Gronk trade completed

sb1 said:

Yep.

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And that was out best offensive showing of any of the superbowls.

Ras-IR Dowling said:

Colts most certainly did tank. Had a nice 13 game losing streak that season.

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When I think about it really doesn’t make sense for a team’s personnel to agree to tank. Teams that win 2 games almost always end up firing a bunch of people and getting rid of players so where’s the benefit to them to tank? Colts fired their president, GM, coach and gutted their roster to become a younger team. So if they tanked all those people got no benefit out of it at all.

That’s why I don’t think teams do it. They were just a lousy team.

festy1986 said:

And that was out best offensive showing of any of the superbowls.

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That was Brady’s best SB game by a mile.

sb1 said:

Not nearly as stupid as the talk of the departure of a 43 year old QB who was kinda terrible the second half of last year takes us from a SB contender in 2020 to a team that will pick high in the draft next year.

That, or they haven’t been paying attention much to their own team.

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The Colts didn't just lose Manning, genius. They went through 4 different QBs (Manning, Painter, Orlovsky, Collins).

Your posts on this topic suck like a black hole convention. Just accept that and move on.

Deus Irae said:

The Colts didn't just lose Manning, genius. They went through 4 different QBs.

Your posts on this topic suck like a black hole convention. Just accept that and move on.

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So what? They sucked without Manning. Pats haven’t sucked yet without Brady other than Bill’s first season. Facts. So I’ll give Bill the benefit of the doubt on this one too.
Not my fault you’d prefer I curl up with my thumb in my mouth over Brady’s departure. See no reason to do that. I’ve moved on.

sb1 said:

Hindsight 20/20 and all. Im certain nobody was thinking Super Bowl at the time.

I think I’ve proven that there’s reason to believe this team won’t fall off a cliff without Brady. If they do suck this year they were very likely going to suck if he was still here.

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Cassel and a 3-1 start doesnt prove anything. Thats 2 incidents in 20 years....and what the heck does not knowing theyd be sb champions have to do with anything. They were the superbowl team Garapollo and Bissett had the luxury of playing with. Both went on to be solid starters in the league and Garapollo went to a superbowl. I just think youre underestimating Bradys contribution. Belichick is the beat coach dont get me wrong

sb1 said:

So what? They sucked without Manning. Pats haven’t sucked yet without Brady other than Bill’s first season. Facts. So I’ll give Bill the benefit of the doubt on this one too.
Not my fault you’d prefer I curl up with my thumb in my mouth over Brady’s departure. See no reason to do that. I’ve moved on.

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No, what's your fault is your attempt to keep defending an asinine comparison, rather than just acknowledging that the obviously inappropriate comparison was an inappropriate comparison.

If you want to argue that the 2020 Patriots won't collapse without Brady, that's a different issue, and I'd simply say that it's way too soon to see where the teams of the AFCE are going to slot in the NFL.

I have already moved on from Gronk, did so last season. He was too banged up to play IMO; he would be in tremendous pain at an early age and for the rest of his life if he continued to play. Just ask me how it is.

sb1 said:

Colts also didn’t tank imo. Teams don’t do that at least not on purpose.

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You have *got* to be joking....

PATRIOTSFANINPA said:

Did you fail to forget that a huge portion of that team and most of the defense from the 18-1 team was still there at both Belichick's and Cassel's disposal? - its not like Cassel started on a team that was 2-14 the year before - come on man - that team was still stacked,even without Brady and actually that 11-5 record would have been 15-1 and a AFCCG with Tom at the helm

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While this is certainly true, I don't think they would've gone 15-1 even with Brady.

The defense was ageing in 2007 which was basically their last great year. They went from #8 in yards and #5 in points per drive to #15 in yards and #11 in points. On third down they went from something like #6 at 33% to #26 at 44%. You underestimate the loss of talent on D due to a combination of age, injuries and free agency losses.

The guys in the trenches were still among the best in the NFL with Warren, Seymour and Wilfork. But behind that is where the problems started. The LB corps got some support in form of rookie Mayo, but other than that, Colvin never recovered from his season ending injury in 07 and only played in 4 games. Bruschi was close to being done. Vrabel regressed in a big way and Seau went from playing in 16 games I think in 07 to playing in 4 games only. Meanwhile the best LB the team had in Adalius Thomas was lost to a season ending injury halfway through the season. The secondary lost an all-pro CB in Samuel and started Ellis Hobbs and Delta O'Neal I think, while Rodney Harrison again dealt with injury problems and played less than half a season forcing Merriweather and Sanders to be the full-time starters.

Offensively they probably had the last all-pro year of Moss in combination with Welker's usual brilliance. But they still lost a key cog in the 2007 offense in Dont'e Stallworth.

All in all, the 2008 team isn't just the 18-0 team minus their QB.

This downward trajectory further showed when Brady was back in 2009 and the team only went 10-6 and also sported a losing record against winning teams before getting shellacked by the Ravens at home in the wild card.

Someone needs to make some photoshop or video of Brady/Gronk Shawshank Redemption with Warden Bill.

patfanken said:

Looks like the Bucs will have more fire power at the skill positions than the Pats had in 2007. If games were won on paper or fantasy football stats, you can pencil the Bucs into the superbowl right now. But this is football which is a game where the most talented teams don't always win. The the team that wins is the best team on THAT particular Sunday.

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Hell, you could argue that were it not for injuries, the Patriots might have reached and even won the SB eight of the last nine years.

Deus Irae said:

Your trolling really sucks.

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This post is underrated

KontradictioN said:

Edelman not following Brady anymore isn’t a joke. Just checked. He really doesn’t follow him.

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He only did that because the Kentucky Derby was cancelled.

Late to this thread, time zone delays and stuff... some thoughts

- no way he'd play for us after Tom left Patriots, 0% chance
- even with Tom on board I don't see it happening, 2% tops
- Gronk was banged up and declining in 2018
- got one year of rest, but also one year w/o proper training, conditioning, lost some muscle

taking all these ^ criteria into account, it's safe to say we've lost "nothing" in this trade but got a 4th rounder back, which is good (3rd would be fantastic). Putting it to a good use is a whole different story tho

I don't blame Gronk for playing elsewhere, but I feel courting us with all that "I may play again who knows" BS was a d*ck move, our WR/TE corps last year were brutal to watch and most of us kinda hoped he'll come back for months... there was some Gronk talk as late as December iirc. Don't appreciate media whores at all

scout said:

During that time period, what was the Patriots record and how many World Championships did they win?

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Such a dumb argument. The super bowl team was only impacted by 1/3 off seasons.

holyredeemer said:

Let me get this straight. You’re saying that the reason Amendola, Flowers, Patterson, Brown blah blah blah left is because BB drove them off by being a prick? Dude, come on man. BB put most of those guys in positions to make more money than they ever dreamed! What have most of those guys done since leaving the Pats? Made millions of dollars and producing less. I wish I had that kind of an ******* in my life.

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The only player on that list that didn’t produce at the same level or better since leaving is Lewis who ended up behind Henry. All the other players have produced at or near the same levels.

Gronk is the best TE of all time. First ballot Pats & NFL HOFER. Will get his jersey retired.

But...this is a greasy move. It seems to me that this was preplanned. Him and Brady have both been drama queens the past few years.

Patstastic said:

Gronk is the best TE of all time. First ballot Pats & NFL HOFER. Will get his jersey retired.

But...this is a greasy move. It seems to me that this was preplanned. Him and Brady have both been drama queens the past few years.

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1. For years, Belichick paid Gronk less than he was worth, and then was going to ship him off to Detroit.
2. Gronk left the sport for an entire year, rather than play for the Patriots again.
   
3. Belichick was playing money and years games with Brady's contract, while not giving him better players around him.
4. Belichick had years to give Brady a legit multi-year deal and focus on improving the offense. He chose to string Brady along year-to-year, and to spend most of his effort on the defense.

But, sure, demonize Gronk and Brady. It's silly, but go for it.

sb1 said:

Colts also didn’t tank imo. Teams don’t do that at least not on purpose.

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Players and coaches generally don't do it as their jobs hang in the balance. Management on the other hand.. they can play the long game..