What is our plan for ILB?

[Wozzy]

Back to the topic at hand... am I the only one here who likes the look of Namdi Obiazor?

 

[mgteich]

Cowden and Streicher have Vrabel's ear and have more influence than Wolf. Wolf is a feel good guy, always giving "appreciation speeches". That is fine, if Kraft wants a feel good guy I am fine with that, as long as Wolf is not involved in any actual drafting strategy or decisions.

You know the rules

1) Poor decisions are made by Wolf.

2) Good decisions are made by Cowden and Stretcher.

 

[mgteich]

The defense was noticeably worse with Gibbens at middle LBer.

Yes, the Defense was noticeably worse when Gibbens was on the field instead of Spillane.

 

[rkarp1]

You know the rules

1) Poor decisions are made by Wolf.

2) Good decisions are made by Cowdwn and Stretcher.

said by the same posters who cried poor decisions are because of RK, JK and collaboration and good decisions are because of BB
end of the day, Wolf is the GM with out question
the past 2 years, post Bill, the roster has improved significantly.

 

[DaBruinz]

said by the same posters who cried poor decisions are because of RK, JK and collaboration and good decisions are because of BB
end of the day, Wolf is the GM with out question
the past 2 years, post Bill, the roster has improved significantly.

It's amazing how people like yourself have no clue how the team was run from 2000 through 2020. During that time, Bill had the final say over all personnel decisions. He was the GM. Period. End of story. Pioli and Caserio were assistants who helped Bill take care of the minutia and with the negotiations. Bill's noticeable screw-ups, draft wise, was when he relied on McDaniels input for WR and RBs. We don't know enough about the picks of the likes of Brace, Cunningham and Crable to know if those were strictly Bill or if Pees and Patricia also weighed in on them.

It's well documented starting in 2021 that Bill no longer had the final say. As was pointed out to you above.

Wolf has been the "GM" for 3 years. His first year, he s**t the bed. 2024 was arguably one of the worst drafts in Patriots history. People love to claim that it was because Mayo didn't give any direction and other excuses, but the reality is that a GOOD GM would have been able to add talent regardless of Mayo.

The 2025 and 2026 drafts appear to be better because of Vrabel, Cowden and Streicher. NOT because of Wolf. If Vrabel didn't have the final say, the drafts would have sucked and we wouldn't have seen a SB appearance. That's obvious from the 2024 draft and player moves.

 

[rkarp1]

It's amazing how people like yourself have no clue how the team was run from 2000 through 2020. During that time, Bill had the final say over all personnel decisions. He was the GM. Period. End of story. Pioli and Caserio were assistants who helped Bill take care of the minutia and with the negotiations. Bill's noticeable screw-ups, draft wise, was when he relied on McDaniels input for WR and RBs. We don't know enough about the picks of the likes of Brace, Cunningham and Crable to know if those were strictly Bill or if Pees and Patricia also weighed in on them.

It's well documented starting in 2021 that Bill no longer had the final say. As was pointed out to you above.

Wolf has been the "GM" for 3 years. His first year, he s**t the bed. 2024 was arguably one of the worst drafts in Patriots history. People love to claim that it was because Mayo didn't give any direction and other excuses, but the reality is that a GOOD GM would have been able to add talent regardless of Mayo.

The 2025 and 2026 drafts appear to be better because of Vrabel, Cowden and Streicher. NOT because of Wolf. If Vrabel didn't have the final say, the drafts would have sucked and we wouldn't have seen a SB appearance. That's obvious from the 2024 draft and player moves.

oooof. did you just make my comment even more correct or what?

 

[DaBruinz]

oooof. did you just make my comment even more correct or what?

Only an imbecile would think that your comment was made correct by being completely debunked.

 

[Wozzy]

said by the same posters who cried poor decisions are because of RK, JK and collaboration and good decisions are because of BB

Nobody said “good decisions by BB,” that part was your imagination running wild. From 2021-2023 it was collaboration. 2024 was Wolf in full control. 2025 it was Vrabel, Cowden with Wolf providing support.

end of the day, Wolf is the GM with out question
the past 2 years, post Bill, the roster has improved significantly.

Vrabel didn’t take this job without control, it’s what ruined him in Tennessee… his GM stunk and did what he wanted.

 

[Wozzy]

Back to the topic at hand... am I the only one here who likes the look of Namdi Obiazor?

I find it funny nobody answered this question.

Nobody wants to go on record and say this 6th round pick is going to suck, because if he turns out to be good the take will age poorly.

Better to say nothing I guess….

 

[mgteich]

Yes, the Defense was noticeably worse when Gibbens was on the field instead of Spillane.

The reasonable conclusion is NOT that we should have paid Gibbens $4M a year or more as a backup. The total of the three backups will be less than Gibbens is being paid.

I agree that we should use cap money for an upgraded ILB backup.

 

[n1997y]

Back to the topic at hand... am I the only one here who likes the look of Namdi Obiazor?

I find it funny nobody answered this question.

Nobody wants to go on record and say this 6th round pick is going to suck, because if he turns out to be good the take will age poorly.

Better to say nothing I guess….

Time will tell.

Until it does anything we say is pure guesswork.

Truth is, any player good enough to get drafted by an NFL team is a pretty good athlete. Whether we likev5he way they look or not is as much about how good our eyes are as it is about how good a player they are. Of course that keeps a lot of posting immense volumes trying to show how good our vision is, all conveniently forgotten when reality unfolds unlike our vision of how it will…

 

[Wozzy]

Time will tell.

Until it does anything we say is pure guesswork.

True.

Truth is, any player good enough to get drafted by an NFL team is a pretty good athlete. Whether we likev5he way they look or not is as much about how good our eyes are as it is about how good a player they are. Of course that keeps a lot of posting immense volumes trying to show how good our vision is, all conveniently forgotten when reality unfolds unlike our vision of how it will…

This is a little less true. Poor athletes get drafted or signed regularly, they rarely make it. Good enough for college isn’t always good enough for the pros.

Obiazor is a vey good athlete, he was good in coverage in college. We’ll see, but I thought it was a solid pick that late in the draft.

 

[rkarp1]

Back to the topic at hand... am I the only one here who likes the look of Namdi Obiazor?

looks like a very good tackler
seems smaller than 230lbs
I thought he would play faster
takes nice angles. makes decisive breaks to the ball
has some blitz ability

24 years old. played a lot of college football
seems like he can grab a back up spot

 

[Wozzy]

looks like a very good tackler
seems smaller than 230lbs
I thought he would play faster
takes nice angles. makes decisive breaks to the ball
has some blitz ability

24 years old. played a lot of college football
seems like he can grab a back up spot

Not sure how a person who weighed 230 pounds can seem smaller… it’s a strange sentence.

They want him to back up Elliss and play special teams, I like his chances.

 

[n1997y]

True.

This is a little less true. Poor athletes get drafted or signed regularly, they rarely make it. Good enough for college isn’t always good enough for the pros.

Obiazor is a vey good athlete, he was good in coverage in college. We’ll see, but I thought it was a solid pick that late in the draft.

It’s a sorting process, looking for the best of the best. Being good in college but not good enough for the NFL doesn’t mean they’re not good at all. I don’t think there are any really poor athletes who do well enough in college to make NFL draft boards. They may be flawed in some way or another, and the NFL puts them under a very strong lens to sort and select the best. But even the guys who wash out are better athletes than most.

 

[Wozzy]

It’s a sorting process, looking for the best of the best. Being good in college but not good enough for the NFL doesn’t mean they’re not good at all. I don’t think there are any really poor athletes who do well enough in college to make NFL draft boards. They may be flawed in some way or another, and the NFL puts them under a very strong lens to sort and select the best. But even the guys who wash out are better athletes than most.

I mean… in relation to graduating high school kids who have no future in sports sure. Poor, really poor… it’s subjective. But there’s a definite correlation to better athletes making the league and having higher ceilings.

There’s always great athletes who simply suck at football or who don’t apply themselves once drafted… Chad Jackson anyone. There are also average, or what you might call “still good” athletes, who work their tail off and create a career… Malcolm Butler or Kyle Van Noy. These guys were extremely hard workers and had what could be described as football smarts.

I don’t watch college football, except maybe the NCAA championship game. So I view these draft prospects as automatons, I look at production, then at measurables, then back at production with an eye on team production.

A good example is this Obiazor kid. He was considered a great man coverage guy at TCU by some, but there were mixed opinions on his coverage by different sources… so I did a deeper dive. TCU had some of the worst sack and pass pressure in the Big12. So the numbnuts at PFF probably will tell us Obiazor was poor at his job, when the reality is even a great coverage guy like Stephon Gilmore will look poor on a team that creates no pressure. PFF often attributes team failure to player failure… Garrett Bradbury in 2024 versus 2025. They called him the worst starting pass protecting center, then called him one of the best a year later. Garbage.

I had a high opinion about Craig Woodson last offseason… why? He had very good athleticism, the kind Vrabel wants for his system, but also his college defensive backfield was one of the best in the nation in pass defense.

Nobody can predict what prospects will do, there’s any number of things like injury or addiction that can derail them… but one can make a very educated guess and be correct more often than not. Measurables are a big part of that.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Not sure how a person who weighed 230 pounds can seem smaller… it’s a strange sentence.

They want him to back up Elliss and play special teams, I like his chances.

I like his chances too. Give him one year to learn and adjust and then Elliss' contract runs out I think.

 

[Wozzy]

I like his chances too. Give him one year to learn and adjust and then Elliss' contract runs out I think.

Agreed, Ellis’s deal is almost up. Another good player behind him provides insurance and leverage in negotiations. This is the way.

 

[rkarp1]

Not sure how a person who weighed 230 pounds can seem smaller… it’s a strange sentence.

They want him to back up Elliss and play special teams, I like his chances.

he looks like a tall S on the field.
he has been listed at 220 lbs elsewhere. perhaps he gained weight for his measurements day?
I assume he will compete with Britt, listed at 240 lbs. started 11 games in 2024. had 72 tackles. 2 TFL.

 

[Wozzy]

he looks like a tall S on the field.
he has been listed at 220 lbs elsewhere. perhaps he gained weight for his measurements day?
I assume he will compete with Britt, listed at 240 lbs. started 11 games in 2024. had 72 tackles. 2 TFL.

Most draft sites guess, or worse trust the colleges who don’t keep good records, if not outright lie about size.

Things will have to go terribly wrong for Britt to make it IMO, he’s a jag.