Jason Taylor OUT for the game???

[ShrewBeer]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Jason Taylor is going to be 34 next season. If the Dolphins can get a second round pick for Taylor, I think they are crazy not to make the trade. Taylor can only play at a top level for another one or two years. A second round pick can be productive for 10. Why would they keep Taylor only to have him retire around the time they start getting good?

if miami would take a second round pick for taylor, teams would be lining up around the block. i wish that were the case, imagine getting taylor for the same deal as welker? sweeeeet

 

[mgteich]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Taylor is worth more than a 2nd round pick. Do you really expect a 2nd round pick to be productive for the drafting team for 10 years? First isn't the contract limit four years for a second rounder. Also, the range of productivitity is wide. Some are not productive at all.

No, I would think that it is the fins would be crazy to trade Taylor for a 2nd rounder. But then, the current front office could be that stupid. They were last year. According to your logic, they should have been happy to get a 2nd for Welker, a player not near as valueable as Taylor.

Actually, I think they are trading Taylor a year or even two too late. By the time the Dolphins are legitimate playoff contenders again, Taylor's career will be winding down. Why would you hold onto an older, more expensive player when you are the worst team in football and you can get trade value for him.

I wouldn't trade Brady NOW for any number of picks. But would I trade a 37 year old Brady for a high first day pick (second round pick)? My heart will always say no, but depending on the overall situation, my head might say yes.

Jason Taylor is going to be 34 next season. If the Dolphins can get a second round pick for Taylor, I think they are crazy not to make the trade. Taylor can only play at a top level for another one or two years. A second round pick can be productive for 10. Why would they keep Taylor only to have him retire around the time they start getting good?

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Taylor is worth more than a 2nd round pick. Do you really expect a 2nd round pick to be productive for the drafting team for 10 years? First isn't the contract limit four years for a second rounder. Also, the range of productivitity is wide. Some are not productive at all.

No, I would think that it is the fins would be crazy to trade Taylor for a 2nd rounder. But then, the current front office could be that stupid. They were last year. According to your logic, they should have been happy to get a 2nd for Welker, a player not near as valueable as Taylor.

I'm sorry, but I feel on a team as bad as many holes as the Dolphins have, a second round pick is worth more than Jason Taylor. On team that was a contender, it might be another story. But the Dolphins might be able to get 6 wins next year. Taylor will be 36 going into the following year when the Dolphins might contend for a playoff spot. How much will he have left?

I also argue that Welker has move value than Taylor. Yes, on the short term, Taylor has more value, but he has only a year or two or maybe three left in him. Welker is in his prime and can give the Pats 7-8 years of top production assuming they keep him. Also, Welker can play a key role in special teams.

As for a second round pick being productive for 10 years, Jason Taylor was a third round pick and he has been with the team since 1997. Yes, drafting is a crapshoot, but the right pick can be a stalworth on their team for a decade. Taylor has a year or two left with a high price tag.

You are talking about the worst team in the league. Taylor and his contract will not help them to get back to a playoff team. A second round pick and the cap relief has a far better shot at it.

 

[ShrewBeer]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Taylor and his contract will not help them to get back to a playoff team. A second round pick and the cap relief has a far better shot at it.

i sooooo hope you are right. that would give us a shot at him.
can u imagine vince,seymour,warren,colvin,teddy,vrabel,wright,thomas AND taylor?

 

[Rob0729]

By the way, coming from fans of a team that knows when it is time to cut bait with their marquee players at the right time, I don't know how anyone can say the Dolphins are crazy to trade Taylor. They are about as crazy as the Pats cutting Milloy, not resigning Woody, cutting McGinest, cutting Law, trading Branch, not resigning Givens, etc.

You gotta cut ties with your expensive seasoned veterans before their contracts become dead weights bringing your team down. I feel the Dolphins missed that window with Taylor and Zach Thomas. They would have been better off this year if they unloaded them the past offseason and were more of active players in free agency. It isn't like they would have won fewer games this year by doing so.

 

[Patsgofor4]

Just so you all get the correct info: The plantar fascia is not also called a heel spur and it is not just limited to the heel of the foot. It is a wide band of fibrous tissue that runs along the base of the foot (from the heel to the toes) to add stability. Plantar fasciitis just means that the plantar fascia is inflamed, usually due to injury/trauma. It hurts like a ***** but he could potentially play after several days of oral antiinflammatory treatment and, if need be, a steroid injection. If he really "tore" his plantar fascia, there is no way he is playing. They may be having him use the crutches to take all pressure off of the area while the antiinflammatory medications work.

 

[mcbee]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Taylor is worth more than a 2nd round pick. Do you really expect a 2nd round pick to be productive for the drafting team for 10 years? First isn't the contract limit four years for a second rounder. Also, the range of productivitity is wide. Some are not productive at all.

No, I would think that it is the fins would be crazy to trade Taylor for a 2nd rounder. But then, the current front office could be that stupid. They were last year. According to your logic, they should have been happy to get a 2nd for Welker, a player not near as valueable as Taylor.

Taylor will be 43 in 10 years. Plus he's making 10M next year. You could sign a top FA and not have to trade ANYTHING and pay him less than that.

So why would you trade a 2nd rounder for him?

I think any team would be stupid for trading for a 33 year old guy with a 10M salary next year.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

here it is in print...


http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/football/pro/dolphins/sfl-flspdolnotes18sbdec18,0,5253608.story

He was spotted at a Ping Pong tournament!!!

also says that Channing Crowder is also out.

 

[alamo]

Chances are, unless he renegotiates (highly unlikely), he's going to get cut in the offseason. No way the Dolphins keep him at his 2008 salary.

I don't know the Dolphins' cap status, but most rebuilding teams can easily afford to overpay a star for a couple of years. It's only once a team gets good that everyone has their hand out and wants a raise and cap dollars are at a premium. Paying their current players or highly paid free agents would be a waste of money for little effect.

Also, Huizenga has enough money that it makes little sense for him to not pay Taylor and put the money in his pocket instead. Keeping Taylor would help bring fans to the stadium, something the team needs badly.

 

[patsox23]

Miami would NEVER trade Taylor here - especially given how the Welker deal made them look. They would trade him almost anywhere outside the division, but the last of the other 31 teams they'd send him to resides in New England.

 

[mgteich]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Are you a patriots fan, or are you on the fins' staff. With analysis like yours, the fins will continue to compete for the top draft pick.

And you are correct, no one will pay a lot for an over the hill player with one or two more years of production left. Other teams will take a different view.

Did we sign a 7-8 year contract with Welker? I would take Taylor instead of Welker for the same contract length in a heartbeat. And just, BTW, if Miami wants our 2nd and 3rd for Taylor, and Taylor is willing to sign a 5-year deal, the deal will be completed as soon as it is allowed.

I'm sorry, but I feel on a team as bad as many holes as the Dolphins have, a second round pick is worth more than Jason Taylor. On team that was a contender, it might be another story. But the Dolphins might be able to get 6 wins next year. Taylor will be 36 going into the following year when the Dolphins might contend for a playoff spot. How much will he have left?

I also argue that Welker has move value than Taylor. Yes, on the short term, Taylor has more value, but he has only a year or two or maybe three left in him. Welker is in his prime and can give the Pats 7-8 years of top production assuming they keep him. Also, Welker can play a key role in special teams.

As for a second round pick being productive for 10 years, Jason Taylor was a third round pick and he has been with the team since 1997. Yes, drafting is a crapshoot, but the right pick can be a stalworth on their team for a decade. Taylor has a year or two left with a high price tag.

You are talking about the worst team in the league. Taylor and his contract will not help them to get back to a playoff team. A second round pick and the cap relief has a far better shot at it.

 

[ShrewBeer]

Miami would NEVER trade Taylor here - especially given how the Welker deal made them look. They would trade him almost anywhere outside the division, but the last of the other 31 teams they'd send him to resides in New England.

kraft did them a favor by giving them more than a 2nd for welker. that was done out of pure kindness and class. you dont think the miami organization appreciates this non-cutthroat business practice?

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

kraft did them a favor by giving them more than a 2nd for welker. that was done out of pure kindness and class. you dont think the miami organization appreciates this non-cutthroat business practice?

Actually the Pats were ready to sign Welker to an offer sheet that contained a "poison pill" like he gets a 50 million dollar bonus if he played more than 5 games in Florida, this way they would have had to give Miami a 2nd round pick because Welker was a Restricted Free Agent.

Instead the Pats offered to make a straight trade for Welker (because he was a RFA, he could be traded) and added the 7th round pick. This was smart on both teams part, Miami was going to lose him anyways, and they pick up another pick. Meanwhile the Pats aren't saddled with a giant contract for Welker, and they avoided a "poison pill" war with Miami, like the one that Seattle and Minnisota engaged in, in which Seattle lost Hutchinson, which has basically killed their running game.

 

[ShrewBeer]

i dont see whats different than what i said. they got rid of the poison pill as a favor. kraft stepped into the deal and played the role of the nice guy, giving them a free 7th rounder

 

[alamo]

kraft did them a favor by giving them more than a 2nd for welker. that was done out of pure kindness and class. you dont think the miami organization appreciates this non-cutthroat business practice?

"Pure kindness and class"? No. The 7th meant little to the Pats but including it helped the Pats avoid a potentially messy contract match. It allowed the Dolphins to gain something they could show to their fans to claim they weren't idiots, and it allowed the Patriots to get the deal completed and move on to other business without waiting a week.

 

[ShrewBeer]

"Pure kindness and class"? No. The 7th meant little to the Pats but including it helped the Pats avoid a potentially messy contract match. It allowed the Dolphins to gain something they could show to their fans to claim they weren't idiots, and it allowed the Patriots to get the deal completed and move on to other business without waiting a week.

im pretty sure kraft said himself that he did not like the poison pill, and that they were going to find a way to get it done without it.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Are you a patriots fan, or are you on the fins' staff. With analysis like yours, the fins will continue to compete for the top draft pick.

And you are correct, no one will pay a lot for an over the hill player with one or two more years of production left. Other teams will take a different view.

Did we sign a 7-8 year contract with Welker? I would take Taylor instead of Welker for the same contract length in a heartbeat. And just, BTW, if Miami wants our 2nd and 3rd for Taylor, and Taylor is willing to sign a 5-year deal, the deal will be completed as soon as it is allowed.

Huh? How would trying to build for the future be continuing to get the top draft pick? My stance is on page one of the Belichick/Pioli handbook. You have to know when your veteran players are not as valuable to you as the trade compensation or the cap they get. The Dolphins are about 2 years away from the playoffs and Jason Taylor is about 2 years away from retiring.

The Dolphins could turn a trade of Taylor into three or four decent starters (in terms of draft picks and cap space to get free agents) which will help them than having one stud player surrounded by a bunch of marginal players. Lawrence Taylor or Reggie White (depending on which position JT plays in) in their prime wouldn't make this Dolphins team more than a 2-4 win team as it is constituted (and I am being generous there). Sorry, but one stud player close to the end of his career will hurt a team more if his cap number make it hard for them to fill in their gaping holes (which is about 9 players on defense and 8 players on offense).

We didn't sign Welker for 7-8 years, but that doesn't mean we don't give him a contract extension before he hits the open market in two or three years to get to 7 or 8 years. You are looking at this far too shortsightedly.

As for Taylor, a Jason Taylor would be far, far more to a team like us than a Dolphins since he would be only one piece of a very strong pie. Even so, I see Taylor's value only be worth it for about a year or two. Welker definitely has more long term upside.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Re: Taylor OUT for the game???

Taylor is worth more than a 2nd round pick. Do you really expect a 2nd round pick to be productive for the drafting team for 10 years? First isn't the contract limit four years for a second rounder. Also, the range of productivitity is wide. Some are not productive at all.

No, I would think that it is the fins would be crazy to trade Taylor for a 2nd rounder. But then, the current front office could be that stupid. They were last year. According to your logic, they should have been happy to get a 2nd for Welker, a player not near as valueable as Taylor.

???????


I don't see the Pats trading the youth of a top pick to help keep them old at LB. I'm not knocking Taylor - just that I don't view him as worthy of a top pick AND a top salary.

That doesn't mean I can't envision a scenario where Taylor is able to retire/graduate with the Fins and find a way to join his good friend Tom Brady in New England for a reasonable salary and an excellent shot at a SB ring.

Most teams don't have an interest in keeping players who don't want to be there (like Samuel's no franchise clause - yes technically they could have forced the issue with him but having disgruntled players undermines a team)

I'd be more concerned about other defensive players retiring if we have a perfect season and SB victory (even without the perfect season) and a major gap than focused on Taylor. Bruschi, Vrabel, and Harrison could all decide to end their careers on a high note after this year, especially if its a perfect season.

That would put us in a bit of a quandry for next year.

 

[mcbee]

The pats could have taylor for 10 years? He'd be 43, I don't get it.

YOu're mixing up two things. The value as a player and what he's paid. Taylor has VALUE as a player. He's being paid 10M. The two are inseparable. If you trade for him, you get him AND his contract. His trade value is the excess of his worth as a player above his salary.

The logic "Taylor is good, so he's worth a #1" is stupid. You don't just get a player, you have to take the salary too.

If he were willing to play for much less, why would Miami trade him at all?

The Pats are going to pay a 34 year old 10M a year. And this is a good deal because he will be dominant "for 10 years".

Yeah, that makes sense. Dolphins will probably cut him, as they should. I doubt anyone would be willing to pay him 10M per year.

 

[ClevTrev]

Just so you all get the correct info: The plantar fascia is not also called a heel spur and it is not just limited to the heel of the foot. It is a wide band of fibrous tissue that runs along the base of the foot (from the heel to the toes) to add stability. Plantar fasciitis just means that the plantar fascia is inflamed, usually due to injury/trauma. It hurts like a ***** but he could potentially play after several days of oral antiinflammatory treatment and, if need be, a steroid injection. If he really "tore" his plantar fascia, there is no way he is playing. They may be having him use the crutches to take all pressure off of the area while the antiinflammatory medications work.

Thank you. That's two of us who have said the same thing. Taylor will most likely play on Sunday. As I mentioned, I ran a marathon just after being treated for Plantar Fasciitis. If it's torn, he's toast, but it rarely tears that badly.