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Looking ahead to cutdowns and waiver (EDIT: First names announced)

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???
And which of Vrabel's OG's did we keep in order to cut Robinson? Wallace? Brown? Strange?
I don't know. Don't nitpick me when I am making generalizations on how they'll attempt to fill the roster. Of course there will be carry over. At the opening presser, he said the roster would look drastically different. I do think his draftees will have a better shot than guys already here if everything is equal.
 
If the Kraft ownership was so hard for Belichick to work from 2014 onward, why didn't he choose to leave the team and go elsewhere? 2014-2023 is a long time to stay under these circumstances. Certainly, Belichick could have better furthered his career elsewhere, or not.
Maybe what you say is correct or maybe it's not. I'm not prognosticator (that's what she said). Things could have occured the way you spell them out in detail or there could have been a public reconciliation that showed a united front. Tough to know looking in a rearview mirror that resembles a funhouse mirror where everyone looks like a clown. Right?
 
If the Kraft ownership was so hard for Belichick to work for from 2014 onward, why didn't he choose to leave the team and go elsewhere? 2014-2023 is a long time to stay under these circumstances. Certainly, Belichick could have better furthered his career elsewhere, or not.
Might have had something to do with his contract. You believe Kraft would've let him go?
 
Might have had something to do with his contract. You believe Kraft would've let him go?
Please, are you saying that when it became bad starting in 2014 that Belichick had a 10-year contract with no out clause. Belichick stayed and signed more contracts. Belichick CHOSE to stay. At very least, he might have completed whatever contract he was under in 2014 and then moved on.
 
Please, are you saying that when it became bad starting in 2014 that Belichick had a 10-year contract with no out clause. Belichick stayed and signed more contracts. Belichick CHOSE to stay. At very least, he might have completed whatever contract he was under in 2014 and then moved on.
This is not how things work.

In the NFL, there is almost no freedom of movement for coaches.

It's not like any other sports. Definitely not like the Premier League in soccer.

When coaches jump to new teams it's always a negotiation, even for Payton. Every coach and team knows that even a coach on the hotseat will have plus years on the contract because if you're in your last year, you're a lame duck.

We saw this with Parcells.
 
If the Kraft ownership was so hard for Belichick to work for from 2014 onward, why didn't he choose to leave the team and go elsewhere? 2014-2023 is a long time to stay under these circumstances. Certainly, Belichick could have better furthered his career elsewhere, or not.
Or he just didn’t want start over again and put up with it because there is no certainty it wouldn’t happen elsewhere and by 2014 had a team built that would go to 4 SBs in 5 years and win 3 of them.

Maybe he saw that Parcells made a mistake chasing ownership since he never saw another SB after leaving here.
 
This is a very weird take on what has happened.

Kraft started interfering a lot and making bad decisions around 2014-2020. This pissed off Belichick. The fact that Kraft almost fired Belichick after the Eagles loss should tell you everything.

As for post 2020 and Belichick going scorched earth, did you forget the whole Patriots TV series that was described as a complete and total attack on Belichick even by notorious Belichick haters? I don't think Belichick is the one attacking here. Quite the opposite.

And the truth is Belichick had every right to be pissed at the Krafts. Even the Kraft's media mouthpiece Curran described the mutiny caused by the coaching staff splitting as Mayo was undermining Belichick at every turn.

This is most decidedly NOT the way to run a football team.

If you absolutely hate the guy, then fire him, but don't start mutinies and undercutting your coaches. When Kraft decided to reinstate Guerrero thereby undercutting the trainers and weight team, it sent a message to the entire locker room about the top down structure of the Patriots. From that moment on, the authority a football team needs was undercut.

I don't think so. Of course, neither you nor I was there, so here is my best take.

(I should say that, though your post is "team Belichick", I'm not "team Kraft". Importantly, this is a story with three sides: Belichick, Kraft and Brady.)

I don't think it's right to say that "Kraft started interfering a lot and making bad decisions around 2014-2020".

But I do think that all the signs are that there was a major crisis after the 2016, Deflategate and Clowndell season. The Guerrero episode was only a symptom.

Hubris 1.

My take is that Belichick really did want to ship out Brady and that, yes, Kraft (the Krafts?) probably did intervene. After that, what we saw from Belichick was a display of petulance. Banning Guerrero was just spite. What was much worse was that, after Garoppolo left, Belichick refused to make an effort to put a replacement for Brady in place (Danny Etling? hmm ...) or to keep him sweet. So when Brady decided that enough was enough, all they had was the shell of Cam Newton.

Belichick went mad in free agency in 2021 (Nelson Agholor, Jonnu Smith, etc.) but also drafted Mac Jones. Mac flourished under McDaniels and the Patriots make the post-season only to be annihilated in Buffalo. But McDaniels left and was allowed to take the whole of the offensive staff with him.

Hubris 2.

For 2022, Belichick decided he didn't need no stinking Offensive Coordinator or O-Line coach and put in two sock puppets in Joe Judge and Matt Patricia. He thereby destroyed Mac Jones and alienated many of the players in the locker room (Damien Harris, Brian Hoyer, Jakobi Meyers) whom he rewarded by shipping out at the end of the year.

For 2023, there was a new OC (B O'B) and a new offensive line coach, although we didn't see much of him. In any case, Mac Jones' confidence was gone, as was confidence in Mac Jones, and the team fell from 8-9 to 4-13.

Was that because Mayo was "undermining" Belichick? I don't see it, not least because the offense was obviously the biggest problem. (Yes, it's possible that Kraft had insisted that the team needed a proper offensive co-ordinator after the debacle of 2022. Was he wrong?)

At that point, Kraft decided that enough was enough, even for the greatest coach of all time. Belichick went Norma Desmond and, instead of reflecting on his failures and owning them, blamed everything on the enemies within -- chiefly, Robert Kraft.

OK. That's my outline take based on very schematic information. Perhaps Kraft could have managed Belichick better, but he also permitted him to make some terrible blunders -- blunders that would have cost anyone but the greatest coach of all time his job much earlier.

And yes, Kraft did, by that late stage, have a succession plan: a contract which stopped Mayo from going off to seek Head Coach opportunities elsewhere and Ron Wolf's little boy. Unfortunately, it wasn't a good one.

Mayo has gone and is now the Fall Guy for Eliot, who, unfortunately, survives.
 
I don't think so. Of course, neither you nor I was there, so here is my best take.

(I should say that, though your post is "team Belichick", I'm not "team Kraft". Importantly, this is a story with three sides: Belichick, Kraft and Brady.)

I don't think it's right to say that "Kraft started interfering a lot and making bad decisions around 2014-2020".

But I do think that all the signs are that there was a major crisis after the 2016, Deflategate and Clowndell season. The Guerrero episode was only a symptom.

Hubris 1.

My take is that Belichick really did want to ship out Brady and that, yes, Kraft (the Krafts?) probably did intervene. After that, what we saw from Belichick was a display of petulance. Banning Guerrero was just spite. What was much worse was that, after Garoppolo left, Belichick refused to make an effort to put a replacement for Brady in place (Danny Etling? hmm ...) or to keep him sweet. So when Brady decided that enough was enough, all they had was the shell of Cam Newton.

Belichick went mad in free agency in 2021 (Nelson Agholor, Jonnu Smith, etc.) but also drafted Mac Jones. Mac flourished under McDaniels and the Patriots make the post-season only to be annihilated in Buffalo. But McDaniels left and was allowed to take the whole of the offensive staff with him.

Hubris 2.

For 2022, Belichick decided he didn't need no stinking Offensive Coordinator or O-Line coach and put in two sock puppets in Joe Judge and Matt Patricia. He thereby destroyed Mac Jones and alienated many of the players in the locker room (Damien Harris, Brian Hoyer, Jakobi Meyers) whom he rewarded by shipping out at the end of the year.

For 2023, there was a new OC (B O'B) and a new offensive line coach, although we didn't see much of him. In any case, Mac Jones' confidence was gone, as was confidence in Mac Jones, and the team fell from 8-9 to 4-13.

Was that because Mayo was "undermining" Belichick? I don't see it, not least because the offense was obviously the biggest problem. (Yes, it's possible that Kraft had insisted that the team needed a proper offensive co-ordinator after the debacle of 2022. Was he wrong?)

At that point, Kraft decided that enough was enough, even for the greatest coach of all time. Belichick went Norma Desmond and, instead of reflecting on his failures and owning them, blamed everything on the enemies within -- chiefly, Robert Kraft.

OK. That's my outline take based on very schematic information. Perhaps Kraft could have managed Belichick better, but he also permitted him to make some terrible blunders -- blunders that would have cost anyone but the greatest coach of all time his job much earlier.

And yes, Kraft did, by that late stage, have a succession plan: a contract which stopped Mayo from going off to seek Head Coach opportunities elsewhere and Ron Wolf's little boy. Unfortunately, it wasn't a good one.

Mayo has gone and is now the Fall Guy for Eliot, who, unfortunately, survives.
eh, suffice to say I think this too is just Kraft centered. But we could go on forever. People tend to forget that Brady was 39 when Belichick showed Kraft the plan to move on from Brady. Only in New England would this have been considered a bad move. If you don't have a plan for succession for your 39 year old starter, you're probably derelict of duty. Given the extreme reactions from Kraft, and the fact the team was old and clearly at the end of its cycle, it makes sense that Belichick wouldn't expend a #1 pick on a QB (even though in retrospect he counts not taking Lamar Jackson as a big mistake).

As for Mac Jones, don't think Belichick ever wanted him.

Also the Guerrero thing was big. That was clear from the documentary. It was the only time Brady got angry and showed emotion in the whole thing. And even Amendola, who was highly critical of Belichick through the whole documentary (likely because of his contract) said that the move undermined the coaches.

I disagree 100% that he destroyed Mac Jones. Mac's limitations were evident to me early on. I posted a mile long critique of him before he collapsed in his second year and there was a lot of pushback on it here. But I saw his problems very early long before Patricia became the OC.
 
There was no way the Pats were paying that with Diggs here.
We signed Diggs. We made our bed and now we have to lay in it. The Pats are not going to sign two WRs over 30 that are each making $25M+.
 
We signed Diggs. We made our bed and now we have to lay in it. The Pats are not going to sign two WRs over 30 that are each making $25M+.
Plus, Diggs has incentives if he sees the ball come his way.

How do you sign a 30 million dollar WR and not focus the offense on him?
 
If the Kraft ownership was so hard for Belichick to work for from 2014 onward, why didn't he choose to leave the team and go elsewhere? 2014-2023 is a long time to stay under these circumstances.
1A) TB12 (until 2019)
1B) $25 mill / season
2) Daily Belichick family reunion at Gillette
 
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There was no way the Pats were paying that with Diggs here.
They could of with Maye on a Rookie deal if we Terry was 24 to 28 I think they would if trade compensation was reasonable.
 
I feel like the media let us down today a bit. I couldn't find any reports about who was or was not at practice and who was or was not on the injured list. Nothing in my usual feeds. Only Romo was the first player on the field.

Of note: White and Mapu are speaking to the media after practice. This 99% means Mapu is on the roster and White isn't being traded.
 
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I feel like the media let us down today a bit. I couldn't find any reports about who was or was not at practice and who was or was not on the injured list. Nothing in my usual feeds. Only Romo was the first player on the field.

Of note: White and Mapu are speaking to the media after practice. Mapu is on the roster and White isn't being traded.
I hope he makes it as our Kicker.
 
No rats to give the practice details away.
I feel like the media let us down today a bit. I couldn't find any reports about who was or was not at practice and who was or was not on the injured list. Nothing in my usual feeds. Only Romo was the first player on the field.

Of note: White and Mapu are speaking to the media after practice. This 99% means Mapu is on the roster and White isn't being traded.
 
put some Mayo on that sammich and you'd be right
 
There was no way the Pats were paying that with Diggs here.
There was no way the Cobra Commanders were letting him go.
 
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