Someone tell me why Mayo and Crable are going to buck the Pats LB trend

[maverick4]

JSP, from what I read, when Mayo was in New England for his interview, they threw schemes at him and he not only immediately digested it, but even analyzed it and offered suggestions on how to improve them, which reportedly really impressed Belichick. They liked Mayo so much that Holley even called out the Pats Mayo pick before the draft even started.

Basically, Mayo is reportedly a rare ILB who could come in and understand the defensive concepts much faster than most.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Who do you think drafted them? It was obvious that BB coveted both players intensely, which to me also suggests he's sure he'll be able to work them in and see them succeed in his system.

To others who raised the issue as well

Basically I see our NEED for LBs as a major factor in drafting decisions.

There's been need in past years but it hasn't been a high enough need to cause BB to pull the trigger on anyone... but need has been a growing factor each year.

So the question I'm raising is, are these LBs BETTER than LBs available in previous drafts?

Or are they about the same but BB now has a higher need and therefore felt compelled to draft them?

The fact is that BB didn't previously feel there were any rookies worth taking in the previous drafts - either these are better rookies or the need for LBs is causing him to finally take a chance.

 

[ALP]

I'm as excited as everyone else to have two young LBs added to the roster, especially a Top Ten pick like Mayo...

But I'm having a tough time forgetting that Belichick is so particular about which LBs can fit in his system that he's pretty much passed on drafting any LB high in the draft since - well, forever.

That's a pretty stark fact noting that BB is a guy who is always drafting with the future in mind - and hasn't been willing or able to use the draft to gain some up and coming talent even as his LB corps gets older and slower.

He's preferred to look to proven NFL veterans as a barometer of whether they can fit in the system - and even then he's been wrong.

So can someone tell me why, once the euphoria from draft weekend dies down, that I should expect Mayo and Crable to do what Belichick never felt rookie LBs were able to do in the past and step right in and contribute? (or the first ones that BB even felt were a worthy investment for the future?)

Not trying to throw cold water on our draft picks - just trying to be realistic when everyone seems to have these guys starting in their minds.

u bring up a good point

ill be completely honest...

the Pats had no choice but to take LB this time, and the chances of THESE lb's to pan out (including mayo) as opposed to previous ones, is the SAME

just this time we had no choice

 

[ALP]

To others who raised the issue as well

Basically I see our NEED for LBs as a major factor in drafting decisions.

There's been need in past years but it hasn't been a high enough need to cause BB to pull the trigger on anyone... but need has been a growing factor each year.

So the question I'm raising is, are these LBs BETTER than LBs available in previous drafts?

Or are they about the same but BB now has a higher need and therefore felt compelled to draft them?

The fact is that BB didn't previously feel there were any rookies worth taking in the previous drafts - either these are better rookies or the need for LBs is causing him to finally take a chance.

the lb's are bout the same i blieve, just like i said before, we had no choice

this was a draft of need

 

[mmasterkillah]

To others who raised the issue as well

Basically I see our NEED for LBs as a major factor in drafting decisions.

There's been need in past years but it hasn't been a high enough need to cause BB to pull the trigger on anyone... but need has been a growing factor each year.

So the question I'm raising is, are these LBs BETTER than LBs available in previous drafts?

Or are they about the same but BB now has a higher need and therefore felt compelled to draft them?

The fact is that BB didn't previously feel there were any rookies worth taking in the previous drafts - either these are better rookies or the need for LBs is causing him to finally take a chance.

Yes, Jerod Mayo and Shawn Crable seem to be better prospects for our defense than their respective opposition in years past. Am I saying Mayo is better than Willis? No... but Willis wasn't available when we chose last year.
I think we had Mayo rated higher than Beason, because Beason never played in the middle in college.

I ALSO believe that our past two losses (Indianapolis, NY Giants) have shown a lack of depth within the LB unit. Our guys were definitely worn down trying to rush the passer in both of those games. Our DL was gassed against the Colts in the divisional playoffs and unable to provide a consistent pass rush. Guys had there hands on there knees bent over gasping for air because they were being asked to do too much, for too long.

Losing Colvin really did worry me a bit. I mean the guy is seemingly always injured, but when he was around he provided a pretty decent pass rush off the edge and an attitude. I think eventually Crable can put on some weight and fill that role just as well as Colvin did for us. I know this is a lot to ask, but Crable did have 28.5 tackles for loss in his final year at Michigan.

DEPTH is the biggest concern, and we can also see that we aren't getting any younger. Completely avoiding the LB issue for years and years (with failed projects like Monte Beisel) MADE us address this need, but it was no coincidence we chose Mayo/Crable to be the guys.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Gilberry of Alabama led the nation in tackles for Loss last season.

I doubt Mayo makes it through the entire season healthy. I'm guessing his shoulder is the first part of body to get destroyed.

Crable in 2008 is ST material with occasional spot/mop up duty in the base defense.

 

[edzo44]

To others who raised the issue as well

"So the question I'm raising is, are these LBs BETTER than LBs available in previous drafts?"

Or are they about the same but BB now has a higher need and therefore felt compelled to draft them?

The fact is that BB didn't previously feel there were any rookies worth taking in the previous drafts - either these are better rookies or the need for LBs is causing him to finally take a chance.

I think the answer is these are better linebackers and Bill finally had the opportunity to get one of the higher draft picks. You can also bet he had his scouting crew looking for gems in the bushes for a long time (even during the season while still playing for the big game). They bailed on the previous drafts because they were thin in quality LB's. This was a different draft and very deep in linebackers.

(I also found it very interesting that they had been watching these guys for a couple of years!!!) They had watched Ruud develope for 2 years so don't think for a minute that any of these picks were casual or off the cuff. They were combing the field and analyzing which ones were the best for our current defensive system as well as the modified "speed" system under developement.

 

[PatsFan37]

For Crable to get on the field, he'll have to be faster, stronger, and consistently in better position then Vrabel or Thomas. Maybe he'll figure in on a rotation, but first he'll have to beat out Woods, who has a 2 year head start.

For Mayo to get on the field, he needs to be faster, stronger, and consistently in better position then Bruschi, Seau, and Hobson, and maybe Harrison on 3rd down. He won't be stronger and he won't be in better position, but he has enough of a speed advantage and he's smart, so it's hard to believe he won't be part of the rotation by the end of the year.

Mayo's position in particular is hard to learn and we've seen some talented veterans struggle with handling the concepts at game speed. Given BB's track record in the first round, I have to believe Mayo will be helping to shut down the middle of the field someday, but I'm not ready to toss out the 'aging LB corps' just yet, guys who have a lot of good plays left in them.

 

[WhiZa]

I think that anyone who expects Mayo, and especially Crable to contribute immediately will be disappointed. I think Mayo will be a third down LB, and Crable will be situational as an edge rusher, and they'll both get burn on pecial teams. I think it will be 2009 by the time either of them get any regular playing time on defense, giving them each a year under the veterans on the team to learn the techniques. I still think they're really good picks though.

Exactly what I was thinking. If Seau returns or if Hobson earns the starting spot, Mayo would be a phenomenal 3rd down LB. Crabel will earn his keep on ST this year. Next year Crabel and Woods have some maturing todo if they want that starting spot.

 

[Kontradiction]

Missed the memo that stated the Defense "left", imo this whole thing about starting is way overrated as this team uses so many situational sets of players dependent on the need...

Mayo is a very good pick and Crable isn't bad, Mayo will be involved in a lot of plays this year and Crable will get an increasing work load.. that is what is great about this team, we are not going to just put Mayo in the middle for 3 downs every time and expect him to be a pro bowler.. Bruschi and Seau are excellent "bridge players" for Mayo and Vrabel and Thomas much the same for Crable..

Never said the defense "left" but it certainly wasn't the focal point last year.

 

[tombonneau]

I think the answer is these are better linebackers and Bill finally had the opportunity to get one of the higher draft picks. You can also bet he had his scouting crew looking for gems in the bushes for a long time (even during the season while still playing for the big game). They bailed on the previous drafts because they were thin in quality LB's. This was a different draft and very deep in linebackers.

I'm going to disagree here. In a presser leading up to the draft BB was specifically asked about his specific LB requirements and if this draft had more of his "type" of LB. His answer was that this draft is pretty much the same as most other drafts.

So I really don't think that all of a sudden in 2008 this draft just happened to have better LBs in the one year we desperately need LBs.

I'm actually cautiously optimistic on both prospects (as well as Ruud).

As someone else mentioned, if we continue to blow teams out, the Pats will be able to get plenty of live learning curve minutes for these guys without risking them screwing up in a critical situation.

 

[Kontradiction]

I'm going to disagree here. In a presser leading up to the draft BB was specifically asked about his specific LB requirements and if this draft had more of his "type" of LB. His answer was that this draft is pretty much the same as most other drafts.

So I really don't think that all of a sudden in 2008 this draft just happened to have better LBs in the one year we desperately need LBs.

I'm actually cautiously optimistic on both prospects (as well as Ruud).

As someone else mentioned, if we continue to blow teams out, the Pats will be able to get plenty of live learning curve minutes for these guys without risking them screwing up in a critical situation.

We'll blow a couple of teams out this year, but not nearly as many as last year. Brady is going to see pressure this season... that has not been seen before (for him anyway).

 

[ALP]

We'll blow a couple of teams out this year, but not nearly as many as last year. Brady is going to see pressure this season... that has not been seen before (for him anyway).

there is no way he sees more pressure then what he saw in the sb....no way

 

[tombonneau]

We'll blow a couple of teams out this year, but not nearly as many as last year. Brady is going to see pressure this season... that has not been seen before (for him anyway).

Why do you say this? Teams tried unsuccessfully to pressure Brady all year, this year will be no different.

The only teams that had real success were Indy (until Mathis & Freeney ran out of gas) and the Giants (until Osi & Strahan ran out of gas). Most teams simply don't have the personnel to get pressure on Brady with the front four, which is the only way to successfully get to him.

We just happened to play one of those teams in the SB.

 

[NEPatriot]

I seriously believe they painted themselves in a corner by not acquiring young talented LBs during the last 6 years when BB says they were looking for them.

Necessity is the mother of invention, hence, all of a sudden, you don't need to be an experienced vet anymore.

BB realized that he didn't have time to look his dream players any more because his current players are getting old.

He still needs experienced players because they will make a play in a critical situation. Even though we drafted rookies LBs, pats signed a contracted with experienced LBs. As you can see, BB has a backup plan in case something doesn't work out.

Let hope that our new drafted picks are a BIG BUST.

 

[belichickaholic]

I think you need to draft a stud at those positions. Then you have to draft a stud that is going to be better than Colvin/Vrabel - Bruschi/AD. Know any players drafted at 31/32 that are better than them?

I also think the complicated defense thing is a bit of a myth. If Mangini can take a 4-3 linebacker from Michigan in David Harris and by mid season, have him playing pretty well, than I think Belichick can teach our youngsters pretty well too. No?

 

[NEPatriot]

i would not like to see TB sacked and hacked any more as i saw in last SB game.

 

[VJCPatriot]

If the Pats liked Crable so much, why were they willing to take a chance of him being snatched by someone else?

As it turns out, if they truly were going to use the 1st 3rd rounder for Crable, that means they got a second rounder next year and Matt Slater for a seventh rounder. Not bad.

I listened to BB's press conference. He said they were about to pull the trigger on Crable with the 1st of their 3rd rounders, but they got an offer they couldn't refuse (future 2nd rounder and a current 5th). They had a mid 3rd as well and chances were good Crable was gonna last, and he DID. So trader Bill got his man, don't worry about that one.

As to OP. Sure, it's a legit worry to see how quickly these newcomers can absorb the Pats complex D. My guess is that they will 'dumb down' the playbook a little. Keep it simple for the new guys (Mayo, Crable, Hobson), and by midseason they should be ready to make some heavy contributions.

 

[Metaphors]

Gilberry of Alabama led the nation in tackles for Loss last season.

I doubt Mayo makes it through the entire season healthy. I'm guessing his shoulder is the first part of body to get destroyed.

Crable in 2008 is ST material with occasional spot/mop up duty in the base defense.

I hear that Patrick Willis is really, really good.

 

[rusH1023]

Belichick DOES draft linebackers -- just never at the top of the draft. This isn't the first time he's done it, just the first time he's done it so high and, plain and simple, you probably heard him say it -- he wants to get younger on the defensive side. Time to get some youth and talent, obviously. This is just the next piece of the puzzle.