Wolf on the OL: I *Think* We Have the Pieces to Compete... Oy Vey...

[mike_usagisan]

This.

He can't throw everyone under the bus before they've even played a game. He's got a locker room to manage with 53 guys, plus PS players and possible waiver wire transactions to complete. We talked about this in another thread. It was either Joe Alt and a QB next year or Maye this year and OT next year. The QB class looks meh for 2025, so there was no sense kicking the can down the road a year. FA OT, especially LTs, and FAs for a reason. If they were worth anything, they would be signed by their respective teams. It's build in the draft, develop your own.

Or occasionally get lucky with a trade, like with Trent the first go round.

I was hopeful they'd trade back up in the first to grab a tackle, but that would mean no Baker. And there was a run on them, so it's questionable whether any that we got then would be any good.

 

[PatsFan2]

This is a glaring statement from our GM that the line is a bit of a shambles... "I think" we have the pieces to compete just fills me with dread and is an implicit admission that the OL is not in a good place...

The line from the second game was constituted was lt lowe lg sow c andrews rg onwenu rt okorafor... I was not overly impressed with their play in the first quarter of the game... and that was against Phillys 2's... there was a lot of consistent pressure inside the box, and that does not bode well for a team that wants to run first... Dre is a good back... but much like the previous years, if the opposing defenses and crowd the line, stack the box - however you want to term it - the offense is going to suffer...

There was another statement from Wolf about be aggressive when the cutdowns are announced... this further bothers me, knowing that we might/will probably be looking at adding a vet or two, guys who didn't go thru camp here, and may not have an understanding of the new line schemes... and i fear that those late additions will be pressed into a starting role, especially of we are able to bring in a tackle or two...

I hate being so negative, but I am concerned that this line is going to be bad...

Game 3 is really going to be the indicator of who the starters are going to be... its getting late in the day in regards to sorting out the starters on the line...

Eliot Wolf on Patriots offensive line: I believe we have the pieces to compete

After the Patriots played the Eagles on Thursday night, head coach Jerod Mayo was asked about the team's offensive line play and he said we "have to get better as a whole, as a unit" before the regular season.

www.nbcsports.com

Our problem right now is Left Tackle the Right Tackle will get help from the TE or Right Guard. I hope C Wallace becomes serviceable @ LT.

 

[Pape]

Our problem right now is Left Tackle the Right Tackle will get help from the TE or Right Guard. I hope C Wallace becomes serviceable @ LT.

what tight end? they are all injured at this point

 

[Clonamery]

what tight end? they are all injured at this point

 

[Ross12]

I'm optimistic that Sow is going to be good at LG. I think Andrews is still good at C. If Onwenu is at RG, I'm confident he's great. Between Okorafor having his moments in PIT, Wallace being a rookie that shows some potential, and the possibility they could kick Onwenu out to RT if they need to, I'm cautiously optimistic they can find a workable player there. If Onwenu has to play RT, then they have Leverett/Robinson who show, IMO, potential to be decent if needed. They also have Strange maybe coming back mid year who’s another option inside with a reasonable floor, though that’s pending a return to his (mediocre at best) form after injury.

LT is a mess, but I’m fairly confident that they can get passable OL play from the other 4 spots. If Wallace or Okorafor play RT well enough to leave Onwenu inside then I think they can get overall good to great play across the other 4 spots even.

The dream, world scenario would be if Lowe or Wallace take well to LT and actually be decent to good there. But I’m skeptical.

LG - Sow is good / Strange is good when he comes back
C - Andrews is good / Leverrett is average
RG - Onwenu is great / Robinson is average, maybe eventually good

The interior is pretty solid. Really not much reason to be concerned here.

RT - Okorafor is average / Wallace is below average? (kinda unknown)
LT - Lowe is probably bad, might be able to be below average / Anderson is bad

With the tackles, Okorafor at RT is at least average. Lowe is probably bad, but with all the reps, maybe the rest of the line can somewhat make up for him if everyone else is OK. Wallace is a bit of an unknown because he's bounced back and forth but I assume he needs work and is probably a depth RT for now. I've mostly written off Anderson but we'll see, maybe he's an emergency swing tackle.

You COULD move Onwenu to RT, and play Robinson or Leverett at RG, but that doesn't really fix LT since I don't think Okorafor would be meaningfully better there, and improving RT but downgrading RG probably leaves you with a no real net gain on the right side, so you may as well leave it alone.

I wouldn't be super surprised if they wait until camp is over and then sign one of these older guys - David Bakhtiari, Donovan Smith, DJ Humphries.

 

[PatsFan2]

what tight end? they are all injured at this point

Philly look like after Starter Dallas Goedert they have some decent youngs guys all won't make the cut.

That kid E.J. Jenkins was making catches in our game.

 

[mike_usagisan]

LG - Sow is good / Strange is good when he comes back
C - Andrews is good / Leverrett is average
RG - Onwenu is great / Robinson is average, maybe eventually good

The interior is pretty solid. Really not much reason to be concerned here.

RT - Okorafor is average / Wallace is below average? (kinda unknown)
LT - Lowe is probably bad, might be able to be below average / Anderson is bad

With the tackles, Okorafor at RT is at least average. Lowe is probably bad, but with all the reps, maybe the rest of the line can somewhat make up for him if everyone else is OK. Wallace is a bit of an unknown because he's bounced back and forth but I assume he needs work and is probably a depth RT for now. I've mostly written off Anderson but we'll see, maybe he's an emergency swing tackle.

You COULD move Onwenu to RT, and play Robinson or Leverett at RG, but that doesn't really fix LT since I don't think Okorafor would be meaningfully better there, and improving RT but downgrading RG probably leaves you with a no real net gain on the right side, so you may as well leave it alone.

I wouldn't be super surprised if they wait until camp is over and then sign one of these older guys - David Bakhtiari, Donovan Smith, DJ Humphries.

I think you're right about the right tackle situation. And it'll be interesting to see if they can get some older LT to come in for one last run.

Interesting group: "David Bakhtiari, Donovan Smith, DJ Humphries" There's all kinds of health risks and I'm not sure any of them are completely healthy right now, but if any of them can stay reasonably healthy, they'd be an instant upgrade.

 

[Steve102]

Or occasionally get lucky with a trade, like with Trent the first go round.

I was hopeful they'd trade back up in the first to grab a tackle, but that would mean no Baker. And there was a run on them, so it's questionable whether any that we got then would be any good.

Yeah, I agree. I think they looked at it as how can they fill the most holes. Maye with Polk and Baker really could take care of the weapon thing, as last year's WR class was pretty deep. I am of the opinion that an OT this year would have cost them both Polk and Baker, so it's really a case of making the best of a bad situation. There was no way to get the QB, LT, and WR position fixed in one draft.

 

[mike_usagisan]

Yeah, I agree. I think they looked at it as how can they fill the most holes. Maye with Polk and Baker really could take care of the weapon thing, as last year's WR class was pretty deep. I am of the opinion that an OT this year would have cost them both Polk and Baker, so it's really a case of making the best of a bad situation. There was no way to get the QB, LT, and WR position fixed in one draft.

Agreed. A number of people have made a good case that drafting LTs is really hard, even for top picks. So unless you get one in the first round, your chances of making it work are not great. And once we decided on Maye, there was no chance for that this year.

 

[Ian]

what tight end? they are all injured at this point

I think they put Michael Jordan in as an extra tight end the other day during 11-on-11s, so that might be an option.

 

[Steve102]

Agreed. A number of people have made a good case that drafting LTs is really hard, even for top picks. So unless you get one in the first round, your chances of making it work are not great. And once we decided on Maye, there was no chance for that this year.

Right. They maybe could have gotten back in and got Guyton late in the 20s, assuming they had a willing trade partner AND were willing to pay the ransom needed AND wanted the player. IMO, they looked at it and said the way they ended up doing it was the fastest route to fill the most roster holes.

 

[PatsFan2]

This is a glaring statement from our GM that the line is a bit of a shambles... "I think" we have the pieces to compete just fills me with dread and is an implicit admission that the OL is not in a good place...

The line from the second game was constituted was lt lowe lg sow c andrews rg onwenu rt okorafor... I was not overly impressed with their play in the first quarter of the game... and that was against Phillys 2's... there was a lot of consistent pressure inside the box, and that does not bode well for a team that wants to run first... Dre is a good back... but much like the previous years, if the opposing defenses and crowd the line, stack the box - however you want to term it - the offense is going to suffer...

There was another statement from Wolf about be aggressive when the cutdowns are announced... this further bothers me, knowing that we might/will probably be looking at adding a vet or two, guys who didn't go thru camp here, and may not have an understanding of the new line schemes... and i fear that those late additions will be pressed into a starting role, especially of we are able to bring in a tackle or two...

I hate being so negative, but I am concerned that this line is going to be bad...

Game 3 is really going to be the indicator of who the starters are going to be... its getting late in the day in regards to sorting out the starters on the line...

Eliot Wolf on Patriots offensive line: I believe we have the pieces to compete

After the Patriots played the Eagles on Thursday night, head coach Jerod Mayo was asked about the team's offensive line play and he said we "have to get better as a whole, as a unit" before the regular season.

www.nbcsports.com

Maybe Wolf is leaning towards playing M Onwenu at RT it seems like we have some decent Guards. Also if Cole Strange comes back we could move Siddy Sow to Right Guard. So when Wolf say we have the pieces he might mean with Cole Strange in the rotation he's a First Rounder.

V. Lowe - Cole Strange - D Andrews - S Soy and M Onwenu

That's not the worse OL in the league other than LT we are pretty solid at the other positions.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

If he’s engaged in trade talks for players, saying in the media that he’s desperate for those players makes them much more expensive.

Interesting point, hmm. If I was him, I would be very hesitant to do a trade because the Patriots may be picking very low next year and Wolf wants to build the team through the draft. He needs to conserve draft capital....but if a good deal comes along...

I suspect that they are waiting until after the cut down day in 8 days to decide who they need to trade for or who they need to trade away. This may be a very active day and maybe even exciting for us.

 

[VrabelJr]

what tight end? they are all injured at this point

Not to mention Henry and Hooper are not great blockers

 

[Pape]

Maybe Wolf is leaning towards playing M Onwenu at RT it seems like we have some decent Guards. Also if Cole Strange comes back we could move Siddy Sow to Right Guard. So when Wolf say we have the pieces he might mean with Cole Strange in the rotation he's a First Rounder.

V. Lowe - Cole Strange - D Andrews - S Soy and M Onwenu

That's not the worse OL in the league other than LT we are pretty solid at the other positions.

Here's the issue I have... It really doesn't matter what rotation they are trying out if its populated with these guys. Average across the board at best. Yes Sow might be a good player... Yes Onwenu might be a good player ... but when they are paired off with a bad line partner, it weakens the entire line across the board...

Everyone that is saying the line "looks good" and "well PFF said they got better" and "Evan Lazar agrees with me" could have quite literally copy and pasted their posts from last two years running. And we saw what a cluster hump that has been. Did the line look better in week 2 vs week 1? They did. That's not exactly hard to do though, is it? They were god awful in week 1. So I'm supposed to be excited they looked merely competent vs the philly 2's and 3's? Nah. I'm good with that.

I want Drake Maye to play. I don't want Brisket to start. Hell I did not want us to sign him in the first place. I want Maye to learn and grow - the right way. Running for your life behind a suspect OL is not the way to do that ... so what I don't want him to do is get behind a line that is average at best on a good day. But now I have seen what we have, there is no way Maye should start til the issues that I see are sussed out and fixed.

Maybe my assessment is wrong - won't be the first time that's happened ( biggest wiffs? BB & Moss ) and everything will be ok. But I am not counting on it.

 

[PatsFan2]

Not to mention Henry and Hooper are not great blockers

Great?? they are not Blockers period! Thanks goodness we can use a back up Tackle in that situation.

 

[Steve102]

Here's the issue I have... It really doesn't matter what rotation they are trying out if its populated with these guys. Average across the board at best. Yes Sow might be a good player... Yes Onwenu might be a good player ... but when they are paired off with a bad line partner, it weakens the entire line across the board...

Everyone that is saying the line "looks good" and "well PFF said they got better" and "Evan Lazar agrees with me" could have quite literally copy and pasted their posts from last two years running. And we saw what a cluster hump that has been. Did the line look better in week 2 vs week 1? They did. That's not exactly hard to do though, is it? They were god awful in week 1. So I'm supposed to be excited they looked merely competent vs the philly 2's and 3's? Nah. I'm good with that.

I want Drake Maye to play. I don't want Brisket to start. Hell I did not want us to sign him in the first place. I want Maye to learn and grow - the right way. Running for your life behind a suspect OL is not the way to do that ... so what I don't want him to do is get behind a line that is average at best on a good day. But now I have seen what we have, there is no way Maye should start til the issues that I see are sussed out and fixed.

Maybe my assessment is wrong - won't be the first time that's happened ( biggest wiffs? BB & Moss ) and everything will be ok. But I am not counting on it.

I think average OL is the best we can hope for right now. I don't think they are average right now, I think they are below average, but they could play better than that as the season goes. Anything Wolf says right now is essentially coach-speak. He has the guys he has, so he's gotta manage them accordingly.

 

[VrabelJr]

Great?? they are not Blockers period! Thanks goodness we can use a back up Tackle in that situation.

We can’t pass out of a 6 OL set. Playing 3 on 7 or 8 is bad numbers.

 

[PancakeBlockPaul]

Only a few years ago we would be saying “it just takes time for the OL to gel and BB’s teams do not start gelling until Oct/Nov”…but since it’s a new regime and our expectations are set so high, extremely high if I may…that the sky is falling since we do not have 6 AllPro level guys out the gate. I love the enthusiasm a lot of us have. We just need to temper said expectations and maybe, dare I say just maybe…lower the bar a tiny smidge of a bit. Just so we don't put ourselves into a bigger issue with the OL (if possible). Like I’ve said in other posts…let’s give it some time

 

[Froob]

These are the type of statements we heard from bad franchises during the dynasty years. It’s quite shocking to see people on board with this new regime.

New regime has barely had time to bring their own guys in. An OL isn’t built in one draft and off season.