Kraft acknowledges drafting woes, says approach is changing

[Lansdowne]

Agree completely.

It’s because of that jackass that quarterbacks had to be protected in the rulebook even more than usual, making it even more difficult for his ilk to make tackles. I bet it burns his ass that he failed to end Brady’s playing career, that Brady has gone to play 12 more seasons and counting after that hit (with 4 more rings to his collection), while he was out of the league by age 30. Love to see it.

 

[Pats1971]

just because Brady won a super bowl with the Bucs doesn't diminish Bill's accomplishments and doesn't mean brady would've won 6 without Bill. Belicheck did have a hand in putting those teams together and putting the defensive game plans together.

If bill brought Aaron Rodgers to the patriots and won a super bowl does that mean that he would've won 6 with any other great QB? it doesn't and its why the argument/analogy is stupid.

I said as soon as I found out Brady was leaving that the media had two stories already written and were waiting to see which one they needed. If Brady left and had success, and the pats didnt, the story would be, well there you go its all Brady, Bill was just along for the ride. If Brady left and didnt do well and the team he went to didnt do well and the pats kept winning, the story is, well there you go, it was all Bill Brady was just along for the ride.
In NFL history never has there been a QB compared to a coach like this. Its stupid as any NFL argument that exists. Brady is a player, Bill is a coach. Thats it, you cannot compare them. Nobody ever said was it walsh or Montana, or was it Bradshaw or Knoll. The entire thing was created in order to do one thing and that is to take the most successful duo of coach and QB of all time and try to diminish one of them. Simple as that.

 

[Pats1971]

Interesting read:
Michael Lombardi sheds new light on why Bill Belichick didn’t call time out at end of Super Bowl XLIX - Pats Pulpit

If they scored though Bill still would have never heard the end of it. 4th and 2 but way louder than that.

Thats like Most things. Had that pass been completed for a TD, Carroll would have been called a genius for fooling the Pats who obviously all thought they would run, but since it was picked, he is a damn fool who should have ran. If Seattle scored, Bill would have been blasted for not calling a Timeout, but since it was Picked Bill is the genius for not doing it. I have said a million times, a coach can only call a play, if the players do not execute and it fails, it does not change the decision of being bad or good that the coach did.
Go to Denver 2003. Pats take a safety on purpose and kick to denver. Had denver drove down the field and scored a TD then the decision means nothing, but the defense had to stop them and get the ball back and Brady and the offense had to go down and score after the stop or the decision is meaningless again. It all works together.

 

[captain stone]

Pollard tried to kill Brady's career...where IS that stupidassle these days?

Dead I hope...the sooner the better...If I'm alive for it I will drive to his funeral and personally spit on his grave in front of all his fanimal punk scum.

 

[captain stone]

This is cool. You made this? Awesome!
The big board looks generally in range. Not a fan of Zaven Collins though ?

Or of Kwity Paye either...and Patrick Surtain at #5? Interesting...

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Thats like Most things. Had that pass been completed for a TD, Carroll would have been called a genius for fooling the Pats who obviously all thought they would run, but since it was picked, he is a damn fool who should have ran. If Seattle scored, Bill would have been blasted for not calling a Timeout, but since it was Picked Bill is the genius for not doing it. I have said a million times, a coach can only call a play, if the players do not execute and it fails, it does not change the decision of being bad or good that the coach did.
Go to Denver 2003. Pats take a safety on purpose and kick to denver. Had denver drove down the field and scored a TD then the decision means nothing, but the defense had to stop them and get the ball back and Brady and the offense had to go down and score after the stop or the decision is meaningless again. It all works together.

I think Belichick is the greatest but we should put things in perspective. Ernie Adams identified this play for repeated practice. And in the actual play itself, Brandon Browner quickly identifies what's happening, you can see him tell Malcolm what to do and Browner gets up fast to prevent the pick.
Finally, in 99% of all cases it's either an incompletion, or tackle at the 1 yard line, still very bad and Seattle likely still scores shortly after. The fact Malcolm Butler intercepted the mf'ing football is miraculous and amazing. I think it's the biggest swing in statistical winning% of a Superbowl play in history. So again, let's not go overboard for Belichick on this one.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I think Belichick is the greatest but we should put things in perspective. Ernie Adams identified this play for repeated practice. And in the actual play itself, Brandon Browner quickly identifies what's happening, you can see him tell Malcolm what to do and Browner gets up fast to prevent the pick.
Finally, in 99% of all cases it's either an incompletion, or tackle at the 1 yard line, still very bad and Seattle likely still scores shortly after. The fact Malcolm Butler intercepted the mf'ing football is miraculous and amazing. I think it's the biggest swing in statistical winning% of a Superbowl play in history. So again, let's not go overboard for Belichick on this one.

Disagree completely. Belichick is the person who has Adam’s do special projects so he can use the information when it is needed, and Belichick was the person who passed on the time-out and forced Carroll into the passing call. Browner definitely helped it by recognizing that Butler was slightly out of position, and Butler made the play, but downplaying Belichick’s role in the play is bogus.

 

[VectorPrime]

Bernard Pollard is actually trying to make an NFL comeback. I’m not joking.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Wherever Pollard is, I hope he’s miserable. **** that guy and **** every single person who celebrated when he injured Brady and Ridley.

Ridley lowered his helmet and tried to challenge Pollard which is a no no. Pollard is a POS, but he’s a guy you don’t try to beat in a helmet to helmet battle.

I think he injured Gronk too. He was also in the same area as Welker during his freak his freak ACL tear in 2009. The guy was the Pats Kryptonite or curse. You might beat his team that day, but they paid dearly for it.

He’s on Twitter. I got into a lengthy argument with him about Brady where he claimed that Brady was just a product of Belichick and Manning was actually the GOAT. His entire argument came down to “ I played the game, I played the game,” and when I told him that so did Dexter Manley and neither one of them can read he blocked me. And it’s true, Peyton Manning is the GOAT, he’s the Tom Brady of commercials. ( Nikki Glaser)

Pollard’s argument is absolutely no different and every bit as lame as the ones made here claiming it was all Brady, Belichick was just along for the ride. Both are equally ignorant. Just like Walsh and Montana, Belichick and Brady achieved their accomplishments by working together, and both deserve equal credit for their accomplishments, you can’t separate and parse the two, unless you are a moron.

I would of gone off on that POS for his lunge at Brady’s knees. Mother f’er should’ve been banned from the league. Should’ve at least been suspended for that year.

Nice on that Dexter Manley reference, fits him to a T.

Pollard’s an ignorant meathead who is always going to hate on Brady. Same with Bart Scott.

Scott has eased off of Brady and shifted the hate to Bill.

 

[Lansdowne]

Disagree completely. Belichick is the person who has Adam’s do special projects so he can use the information when it is needed, and Belichick was the person who passed on the time-out and forced Carroll into the passing call. Browner definitely helped it by recognizing that Butler was slightly out of position, and Butler made the play, but downplaying Belichick’s role in the play is bogus.

That was such an amazing sequence. Seattle doomed themselves by taking too long to get settled after the Kearse catch which forced them to burn their second timeout. Hightower outmuscled a massive human being in Okung to get the tackle on Lynch, with Ayers also coming in to help on the stop. Carroll expected Belichick to use a timeout and panicked when he didn’t, even though Carroll had a timeout in his back pocket if he wanted to try to run it from the 1. That was a heads up moment by Browner to help Butler get in position to defend Lockette. I still can’t believe it.

Sorry for getting off topic but I’m annoyed the helmet catch gets called the biggest play in Super Bowl history, when the outcome of the game wasn’t decided yet after that play whereas Butler’s interception turned it from an almost certain loss to a win. The Giants still had to go another 24 yards to score whereas the Seahawks were right there at the goal with a running back who had just run for 4 yards the previous play. Tyree put the Giants in position to win the game. Butler’s interception effectively ended the game, with the Pats only needing to making sure not to get a safety on offense before kneeling down.

 

[Deus Irae]

Sorry for getting off topic but I’m annoyed the helmet catch gets called the biggest play in Super Bowl history, when the outcome of the game wasn’t decided yet after that play whereas Butler’s interception turned it from an almost certain loss to a win. The Giants still had to go another 24 yards to score whereas the Seahawks were right there at the goal with a running back who had just run for 4 yards the previous play. Tyree put the Giants in position to win the game. Butler’s interception effectively ended the game, with the Pats only needing to making sure not to get a safety on offense before kneeling down.

This is where we point out the difference between 18-1 and 19-0, and hope you can figure out the rest from there.

 

[Huckleberry1]

That was such an amazing sequence. Seattle doomed themselves by taking too long to get settled after the Kearse catch which forced them to burn their second timeout. Hightower outmuscled a massive human being in Okung to get the tackle on Lynch, with Ayers also coming in to help on the stop. Carroll expected Belichick to use a timeout and panicked when he didn’t, even though Carroll had a timeout in his back pocket if he wanted to try to run it from the 1. That was a heads up moment by Browner to help Butler get in position to defend Lockette. I still can’t believe it.

Sorry for getting off topic but I’m annoyed the helmet catch gets called the biggest play in Super Bowl history, when the outcome of the game wasn’t decided yet after that play whereas Butler’s interception turned it from an almost certain loss to a win. The Giants still had to go another 24 yards to score whereas the Seahawks were right there at the goal with a running back who had just run for 4 yards the previous play. Tyree put the Giants in position to win the game. Butler’s interception effectively ended the game, with the Pats only needing to making sure not to get a safety on offense before kneeling down.

Agree completely

 

[Huckleberry1]

This is where we point out the difference between 18-1 and 19-0, and hope you can figure out the rest from there.

Nothing douchey or smarmy about this post,

 

[Lansdowne]

This is where we point out the difference between 18-1 and 19-0, and hope you can figure out the rest from there.

Please do not patronize me, I’m fully aware of the narrative and how the losing team’s record made that play iconic. You’re deliberately glossing over the part where I said the game wasn’t over yet after the helmet catch, whereas Butler’s play effectively ended the game.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Disagree completely. Belichick is the person who has Adam’s do special projects so he can use the information when it is needed, and Belichick was the person who passed on the time-out and forced Carroll into the passing call. Browner definitely helped it by recognizing that Butler was slightly out of position, and Butler made the play, but downplaying Belichick’s role in the play is bogus.

We all know you're the biggest BB homer so needs to be interpreted as such (ignored).

It was certainly ballsy of BB to not call timeout. But the reason we have a Superbowl Ring is because of Malcolm Butler. Even BB making the right move there, if Butler doesn't specifically intercept the ball, the Seahawks still win the Superbowl. It's funny how you can't spread the credit around. Next you're going be like other doofuses here trying to argue the Pats have been excellent at drafting wide receiver.

 

[Deus Irae]

Please do not patronize me, I’m fully aware of the narrative and how the losing team’s record made that play iconic. You’re deliberately glossing over the part where I said the game wasn’t over yet after the helmet catch, whereas Butler’s play effectively ended the game.

I'm not glossing over anything. I'm pointing out the obvious. You're choosing to ignore it.

 

[Huckleberry1]

We all know you're the biggest BB homer so needs to be interpreted as such (ignored).

It was certainly ballsy of BB to not call timeout. But the reason we have a Superbowl Ring is because of Malcolm Butler. Even BB making the right move there, if Butler doesn't specifically intercept the ball, the Seahawks still win the Superbowl. It's funny how you can't spread the credit around. Next you're going be like other doofuses here trying to argue the Pats have been excellent at drafting wide receiver.

I’m a homer for both Belichick and Brady, because both have earned it, and unlike you I don’t spend all day every day *****ing about the exact same thing. And feel free to search my posts on Belichick and WR’s, as I said just a few days ago that he sucks at drafting them. And I did spread the credit around, you just have a reading deficiency, as I said Belichick deserved credit for forcing Carroll into running the pass play they practiced for, Browner deserves credit for moving Butler to the right place, and Butler deserves credit for making the play.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

I’m a homer for both Belichick and Brady, because both have earned it, and unlike you I don’t spend all day every day *****ing about the exact same thing. And feel free to search my posts on Belichick and WR’s, as I said just a few days ago that he sucks at drafting them. And I did spread the credit around, you just have a reading deficiency, as I said Belichick deserved credit for forcing Carroll into running the pass play they practiced for, Browner deserves credit for moving Butler to the right place, and Butler deserves credit for making the play.

Ok. I don't disagree strongly with the above. But

The Patriots have an extra Superbowl ring because of Malcolm Butler specifically intercepting it and not just tipping it away. Seahawks had a 99% win percentage at that point in the game. Goal line at the 1, multiple downs to try, best RB in the league, with almost no time left. Malcolm Butler made the greatest play in Superbowl history.

 

[Lansdowne]

I'm not glossing over anything. I'm pointing out the obvious. You're choosing to ignore it.

You missed my point even though I laid it out entirely in the original post and replied with snark. If that helmet catch happens against a 12-4 Chargers team, it’s a cool play but not the biggest in Super Bowl history. No kidding. You’re ignoring that the Giants needed to make four more plays after that for it to matter (Adalius sack, incomplete to Tyree, convert on 3rd and 11 to Smith, Plaxico in the end zone for the lead). Pats make a stop and this biggest play ever is just a footnote like the Kearse catch was. If Tyree caught that in the end zone for the touchdown you’d have a point, but he didn’t. The Giants still had another down even if he didn’t make the play. Butler misses his play, Lockette scores, with only a narrow chance of victory for the Pats by virtue of getting the ball back on a kickoff.

All the Pats had to do after Butler’s pick was QB sneak and victory formation. Change of possession and run the clock out. Seahawks couldn’t get the ball back. It was over. One play decided the outcome, one play didn’t. I’ll let you figure out which is which, if we want to be snarky here.

I didn’t ignore anything, though I’d be happy to extend the same courtesy you gave to me. Not worth my time.

 

[Deus Irae]

You missed my point even though I laid it out entirely in the original post and replied with snark. If that helmet catch happens against a 12-4 Chargers team, it’s a cool play but not the biggest in Super Bowl history. No kidding.

I didn't miss your point. I find it amusing as hell, though, that you call my posts patronizing while insisting that, if I'd just gotten your point, I'd be sure to agree with you.



That's the same thing I'm saying to you, but I'm saying it about the more important play, because 19-0 v. 18-1 is bigger than just another SB win.

You’re ignoring that the Giants needed to make four more plays after that for it to matter (convert on 3rd and 11, Plaxico in the end zone). Pats make a stop and this biggest play ever is just a footnote like the Kearse catch was. All the Pats had to do after Butler’s pick was QB sneak and victory formation. Change of possession and run the clock out. One play decided the outcome, one play didn’t. I’ll let you figure out which is which, if we want to be snarky here.

I didn’t ignore anything, though I’d be happy to extend the same courtesy you gave to me.

You're ignoring that the Tyree play going incomplete makes it a 4th down play for the Giants. "Four more plays" doesn't even enter into it at that point.