PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Content Post Idle thoughts: The bye week edition

This has an opening post with good commentary and information, which we definitely recommend reading.
Status
Not open for further replies.

patfanken

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
Joined
Jul 11, 2005
Messages
16,889
Reaction score
31,476
I thought I'd use this week's post to use it on a variety of random thoughts as they occur to me over the start of the week. Having this bye week is vital to the team, but it sucks for us fans. I mean there will be games this week that will be of interest, but nothing beats a Pats game week.

1. Post game thoughts:
a. I think the intensity and effort the entire team showed for this game was impressive. The execution wasn't always perfect, but if there were ever going to be a let down game, this was it. And it wasn't. Vrabel made a fast start a priority and that's what his team accomplished. He made violence a priority and that's was they did. They made "the next man up" a priority and the next man stood up tall.

b. Maye didn't make a great leap forward, but made some progress. The sack was his fault, but the fact he recognized it right away means it is less likely it will happen again. Scary accurate on the TD passes. Everybody eats when Maye cooks the dinner, no one eats too much. That seems to be the case each game to Maye's credit.

c. The OL didn't skip a beat. Not perfect, but certainly "acceptable ". Lowe did more than just decent job on porn boy. Brown was just as good as Wilson. And the old man erased Burns. Kudos to them,but even more praise to Marrone and his boys to get them prepared. It was as impressive as job as the Bills did without their 2 starting OTs

d. Williams can get quick releases off the LOS. He can beat guys deep. He can catch the ball. Those are the things we know he can do. What we don't know is if he can read coverages in mid route, can he run option routes, can he adjust on the fly when Maye goes off script. Probably not given that he is a raw rookie trying to adjust to Josh's demanding timing structure. But we HAVE finally started to see him show why he was taken with that 3rd rounder instead of Burden or Tesslaa. 5 catches/2 long TDs. That kind of explosiveness threat can make every other part of your offense better. We have seen some minor improvement the last few weeks, lets see if it continues.

e. Henderson is also showing improvement. I still question his vision and patience, but I'm seeing the beginnings of him starting to look for "plan B" holes, but there is a long way to go. However if production like last night becomes the rule rather than the exception, that will be enough until the vision comes

f. Defense line and LB's were good enough last night but not great. However, given we were missing 2 of our regular rotation it was good enough.

g. We lost Spillane early and Ellis had a double digit tackle night and TWO note worthy hits. I NEVER thought he was worthy of all the bad press he got here, and now even the boo birds have to eat a little crow because he was outstanding last night beyond the 2 big hits. Between Spillaine, Ellis, Tavia, and Gibbons and Mapu we have 5 LBs who have a variety of skill sets who can give us solid play and depth we need at inside LB. No one is "great" all are pretty good because they aren't asked to do too much.

h. Now the elephant in the room. The fatal flaw. For once again we couldn't generate a single four man pass rush that could immediately pressure the QB, let alone sack him. Even when we blitzed him with 5 and 6 man rushes we only got instant pressure maybe 3/4 times and only one resulted in a sack. THIS is the area that needs to looked at before the playoffs to see what can be done to improve this need. Not sure what can be done at this point instead to look at some other rush and blitz combinations. The players are who they are. Clearly we are better with Milt in the line up. Barmore is far more effective with him in the line up. But this is THE are of #1 need this off season. We need one of our first 2 picks to be an edge rusher, and our #1 FA needs to be one too. (and I DON'T mean Chaisson either)

i. (DISCLAIMER) I have NEVER called the offensive plays or coordinated the offense when I was a HC. I DID have to understand offensive concepts because I was always in charge of the defense even before I was a HC. But I need Josh to listen to me just this once. We need to add a 3 plays series of a RPO that we can run in both directions and from under C and from shotgun.

We we are inside the 10 we are having trouble now. Teams are just digging in and just beating our straight dives into the middle and off tackle and QB sneaks. So our plan B has been to announce pass and do that to mediocre success. Either way NOTHING is easy for us down there. I suggest this option as a way to threaten the edges and thus loosen up the middle. We have speed at both RB and QB regardless of how we choose to align our 11, we can threaten the edges. The other thing I would suggest to Josh is to look at the Bears/Eagles game and checks some of the Bears running schemes. Lots of angle blocking and KO's. Those schemes got what was a moribund running game going to a tune 240+ yds. Maybe these schemes could open a few more holes. Just a suggestion. If you think this is an interesting topic I can go more into detail on how the RPO works and some of those blocking schemes. (BTW- they all go back to Tubby Raymond's Delaware Wing T schemes that were popular in the early 60's when I was in HS.)

j. Sure he looks like one of those odious preppies from some bad 80's movie, but I like Jackson Dart. He's tough, skilled, and aggressive and shows a lot of the same things I liked about Maye last season. It was interesting that he wasn't pissed at Ellis for the hit. He seemed to be invigorated by it. Kind of remind be of Brady after that big hit that knocked his helmet off. Brady bounced up fired up. So did Dart. No, the Giants got the best QB of this draft, If he survives the initiation process he should be a good one.

k. BB had the solution to the Ref problem years ago. It was simple. Coaches could challenge any play and could challenge anything. a catch, a penalty, an out of bounds, anything at all. If you think that guy clearly held your guy, you can challenge it. And if you win your first 2 you get a 3rd. When you use them up, you are out of luck. No automatic reviews. The refs are part of the game and bad calls are just like bad bounces or bad plays...part of the game and you live with them. They help as often as they hurt.
 
Is there a RPO version with 5 wide (maybe with one or both of the RBs out wide in place of receivers), or at least a much more spread out formation instead of everyone bunched together screaming run up the middle? Most corners won't be able to prevent a RB getting a few yards.

That one throw by Dart when he was being tackled to the ground and somehow he popped up and hit a receiver was quite something. Spot on characterization by you - he does look like the sort of objectionable preppie that gets his comeuppance at the end of the movie.
 
Great analysis as always - I look forward to it

I give the left side of the OL credit as well - though helpful that Lowe and Brown are both free agents next year so big incentive to protect the franchise well! That being said, equaling Wilson isn't necessarily a high bar as we know, so as adequate as they are now, I'm sure there will be some investments in the OL next season.

As far as the receiving game, the bye prompted me to look closer into Maye's great accuracy and completion percentage. Sure he's had some sloppy throws too but damn - he's dropped in some perfect rainbows to receivers making artful toe taps for the in bounds catch, and he's only getting better.

He's spreading the ball AND has over 80% accuracy with some guys like Diggs grabbing 64 catches on just 70 targets!

And he's not the only one catching 8 out of 10 throws going his way. For comparison Randy Moss, even with Brady throwing to him, could be counted on to catch a pass about 50-60% of the time - barely over half. Having multiple guys able to catch the pass 8 out of 10 times as opposed to one guy who will catch it half the time can be a difference maker in the playoffs.

Williams 5 catches don't seem like much for a season so far - until you realize he's averaging nearly 30 yards a catch. I'd expect to see him on the field more, whether he's a target or not as Ds need to factor for him.

Good to see Stevenson back - he's at least got the size that we need for a goal line RB and is one of those 80% guys with 20 catches on 24 targets. Maybe if the OL gets healthy and he can hold onto the ball we can actually punch through to the goal line in short yardage situations.

As for the D, well, hopefully the bye this week and the hopeful 1st round bye gets everyone healthy enough for the "real" season that starts in the playoffs!
 
Is there a RPO version with 5 wide (maybe with one or both of the RBs out wide in place of receivers), or at least a much more spread out formation instead of everyone bunched together screaming run up the middle? Most corners won't be able to prevent a RB getting a few yards.

That one throw by Dart when he was being tackled to the ground and somehow he popped up and hit a receiver was quite something. Spot on characterization by you - he does look like the sort of objectionable preppie that gets his comeuppance at the end of the movie.
actually I like the Bunch look on the GL. I was thinking of lining up with a seven man OL, 2 receivers lined up as wing backs and a RB behind the QB either under C or in a pistol. The DL can't bunch up in the middle against that alignment. They are spread thing along that 9 man front. You can set running plays into the holes the DL leaves where ever they are. You can run RPO with the TE and wing back. The RB and QB put tremendous stress on the edge as RB's Even more so if you keep the TE in to block and cross the other TE. He'd be hard to covert through the run look. Anyhow, it's just a thought.
 
Is Barmore playing with poor balance and pushed to the ground too much on the pass rush? That's what I'm seeing but could be wrong.
 
I thought I'd use this week's post to use it on a variety of random thoughts as they occur to me over the start of the week. Having this bye week is vital to the team, but it sucks for us fans. I mean there will be games this week that will be of interest, but nothing beats a Pats game week.

1. Post game thoughts:
a. I think the intensity and effort the entire team showed for this game was impressive. The execution wasn't always perfect, but if there were ever going to be a let down game, this was it. And it wasn't. Vrabel made a fast start a priority and that's what his team accomplished. He made violence a priority and that's was they did. They made "the next man up" a priority and the next man stood up tall.

b. Maye didn't make a great leap forward, but made some progress. The sack was his fault, but the fact he recognized it right away means it is less likely it will happen again. Scary accurate on the TD passes. Everybody eats when Maye cooks the dinner, no one eats too much. That seems to be the case each game to Maye's credit.

c. The OL didn't skip a beat. Not perfect, but certainly "acceptable ". Lowe did more than just decent job on porn boy. Brown was just as good as Wilson. And the old man erased Burns. Kudos to them,but even more praise to Marrone and his boys to get them prepared. It was as impressive as job as the Bills did without their 2 starting OTs

d. Williams can get quick releases off the LOS. He can beat guys deep. He can catch the ball. Those are the things we know he can do. What we don't know is if he can read coverages in mid route, can he run option routes, can he adjust on the fly when Maye goes off script. Probably not given that he is a raw rookie trying to adjust to Josh's demanding timing structure. But we HAVE finally started to see him show why he was taken with that 3rd rounder instead of Burden or Tesslaa. 5 catches/2 long TDs. That kind of explosiveness threat can make every other part of your offense better. We have seen some minor improvement the last few weeks, lets see if it continues.

e. Henderson is also showing improvement. I still question his vision and patience, but I'm seeing the beginnings of him starting to look for "plan B" holes, but there is a long way to go. However if production like last night becomes the rule rather than the exception, that will be enough until the vision comes

f. Defense line and LB's were good enough last night but not great. However, given we were missing 2 of our regular rotation it was good enough.

g. We lost Spillane early and Ellis had a double digit tackle night and TWO note worthy hits. I NEVER thought he was worthy of all the bad press he got here, and now even the boo birds have to eat a little crow because he was outstanding last night beyond the 2 big hits. Between Spillaine, Ellis, Tavia, and Gibbons and Mapu we have 5 LBs who have a variety of skill sets who can give us solid play and depth we need at inside LB. No one is "great" all are pretty good because they aren't asked to do too much.

h. Now the elephant in the room. The fatal flaw. For once again we couldn't generate a single four man pass rush that could immediately pressure the QB, let alone sack him. Even when we blitzed him with 5 and 6 man rushes we only got instant pressure maybe 3/4 times and only one resulted in a sack. THIS is the area that needs to looked at before the playoffs to see what can be done to improve this need. Not sure what can be done at this point instead to look at some other rush and blitz combinations. The players are who they are. Clearly we are better with Milt in the line up. Barmore is far more effective with him in the line up. But this is THE are of #1 need this off season. We need one of our first 2 picks to be an edge rusher, and our #1 FA needs to be one too. (and I DON'T mean Chaisson either)

i. (DISCLAIMER) I have NEVER called the offensive plays or coordinated the offense when I was a HC. I DID have to understand offensive concepts because I was always in charge of the defense even before I was a HC. But I need Josh to listen to me just this once. We need to add a 3 plays series of a RPO that we can run in both directions and from under C and from shotgun.

We we are inside the 10 we are having trouble now. Teams are just digging in and just beating our straight dives into the middle and off tackle and QB sneaks. So our plan B has been to announce pass and do that to mediocre success. Either way NOTHING is easy for us down there. I suggest this option as a way to threaten the edges and thus loosen up the middle. We have speed at both RB and QB regardless of how we choose to align our 11, we can threaten the edges. The other thing I would suggest to Josh is to look at the Bears/Eagles game and checks some of the Bears running schemes. Lots of angle blocking and KO's. Those schemes got what was a moribund running game going to a tune 240+ yds. Maybe these schemes could open a few more holes. Just a suggestion. If you think this is an interesting topic I can go more into detail on how the RPO works and some of those blocking schemes. (BTW- they all go back to Tubby Raymond's Delaware Wing T schemes that were popular in the early 60's when I was in HS.)

j. Sure he looks like one of those odious preppies from some bad 80's movie, but I like Jackson Dart. He's tough, skilled, and aggressive and shows a lot of the same things I liked about Maye last season. It was interesting that he wasn't pissed at Ellis for the hit. He seemed to be invigorated by it. Kind of remind be of Brady after that big hit that knocked his helmet off. Brady bounced up fired up. So did Dart. No, the Giants got the best QB of this draft, If he survives the initiation process he should be a good one.

k. BB had the solution to the Ref problem years ago. It was simple. Coaches could challenge any play and could challenge anything. a catch, a penalty, an out of bounds, anything at all. If you think that guy clearly held your guy, you can challenge it. And if you win your first 2 you get a 3rd. When you use them up, you are out of luck. No automatic reviews. The refs are part of the game and bad calls are just like bad bounces or bad plays...part of the game and you live with them. They help as often as they hurt.
I wasn't surprised at the intensity. After Cincinnati, a strong effort was needed. If that had come out flat again, I would have begun to have doubts about them. They responded as expected.
You are right on the plays inside the 10. They have to give the QB some options on the edges. Williams and Tonga are essential to any post season success. Next draft OL and Edge.
 
Great analysis as always - I look forward to it

I give the left side of the OL credit as well - though helpful that Lowe and Brown are both free agents next year so big incentive to protect the franchise well! That being said, equaling Wilson isn't necessarily a high bar as we know, so as adequate as they are now, I'm sure there will be some investments in the OL next season.

As far as the receiving game, the bye prompted me to look closer into Maye's great accuracy and completion percentage. Sure he's had some sloppy throws too but damn - he's dropped in some perfect rainbows to receivers making artful toe taps for the in bounds catch, and he's only getting better.

He's spreading the ball AND has over 80% accuracy with some guys like Diggs grabbing 64 catches on just 70 targets!

And he's not the only one catching 8 out of 10 throws going his way. For comparison Randy Moss, even with Brady throwing to him, could be counted on to catch a pass about 50-60% of the time - barely over half. Having multiple guys able to catch the pass 8 out of 10 times as opposed to one guy who will catch it half the time can be a difference maker in the playoffs.

Williams 5 catches don't seem like much for a season so far - until you realize he's averaging nearly 30 yards a catch. I'd expect to see him on the field more, whether he's a target or not as Ds need to factor for him.

Good to see Stevenson back - he's at least got the size that we need for a goal line RB and is one of those 80% guys with 20 catches on 24 targets. Maybe if the OL gets healthy and he can hold onto the ball we can actually punch through to the goal line in short yardage situations.

As for the D, well, hopefully the bye this week and the hopeful 1st round bye gets everyone healthy enough for the "real" season that starts in the playoffs!
I'm down on Stevenson. I can't stop seeing him trying to get to the end zone, while getting turned around and pushing with his back to the end zone. He does some really good things but for me the consistency is missing.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
MORSE: Patriots Prospects and 30 Visits
Patriots News 04-19, Countdown To Draft Day
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft 6 – A Week Before the Draft
TRANSCRIPT: Eliot Wolf Pre-Draft Press Conference 4/13
Patriots News 04-12, What To Watch For In The NFL Draft
MORSE: Pre-Draft Patriots News and Notes
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft 5
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft 5
Mark Morse
2 weeks ago
Patriots Part Ways with Another Linebacker as Offseason Roster Shake-Up Continues
Patriots News 04-05, Mock Draft 2.0, Patriots Look For OL Depth
MORSE: 18 Game Schedule and Other Patriots Notes
Back
Top