Major Improvements To The Run Game

[DaBruinz]

You never know. Wouldn't be the first time a player showcases something new in a different system. I do think there's definitely SOMETHING you can take away from the fact that BUF never used him as a rusher or a receiver. I'm sure their coaches all had the same thoughts as us that it'd be a nice little wrinkle of the FB could contribute with a few touches to make the defenses respect it, yet they never actually used him for it. Has to reflect in some level what they thought of his skills for it.

Gilliam is actually has 16 receptions on 20 targets for 135 yards, 2 TDs and 7 1Ds. But the last time he had more than 1 or 2 receptions was back in 2022. That was when Ken Dorsey was their OC.

 

[DaBruinz]

I am not trying to dispute you. I am stating we do not know what he can be.

Understood..

 

[mnpatfan]

https://www.clevelandbrothers.com/h...er.jpg?width=880&length=880&name=D5-dozer.jpg

 

[JoeSixPat]

We have a good track record signing former Bills players lately

I think Gilliam is going to be a difference maker in the red zone/short yardage despite the lack of runs or catches will become a fan favorite when they see TDs and successful 4th down runs

I'd love to see them throw to him in pre-season and see what he can do though - anyone on the field should be considered a dangerous target with Maye behind center.

 

[mike_usagisan]

Oh, I love a good thread about a fullback. LFG!

 

[Schmo]

I see everyone saying how great of a blocking FB Gilliam is. But, who doesn’t want to see a James Develin-type run? I need that.

It takes WAAAYYYY too long breaking that many tackles. Half of the GDT starts complaining before the play is over.

 

[patfanken]

Depending on ATV's health I think there could be a huge upgrade in the offensive line starting 5. Campbell's playoff woes have made people forget that he was a plus LT for all the games he played before he was injured. I religiously checked all those graphs and PFF data each week to see how he compared to his peers, especially comparing him to Simmons. This was his rookie season, playing in a new offense and next to another rookie who was playing out of position seeing things they had never seen before and playing against grown men at age 21. They were flawed, but good enough to help the Pats offense to have the #3 total offensive rating. Anyone who doesn't think Campbell will be even better than last year really doesn't know football at all, just sayin'

ATV will be a vast improvement on Wilson, who didn't suck, but will be a better C than he was a LG. ATV is a plus LG who will help both Campbell and Wilson with his experience. BUT... this is only IF he can stay on the field

Wilson should thrive going back to C. He will be a better run blocker and hopefully be as good a pass blocker as Bradbury. We will see how well this prediction works out early in camp after they put the pads on.

Owenu was as solid as a rock all season and still got **** on because people were still ass burnt over his contract.

Old man Moses was steady. He is no longer an impact RT, but does enough not to be a liability in both pass blocking and the run game.
This is a position you would like to upgrade and have Bryant beat him out, or a day one draft pick, if we chose to go that way and a day one starter talent falls to us.

Now we come to the problem (right now) There is no depth behind the starters. Brown is a quality depth player, but we know NOTHING about Bryant because he rarely got on the field and we lost our back up at LT and haven't yet replaced him. Mummford left, and it's Hard to think Wallace will suddenly become a factor (could happen, but...) So we have 6 OLmen we can count on. We need to add 3-4 more quality players over the next 4 months

Add Gilliam and Hill to that equation in the run game and both are HUGE upgrades in the run game and pass protection. Stevenson is a plus pass protector and Henderson is more than willing and improved over the course of the season. Hopefully that will continue into season 2

Bottom Line the loss of Lowe and Mumford have left us thin on our OL depth, but we still have a full 4 months to resolve it. Of course, life would be a lot easier IF guys like Bryant and Wallace suddenly "get it".

 

[n1997y]

It takes WAAAYYYY too long breaking that many tackles. Half of the GDT starts complaining before the play is over.

And the other half are still typing their complaints about the last play.

 

[KCSVEN]

-AVT Health might be the key to the offense.

-Bills were 27th in run defense and did nothing to improve. Even if they draft defense in first round, they are likely not any better and have no 2nd round pick now.

-Win the division is key and best way to beat Bills is run it down their throats and keep Allen possessions to a minimum. They could run for 300 yards vs Buffalo. Might become the 9th team with 400 yards rushing in a game.

-Pretty smart the way they attacked improving the rushing offense in free agency. Mainly predicated on AVT staying healthy to maximize it though. If he does and is at his 2024 form going to be a really good run blocking group.

 

[Salsalife]

To be honest I'm not concerned at all on the running game. Last years guys played really well. I'm disappointed in Patriots Unfiltered. I'm currently concerned about Maye more than the run game. My question to PU is have you broken down the Superbowl play by play? Have you shown us that it was our receivers covered more tightly, was it Maye's indecisiveness in the pocket or was it our Oline getting run over and had no push. Maybe you guys can get it explain . I trust your assessment. 1 thru 5 priorities this offseason other than replacing our losses in FA. Is AJ Brown the bridge if we meet up with Seattle again which I hope?

 

[Ring 6]

Depending on ATV's health I think there could be a huge upgrade in the offensive line starting 5. Campbell's playoff woes have made people forget that he was a plus LT for all the games he played before he was injured. I would religiously checked all those graphs and PFF data each week to see how he compared to his peers, especially comparing him to Simmons. This was his rookie season, playing in a new offense and next to another rookie who was playing out of position seeing things they had never seen before and playing against grown men at age 21. They were flawed, but good enough to help the Pats offense to have the #3 total offensive rating. Anyone who doesn't think Campbell will be even better than last year really doesn't know football at all, just sayin'

ATV will be a vast improvement on Wilson, who didn't suck, but will be a better C than he was a LG. ATV is a plus LG who will help both Campbell and Wilson with his experience. BUT... this is only IF he can stay on the field

Wilson should thrive going back to C. He will be a better run blocker and hopefully be as good a pass blocker as Bradbury. We will see how well this prediction works out early in camp after they put the pads on.

Owenu was as solid as a rock all season and still got **** on because people were still ass burnt over his contract.

Old man Moses was steady. He is no longer an impact RT, but does enough not to be a liability in both pass blocking and the run game.
This is a position you would like to upgrade and have Bryant beat him out, or a day one draft pick, if we chose to go that way and a day one starter talent falls to us.

Now we come to the problem (right now) There is no depth behind the starters. Brown is a quality depth player, but we know NOTHING about Bryant because he rarely got on the field and we lost our back up at LT and haven't yet replaced him. Mummford left, and it's Hard to think Wallace will suddenly become a factor (could happen, but...) So we have 6 OLmen we can count on. We need to add 3-4 more quality players over the next 4 months

Add Gilliam and Hill to that equation in the run game and both are HUGE upgrades in the run game and pass protection. Stevenson is a plus pass protector and Henderson is more than willing and improved over the course of the season. Hopefully that will continue into season 2

Bottom Line the loss of Lowe and Mumford have left us thin on our OL depth, but we still have a full 4 months to resolve it. Of course, life would be a lot easier IF guys like Bryant and Wallace suddenly "get it".

Honesty OL is the most importantly area on this team right now.
AVT is a pro bowl caliber G. What I’ve read says the risk of reinjury is low after surgical repair. If he stays healthy it’s a tremendous upgrade.
Campbell was a good LT as a rookie before the injury and basically playing on 1 leg. It is very promising that he will be very good in year 2. Wilson came in with high expectations as a C, played out of position as a rookie, had some injuries, and now plays at his natural position in year 2. Onwenu is a good G despite that weird fascination of some people around here to rag on him. Grandpa Moses is solid and rarely misses time.

As you say depth is a big deal. In the NFL at this stage depth is one of 3 things
1) a young unproven player
2) a veteran who isn’t good enough to start and is some level of liability when they get in the field
3) a slug who hurts you if he has to play.

I think that Brown is a 2 not a 3. Bryant is a 1 who might be a 3. Wallace is a 3.
This is the stage of free agency where you find the 2s. Ideally we sign 1 or 2 OT and 1 or 2 IOL and then add another 3 OL in the draft.

 

[Ring 6]

-AVT Health might be the key to the offense.

-Bills were 27th in run defense and did nothing to improve. Even if they draft defense in first round, they are likely not any better and have no 2nd round pick now.

-Win the division is key and best way to beat Bills is run it down their throats and keep Allen possessions to a minimum. They could run for 300 yards vs Buffalo. Might become the 9th team with 400 yards rushing in a game.

-Pretty smart the way they attacked improving the rushing offense in free agency. Mainly predicated on AVT staying healthy to maximize it though. If he does and is at his 2024 form going to be a really good run blocking group.

We are still a team that runs so we can pass. It’s really the league now. You can’t play 1970s ball and try to run 40 times and throw 20 and expect to get far.
The best thing this team has is Drake Maye. Every scheme and play calling decision should have the ultimate goal of setting up getting receivers open 15+ yards downfield.
You do not win in the NFL any more with 3 yards and a cloud of dust. You don’t win by throwing just when you have to. You win with chunk plays. You need explosive plays to be set up by the other plays you run. Having an effective running game doesn’t really win games (on a large scale) it sets you up for the opportunity to make explosive plays that win games.

 

[Salsalife]

We are still a team that runs so we can pass. It’s really the league now. You can’t play 1970s ball and try to run 40 times and throw 20 and expect to get far.
The best thing this team has is Drake Maye. Every scheme and play calling decision should have the ultimate goal of setting up getting receivers open 15+ yards downfield.
You do not win in the NFL any more with 3 yards and a cloud of dust. You don’t win by throwing just when you have to. You win with chunk plays. You need explosive plays to be set up by the other plays you run. Having an effective running game doesn’t really win games (on a large scale) it sets you up for the opportunity to make explosive plays that win games.

Chunk plays I totally agree. The Superbowl showed me that our offense is the #1 priority this offseason. We was shut down and I am deeply concerned about our talent on that side of the ball. I don't think we need qty but for sure quality. I'm a Diggs guy, if he does not serve time I'd fully support him returning. Don't care if he's aged. Great hands, locker room guy and can beat mediocre corners still. Proved it during the season and the double team shut him down. Doubs, Diggs is a good # 2 #2 combo. Doable for now. TE as our first pick.

 

[Ring 6]

Chunk plays I totally agree. The Superbowl showed me that our offense is the #1 priority this offseason. We was shut down and I am deeply concerned about our talent on that side of the ball. I don't think we need qty but for sure quality. I'm a Diggs guy, if he does not serve time I'd fully support him returning. Don't care if he's aged. Great hands, locker room guy and can beat mediocre corners still. Proved it during the season and the double team shut him down. Doubs, Diggs is a good # 2 #2 combo. Doable for now. TE as our first pick.

We need to protect Maye and the offense will dominate.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

We need to protect Maye and the offense will dominate.

I comes down to having an effective OL. Protect Maye and develop the ability to convert short yardage situations. That was a big problem all year and was part of the playoff disfunction.

 

[patfanken]

Chunk plays I totally agree. The Superbowl showed me that our offense is the #1 priority this offseason. We was shut down and I am deeply concerned about our talent on that side of the ball. I don't think we need qty but for sure quality. I'm a Diggs guy, if he does not serve time I'd fully support him returning. Don't care if he's aged. Great hands, locker room guy and can beat mediocre corners still. Proved it during the season and the double team shut him down. Doubs, Diggs is a good # 2 #2 combo. Doable for now. TE as our first pick.

Josh was pretty good last year in running the ball close to 50$ of the time. I would wager that we threw the ball on average about 25 times a game. I wonder where that placed the Pats compared to the rest of the league in attempts per game. EDIT: I just checked my computer's AI and found that the Pats averaged 28 attempts per game and ranked 17th in the league in attempts. So, I was off just a bit. It also told me that we ran the ball 25 times per game, also in the middle of the pack in comparison to the rest of the league.

You are right about the necessity of having "chunk plays" (plays over 20yd) in a drive. It is hard to drive the ball 70+ yds and over 10+ plays because the longer the offense is on the field the more likely **** will happen, a sack, a penalty, etc that kills a drive. This is why the Pats drafted speed (Henderson, Williams) last season. And even though I hope Henderson will show a lot more elusiveness to his runs, he is a proven threat to go all the way, every time he touches the ball.

As for the draft, no to a first round TE, we need to draft a quick twitch speed Edge in this draft early and there should be a couple of imperfects, but quality prospects at the end of the first round like Mason Thomas. Though I wouldn't hate a 2nd day pick going toward the TE position.

And as for Diggs, I wouldn't hate that either. BTW- I think his legal issues will likely end up much like Baremore. Much ado about nothing.

 

[Ring 6]

Josh was pretty good last year in running the ball close to 50$ of the time. I would wager that we threw the ball on average about 25 times a game. I wonder where that placed the Pats compared to the rest of the league in attempts per game. EDIT: I just checked my computer's AI and found that the Pats averaged 28 attempts per game and ranked 17th in the league in attempts. So, I was off just a bit. It also told me that we ran the ball 25 times per game, also in the middle of the pack in comparison to the rest of the league.

You are right about the necessity of having "chunk plays" (plays over 20yd) in a drive. It is hard to drive the ball 70+ yds and over 10+ plays because the longer the offense is on the field the more likely **** will happen, a sack, a penalty, etc that kills a drive. This is why the Pats drafted speed (Henderson, Williams) last season. And even though I hope Henderson will show a lot more elusiveness to his runs, he is a proven threat to go all the way, every time he touches the ball.

As for the draft, no to a first round TE, we need to draft a quick twitch speed Edge in this draft early and there should be a couple of imperfects, but quality prospects at the end of the first round like Mason Thomas. Though I wouldn't hate a 2nd day pick going toward the TE position.

And as for Diggs, I wouldn't hate that either. BTW- I think his legal issues will likely end up much like Baremore. Much ado about nothing.

Doubs is going to thrive with Maye.

 

[Salsalife]

I comes down to having an effective OL. Protect Maye and develop the ability to convert short yardage situations. That was a big problem all year and was part of the playoff disfunction.

Did your compare Brady time vs Maye time. I rewatched the Superbowl against Seattle. There were points where he ducked and try to run. No focus downfield? Happened thru out the playoff run. Am I wrong in this eval?

 

[Salsalife]

Josh was pretty good last year in running the ball close to 50$ of the time. I would wager that we threw the ball on average about 25 times a game. I wonder where that placed the Pats compared to the rest of the league in attempts per game. EDIT: I just checked my computer's AI and found that the Pats averaged 28 attempts per game and ranked 17th in the league in attempts. So, I was off just a bit. It also told me that we ran the ball 25 times per game, also in the middle of the pack in comparison to the rest of the league.

You are right about the necessity of having "chunk plays" (plays over 20yd) in a drive. It is hard to drive the ball 70+ yds and over 10+ plays because the longer the offense is on the field the more likely **** will happen, a sack, a penalty, etc that kills a drive. This is why the Pats drafted speed (Henderson, Williams) last season. And even though I hope Henderson will show a lot more elusiveness to his runs, he is a proven threat to go all the way, every time he touches the ball.

As for the draft, no to a first round TE, we need to draft a quick twitch speed Edge in this draft early and there should be a couple of imperfects, but quality prospects at the end of the first round like Mason Thomas. Though I wouldn't hate a 2nd day pick going toward the TE position.

And as for Diggs, I wouldn't hate that either. BTW- I think his legal issues will likely end up much like Baremore. Much ado about nothing.

So edge is more important to you, I can agree with that since we lost chaisson in FA. But but we really really need a great blocking TE to help Cambell and be a big Target for Maye. TE play is historic in New England especially in the RED ZONE! If I had Vrabels ear for a minute I'd tell him to consider converting a linebacker like himself to play TE.... and teach teach teach!

 

[patfanken]

I think your desire for a big inline TE is blinding you to the fact that we just signed a "big inline blocking TE" 6'4 - 255 and ran a 4.8 40 and is a reportedly a HELL of a good blocker. He also has over 30 receptions over his 3 year career. He has the chance to be our primary #2, play 50% of the offensive snaps and catch 20 or so balls and block the **** out of LB's and DE's. And that's BEFORE you draft anyone or see what Dippre has to offer.

Take it easy, man. We MIGHT just have what you desire to badly already on the roster. No guarantees, but we can hope