OT: Womens U.S Hockey Wins Gold!!

[DoubleDeluxe]

Matthew’s won’t get booed because he won the medal. As you say, we are proud but we aren’t bitter. That being said, Matthew’s may be booed in Toronto for how underwhelming the Leafs have been this year.

I'm a Leafs fan, don't remind me.

 

[Boomer B]

I'm a Leafs fan, don't remind me.

Could be worse, I’m a Canucks fan..

 

[The Brandon Five]

The top echelon of hockey is always a good reminder of how our culture often limits excellence in sport and life.

Malcolm Gladwell in "Outliers" noticed that almost ALL great hockey players were born early in the year, January through March.

Why is being born early an indicator of being great in sports? No ACTUAL reason, aside from the fact that we group kids by birth year when they start out in sports we start culling the "best" right from the get go

Well, not surprisingly those kids who were born in January of a given year were more physically adept than those born almost a year later.

So we took the "best" and developed them more, leaving those with the same or more potential behind. Gladwell points out that if we adopted a system that even developed kids grouped in 6 month age brackets they'd probably have twice as many great players!

We do this in our culture and society all the time, not just in sports, but it's a great illustration.

Q&A with Malcolm Gladwell - ESPN Page 2

Malcolm Gladwell's new book, "Outliers," explains why some success in sports might be more about birth dates than talent.

www.espn.com

Q. Do you know of any junior sports leagues that are trying to change the way they sift talent in order to level the playing field?

A. As far as I know, none. I brought up this very fact with one of the most senior officials in the Canadian national junior hockey program, and pointed out that Canada was squandering the talents of hundreds of boys with late birthdays. I asked [an official] why he didn't just start a parallel league, with a cut-off in late summer. He shrugged and said it would be complicated. Complicated! I don't think, as a society, we are always particularly smart about how to make the best use of our talent. And if we're this bad at sports, imagine how bad we are at other things -- like getting the most out of young people's brains?

That book absolutely blew my mind.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Wow. But I do feel sorry for the Canadians. Kind of wonder how Connor Hellebuyck will be received back in Winnipeg.

No Stanley Cup since 1993 and now they don't even have the Olympics. Woof.

 

[The Brandon Five]

WTF 8 am Sunday morning start time for the one game everyone has been waiting for?

You would think with all that money NBC paid for the broadcasting rights, they would have some say so about this.

LFG USA!

Well considering that the same people singed up for the Super Bowl on the same network so that they were competing with themselves it's safe to say that NBC might be run by morons.

 

[bormio]

Very cool angle. One thing that always stood out to me is the lack of noise dude to no announcers during the games.

Damn, it was a Canadian crowd. Hope they thoroughly enjoyed it

 

[XLIX]

No Stanley Cup since 1993 and now they don't even have the Olympics. Woof.

I never understood the national pride in winning a League championship. Assuming my team doesn’t win it, I really don’t give a crap whether the team that does plays in the U.S. or Canada. I’m not rooting for LA to beat Toronto.

 

[XLIX]

The top echelon of hockey is always a good reminder of how our culture often limits excellence in sport and life.

Malcolm Gladwell in "Outliers" noticed that almost ALL great hockey players were born early in the year, January through March.

Why is being born early an indicator of being great in sports? No ACTUAL reason, aside from the fact that we group kids by birth year when they start out in sports we start culling the "best" right from the get go

That theory flies out the window when you consider Wayne Gretzky, when growing up, was always playing in youth leagues a few years older than he was.

Yes he happened to be born in January, but he wasn’t dominating kids 10 months younger than him. He was dominating kids 3 years older than him.

 

[Halifax_Pats_Fan]

The two teams now are closer than they were, but to be honest, and if you are knowledgeable in hockey, we played well and dominated the game...but still lost on a mediocre shot from a play that Nate and Cale were asleep on. Nate was probably dreaming of that stuffy he would be getting post game. Would have been nice to have a healthy Crosby but Gudas (who has been having a career of suspensions and controversial hits) decided he would hit, sit on and injure Crosby. It is what it is.

We missed open net after open net. The US is not at our level yet but I do want to congratulate them on winning for sure. And that move they did with Johnny Gaudreau's family....all class.

Its cute to hear folks who know nothing about hockey on X come out with the memes though as if they watched a day of hockey in their lives. Jesus even John Rocker, the crazy s of a b was gloating (still remember seeing him in person run like a mad mad from out of the bullpen in Fenway...I knew he was crazy then and I am certain he is certifiably crazy now).

Until the next Olympics though, the US are the champs and they played a good tournament while Canada really had trouble in the quarters and semis. They get on cruise control and don't realize other nations want gold too...and they get lazy. They were not ready for either of those games but they were ready for the US.

Until then we have the 4 nations which was great, and really which the US could and should have won last time. I feel they were the better team but they lost that game.

It is becoming a great rivalry and hockey needs to take advantage of showcasing it more.

In the end, my hope is that folks cheer and chirp a little....why not right? But keep politics out of hockey, and be respectful of your opponent. That goes for both sides. Hockey is different than the NFL and (thank god) the NBA. Imagine a handshake line in those two sports? Ya...

To the USA, congrats on the victory. Olympic gold medal champs (x2). Well done gang!

- HPF

 

[bresna]

WTF 8 am Sunday morning start time for the one game everyone has been waiting for?

You would think with all that money NBC paid for the broadcasting rights, they would have some say so about this.

LFG USA!

I assume you were kidding here? 8:00 AM EST was 2:00 PM in Milan on the last day of the Olympics, with the closing ceremony happening just a few hours after this game ended. Any later than an 8:00 AM EST start might have caused this to run into the closing ceremonies, especially if the game went into multiple overtimes.

 

[XLIX]

I assume you were kidding here? 8:00 AM EST was 2:00 PM in Milan on the last day of the Olympics, with the closing ceremony happening just a few hours after this game ended. Any later than an 8:00 AM EST start might have caused this to run into the closing ceremonies, especially if the game went into multiple overtimes.

“Multiple overtimes”? Who’s the one doing the kidding here?

 

[pazrul72]

That theory flies out the window when you consider Wayne Gretzky, when growing up, was always playing in youth leagues a few years older than he was.

Yes he happened to be born in January, but he wasn’t dominating kids 10 months younger than him. He was dominating kids 3 years older than him.

I know next to nothing about hockey so this is just common sense to me. You are talking about Gretzky, that would be like saying all QBs should be taken in round 6 cuz of Brady. Outlier 1 of 1 that disproves any and all statistics you try to use on them.

You are also missing the point of the study which makes a ton of sense. It's not the training and resources that go into kids born later, later in their lives, it's the initial two or three years where you only have so much time to coach and put time into. Who do they do that for? The older kids who are bigger and more coordinated thus "better". And like anything else once you get that extra training the gap gets even bigger and harder to overcome. It'd be one thing if there was like 1% this applied to but if you look at the data it's a pretty big discrepancy that makes sense when you think about it. 1 all time generational talent who according to you fits the model does not throw out the 100's of other less talented players that potentially just squeaked by someone more "talented" with less training.

 

[upstater1]

I know next to nothing about hockey so this is just common sense to me. You are talking about Gretzky, that would be like saying all QBs should be taken in round 6 cuz of Brady. Outlier 1 of 1 that disproves any and all statistics you try to use on them.

You are also missing the point of the study which makes a ton of sense. It's not the training and resources that go into kids born later, later in their lives, it's the initial two or three years where you only have so much time to coach and put time into. Who do they do that for? The older kids who are bigger and more coordinated thus "better". And like anything else once you get that extra training the gap gets even bigger and harder to overcome. It'd be one thing if there was like 1% this applied to but if you look at the data it's a pretty big discrepancy that makes sense when you think about it. 1 all time generational talent who according to you fits the model does not throw out the 100's of other less talented players that potentially just squeaked by someone more "talented" with less training.

Malcolm Gladwell could've also just looked at all the children of former pros playing at the Olympics.

It's incredible the amount of wealthy children you see getting Olympic rings these days.

Someone will say it's genetics, and sure that plays some part, but the biggest thing is $$ and training and excellent coaching.

Pegula and Springsteen have daughters with Olympic medals.

It's not only the Americans with players like the Tkachuks, the Hughes's, and Nelson, but also the Canadians. Macklin Celebrini had absolutely every advantage you can imagine.

 

[bormio]

I don’t really get that much joy from seeing the Canadians lose. Now when the Canadiens lose, that is a different matter

 

[Boomer B]

I never understood the national pride in winning a League championship. Assuming my team doesn’t win it, I really don’t give a crap whether the team that does plays in the U.S. or Canada. I’m not rooting for LA to beat Toronto.

I’m Canadian and I couldn’t give a **** if another Canadian team aside from my hometown Canucks win the Cup. Everyone I know who’s into the sports feels the same. Canadian teams biggest rivals are other Canadian teams. How can I hope a rival wins the Cup? It’s like a Patriots fan hoping the Colts or the Jets win. I hear it here a lot, but it’s mostly from the media or people without a serious interest in hockey. Aside from that, most teams in the NHL have a high concentration of Canadian players. So even if it’s a US team, a lot of the players come from Canada.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

I’m Canadian and I couldn’t give a **** if another Canadian team aside from my hometown Canucks win the Cup. Everyone I know who’s into the sports feels the same. Canadian teams biggest rivals are other Canadian teams. How can I hope a rival wins the Cup? It’s like a Patriots fan hoping the Colts or the Jets win. I hear it here a lot, but it’s mostly from the media or people without a serious interest in hockey. Aside from that, most teams in the NHL have a high concentration of Canadian players. So even if it’s a US team, a lot of the players come from Canada.

And I’m the opposite.
Once TO makes their annual early postseason exit, I always cheer for the other Canadian teams.
Maybe it’s just to put an end to the Canada Stanley Cup slump narrative that only gets more pub as time goes on.
Maybe it’s because I know people in those cities who are fans.
I will say the rivalries out West are probably a little more heated.
Ottawa and Montreal were both bad for years, so those rivalries with the Leafs haven’t been at the forefront in recent years.

 

[Boomer B]

Malcolm Gladwell could've also just looked at all the children of former pros playing at the Olympics.

It's incredible the amount of wealthy children you see getting Olympic rings these days.

Someone will say it's genetics, and sure that plays some part, but the biggest thing is $$ and training and excellent coaching.

Pegula and Springsteen have daughters with Olympic medals.

It's not only the Americans with players like the Tkachuks, the Hughes's, and Nelson, but also the Canadians. Macklin Celebrini had absolutely every advantage you can imagine.

Celebrini, along with Connor Bedard, played youth hockey at the NorthShore Winter Club here in Vancouver. My office is a few minutes away. Celebrini got his advantage like many others through genetics - his Dad Rick played semi-pro soccer for our Whitecaps team in the 80’s. He then became the physiotherapist for the Whitecaps, and now is the Director of Sports Medicine for Golden State.

 

[Boomer B]

And I’m the opposite.
Once TO makes their annual early postseason exit, I always cheer for the other Canadian teams.
Maybe it’s just to put an end to the Canada Stanley Cup slump narrative that only gets more pub as time goes on.
Maybe it’s because I know people in those cities who are fans.
I will say the rivalries out West are probably a little more heated.
Ottawa and Montreal were both bad for years, so those rivalries with the Leafs haven’t been at the forefront in recent years.

Interesting. In Vancouver there are a ton of Maple Leaf and Canadien fans. Before the Canucks existed, people here either cheered for Toronto or Montreal, and they was passed down to their kids. Now when they come to town, half the building is in Maple Leaf or Canadien jerseys, so the rest of us hate those 2 teams. Then you have the Western rivals, Edmonton and Calgary, can’t cheer for them. I think the only team I’m indifferent towards is Winnipeg.

 

[XLIX]

I know next to nothing about hockey so this is just common sense to me. You are talking about Gretzky, that would be like saying all QBs should be taken in round 6 cuz of Brady. Outlier 1 of 1 that disproves any and all statistics you try to use on them.

You are also missing the point of the study which makes a ton of sense. It's not the training and resources that go into kids born later, later in their lives, it's the initial two or three years where you only have so much time to coach and put time into. Who do they do that for? The older kids who are bigger and more coordinated thus "better". And like anything else once you get that extra training the gap gets even bigger and harder to overcome. It'd be one thing if there was like 1% this applied to but if you look at the data it's a pretty big discrepancy that makes sense when you think about it. 1 all time generational talent who according to you fits the model does not throw out the 100's of other less talented players that potentially just squeaked by someone more "talented" with less training.

I’m just not buying it. A kid born in February will be about 4 months older than the average kid on the team. Those 4 months aren’t going to carry a lifelong advantage in the sport which carries its way all the way to the NHL.

Furthermore, January 1st isn’t the cutoff everywhere. In my town if I wanted my (hypothetical) 5 year old to play in my local kids hockey league, the kids born in September, October, November are the oldest ones.

 

[h0c2000]

Celebrini, along with Connor Bedard, played youth hockey at the NorthShore Winter Club here in Vancouver. My office is a few minutes away. Celebrini got his advantage like many others through genetics - his Dad Rick played semi-pro soccer for our Whitecaps team in the 80’s. He then became the physiotherapist for the Whitecaps, and now is the Director of Sports Medicine for Golden State.

Celibrini's older brother on local Boston news yesterday.