
Said it before they signed him, never looked back - best signing of the off-season. Becoming a leader on that team, for 2 million less than the Lions paid Flowers years ago..

Godchaux is looking better the last couple of games, but still looks iffy for that contract. Wise, too, surprised me with that contract. BB wants these guys to be leaders on that D. Hope it's happening behind the scenes.

Guy was a steal coming back.
Staying with this, too. The run D has tightened as the guys have sorted it out more completely, and Godchaux has been great in short yardage. Overpaid trio? No bank-breakers there, and despite the terrible start, the Pats are now 14th in run defense, and getting better all the time.


Jalen Mills is looking worth every penny they paid him.
Staying with this. He wasn't expensive and he's doing everything asked of him, even though he's been playing out of position with Jones gone. I still think he's going to replace Devin Mac, maybe next year. Great value for the Pats. As advertised with versatility.

Tough break for Anderson, but these things happen (which is reflective of the way BB spends money).
...still like the guy and hope he can play again in the NFl.

Van Noy is making solid money for veteran contributions. Glad to have him at that price.
Not so sure on this right now. I have a hard time evaluating Van Noy. Sometimes a world-beater, sometimes a head-scratcher. Still, he's not breaking any banks, provides a veteran, knowledgeable presence...

Right now, and I hate to say it, the worst contract on the team is Hightower. He really hasn't looked good - but the guy had a year off and isn't a kid. Watch him take over that D in the second half when he gets his legs under him (much like Gronk did in Tampa last year).
HT is starting to play like HT again, and it shows.

This should be a 2-2 team, could be a 3-1 team, but they're a 1-3 team and you are what your record says you are. We'll learn a lot about the characters of the guys they brought in over the next few weeks. No letdown in Houston, I hope.

Yes, I remain a homer. I'm very optimistic for the future. If this team clicks, they have 5 weapons on the field every play.

Biggest mistake this year looks like trading Michel. Stevenson and Taylor have to step up.
Above 500, playing very well...I'm not surprised. I still think a playoff spot is a long-shot. They've got a tough stretch coming up.

Bolden has made me wrong on the last line. I thought that he was underused years ago, but never believed that he could become as big a part of the offense as he has, particularly in his 30's. As in, he's the biggest pleasant surprise this year.
 
Last edited:

TheRainMaker

My Mom says I'm a catch
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Was the market that bad for Judon last off-season? He was rumored to be asking for $20M per season. I said when he signed and still say his deal was a massive steal.
 

JayNM

In the Starting Line-Up
Was the market that bad for Judon last off-season? I said when he said and still say his deal was a massive steal.
From what I gathered he was a good to great player in Bal, but they didnt lean heavily on him. I doubt he would have got more in the Market last year (Given Covid and all), but we approached him early and felt like a slight overpay at the beginning, if im being honest

But yeah, he has GROWN in the system. No matter some posters say, but Ozzy is a great GM... but he misjudged Judon there, this guy has DPOY potential
 

TheRainMaker

My Mom says I'm a catch
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
From the NFL stat site......

Jonnu Smith at Tennessee in 2020 , 15 games , 41 receptions , 448 yards and 8 touchdowns
Jonnu Smith at Patriots in 2021 so far , 9 games , 21 receptions , 193 yards and 1 touchdown

So in 2021 , is this how he is being used or has he gone backwards in performance ?
It’s how he’s being used. It seems like the only time I see him getting a reception is off of a gimmick screen. He’s better than that.
 

venecol

The FRG has a little ****
PatsFans.com Supporter
2021 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Was the market that bad for Judon last off-season? He was rumored to be asking for $20M per season. I said when he signed and still say his deal was a massive steal.
The rumors w/ Judon was that because he played in a high blitz D at BAL he found himself w/ a lot of 1-on-1s or even free rushes to the QB; concern being he could be neutralized by OLs once more attention was placed on him. Obviously they were dead wrong.
 

RobertWeathers

Author of the Port Huron Statement
It’s how he’s being used. It seems like the only time I see him getting a reception is off of a gimmick screen. He’s better than that.
With the protection issues Mac was having I don't blame them for keep him back and then made avail on screens.

They feel Henry is the better receiver and Smith the better pass blocker. They aren't wrong.
 

PATSYLICIOUS

Pro Bowl Player
Seems about the same now as then… agholor and smith are the only contracts that really make you upset. but still think both could become bigger factors and have ‘flashed’
 

203Pat

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
These aren't my evaluations of the players straight up, but rather my evaluations of how they've justified the new contracts:

Underpaid: Judon, Karras
Seems about right: Bourne, Mills, Van Noy
Minor overpay: Henry, Godchaux, Anderson
Comical overpay: Agholor, Smith

This isn't to say even Agholor or Smith are lost causes. In camp, reports were that Agholor looked like our best WR at times, and I certainly liked what I saw from Smith over Henry before the real games were played (after which my opinion turned around completely).

I think some people will take offense that I placed Henry in one of the "overpaid" tiers. I just don't think 600 yards and 10 TD (roughly his full season projection), without elite blocking ability, is worth $12.5M/year.

I think Van Noy is overpaid. He looks like he is over the hill and doesn't make much of an impact. Whatever Godchaux makes he's overpaid. Jonnu is looking more and more like a bust and Agholor was overpaid the minute the ink dried on that contract. That being said, for what they paid Judon, Bourne, and Karras those guys so far look like bargains.
 

TheRainMaker

My Mom says I'm a catch
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
The rumors w/ Judon was that because he played in a high blitz D at BAL he found himself w/ a lot of 1-on-1s or even free rushes to the QB; concern being he could be neutralized by OLs once more attention was placed on him. Obviously they were dead wrong.
This was exactly my concerns as well.
 

Top