Lakers/Celtics in trade talks with Pels for Anthony Davis

[rochrist]

That team couldn’t get past a team that got jobbed out to the Warriors.

We over achieved in a weak conference that got substantially better.

Last year this a lot of people on this board were saying based off our performance we were golden because Kyrie and Hayward would put us over the top. To double down I got in arguments with people here who said we shouldn’t try to trade for Kawhi because we were all set and we were all but guaranteed a Finals appearance. I remember those discussions where everyone was so sure that last year meant something.

The team that got Kawhi got the superstar they needed that pushed them over the top. We underperformed. We are not better than Toronto with Kawhi. We probably aren’t as bad as this year showed, but we certainly weren’t as good as last year. We are somewhere in the middle which isn’t championship quality.

This is a Star driven league. You need to get stars or you don’t win. The last NBA champions in order featured Kawhi, Durant/Curry, Durant/Curry, Lebron, Curry, a Super Star stacked Spurs team, Lebron, Lebron, Dirk, Kobe, Kobe, Garnett/Pierce/Allen, stacked Spurs team with all time great players, Dwayne Wade, etc..

That's great and all. I still don't want an Anthony Davis who is guaranteed to leave in a year here, especially when getting him would strip the team of all it's assets. Particularly since Davis has never led anybody within 10 miles of a title. At least Kawhi had that going for him.

 

[rochrist]

Do you think trading for Kawhi was worth it? Because he might not re sign with Toronto and they will have given a franchise legend away for him.

This isn’t the NFL. You are quite literally in the business of collecting talent here. One year of AD is worth more than 10 of Tatum/Brown

No. It isn't. See? I can play that game too. Just because you say it, doesn't make it so. If Kawhi doesn't resign and they blow the team up, then from my point of view, it wouldn't be worth it. Granted, for Toronto fans, you have to take into account that it's their first title. The Celtics have 17. I'm not interested in one and dones. In truth, the NBA is an eyelash away from losing me altogether with the whole cool kids teaming up to get a title in a town they like.

 

[lancerman]

No. It isn't. See? I can play that game too. Just because you say it, doesn't make it so. If Kawhi doesn't resign and they blow the team up, then from my point of view, it wouldn't be worth it. Granted, for Toronto fans, you have to take into account that it's their first title. The Celtics have 17. I'm not interested in one and dones. In truth, the NBA is an eyelash away from losing me altogether with the whole cool kids teaming up to get a title in a town they like.

Let’s be real for a second, the Celtics have one title in the last 30 years. And 13 of those 17 came 40 to 50 years ago. Which isn’t that far off from when the Browns were really good. And they got that one title because they went all in through trades and free agency. Toronto has as many as us in the last 3 decades and that very likely would have been us if we traded to get Kawhi.

The league is structured the way the league structured. You can dislike it, but that’s the way it is. The realistic scenario is even with Tatum and Brown you need some star to come to town or get lucky and draft one (in which case you need to be in the lottery) to have a shot at the title. The East was much weaker last year. We can’t pretend the team will be magically better without its best player, regardless of how you feel about him.

Toronto might have to blow up their team. But they blow it up having gotten a ring which is the goal. And unless you have a legit superstar with a long term commitment, that’s the game you have to play. Id much rather make the trade to get our second title in 3 decades than hope that someone comes along to take us out of purgatory

 

[rochrist]

Let’s be real for a second, the Celtics have one title in the last 30 years. And 13 of those 17 came 40 to 50 years ago. Which isn’t that far off from when the Browns were really good. And they got that one title because they went all in through trades and free agency. Toronto has as many as us in the last 3 decades and that very likely would have been us if we traded to get Kawhi.

The league is structured the way the league structured. You can dislike it, but that’s the way it is. The realistic scenario is even with Tatum and Brown you need some star to come to town or get lucky and draft one (in which case you need to be in the lottery) to have a shot at the title. The East was much weaker last year. We can’t pretend the team will be magically better without its best player, regardless of how you feel about him.

Toronto might have to blow up their team. But they blow it up having gotten a ring which is the goal. And unless you have a legit superstar with a long term commitment, that’s the game you have to play. Id much rather make the trade to get our second title in 3 decades than hope that someone comes along to take us out of purgatory

Of course Kawhi wasn't a lottery pick. Neither was Giannis. Ginobli was the 57th pick. Draymond Green was a 2d rounder. Klay Thompson was the 11th pick. Great players come from all over the draft.

Anyway, agree to disagree. I don't enjoy or want rent-a-titles.

 

[rochrist]

Davis to LA for Ball, Ingrahm, some other guy and THREE first rounders including #4.

Done deal.

 

[lancerman]

Okay so Lakers now have Lebron, AD, Kuzma and have cap room for another max deal which honestly they could use on a Kyrie or really draw anybody.

See in two years they went from absolute trash that were nowhere near us to selling out the whole corp they built and now should be a top 3 at worst team until Lebron completely declines in the West.

Meanwhile the massive build that the Celtics have been doing the last several years is about to yield them getting left at the altar when Kyrie is gone and a team with absolutely no chance to compete for at least a couple years and that assuming Tatum and Brown develop better than we can realistically hope.

That's how the NBA is.

 

[captain stone]

I can't believe that NO caved on demanding Kuzma from the feckin Fakers after they demanded Tatum from us. Feck them, and Feck the Fakers too.

Kyrie Irving's not going to LA; he wants to win a non-Lebroni title for himself, preferably while beating Lebroni for it in the finals.

It is for that reason why non-destination teams such as Boston must consistently maximize their draft picks and not be afraid to blow it all apart whenever it's obvious that the current roster isn't talented enough to be considered serious contenders. You just Cannot trade up during the draft and Still miss Giannis A....those decisions are history-making, and not in a good way.

 

[rochrist]

Okay so Lakers now have Lebron, AD, Kuzma and have cap room for another max deal which honestly they could use on a Kyrie or really draw anybody.

See in two years they went from absolute trash that were nowhere near us to selling out the whole corp they built and now should be a top 3 at worst team until Lebron completely declines in the West.

Meanwhile the massive build that the Celtics have been doing the last several years is about to yield them getting left at the altar when Kyrie is gone and a team with absolutely no chance to compete for at least a couple years and that assuming Tatum and Brown develop better than we can realistically hope.

That's how the NBA is.

They don't actually have quite cap room for another max deal. Plus, AD will be a free agent at the end of the year so they'll have to pay him.

 

[ViperGTS]

I can't believe that NO caved on demanding Kuzma from the feckin Fakers after they demanded Tatum from us. Feck them, and Feck the Fakers too.

Kyrie Irving's not going to LA; he wants to win a non-Lebroni title for himself, preferably while beating Lebroni for it in the finals.

It is for that reason why non-destination teams such as Boston must consistently maximize their draft picks and not be afraid to blow it all apart whenever it's obvious that the current roster isn't talented enough to be considered serious contenders. You just Cannot trade up during the draft and Still miss Giannis A....those decisions are history-making, and not in a good way.

I literally got hated on a Celtics forum for standing up to people who said trade everything for one year of AD. Literally had a large part in getting me banned. I said long ago he wasn't coming to Boston for JT, JB and whatever else was needed. Kept it up, for months and months. Got home late today, and opened B/r to see AD traded. To whom I wondered with significant interest? The Lakers? Ahahahahahha I knew it. He can go play with broken down Bron Bron.

Trust me, the Cs will be fine. Tatum and Brown will grow into forces.

 

[lancerman]

They don't actually have quite cap room for another max deal. Plus, AD will be a free agent at the end of the year so they'll have to pay him.

This year they can give a max to somebody for one year then obviously next year you have to use it on AD. I could be wrong, but I've been hearing it from Lakers fans all day

 

[lancerman]

I can't believe that NO caved on demanding Kuzma from the feckin Fakers after they demanded Tatum from us. Feck them, and Feck the Fakers too.

Kyrie Irving's not going to LA; he wants to win a non-Lebroni title for himself, preferably while beating Lebroni for it in the finals.

It is for that reason why non-destination teams such as Boston must consistently maximize their draft picks and not be afraid to blow it all apart whenever it's obvious that the current roster isn't talented enough to be considered serious contenders. You just Cannot trade up during the draft and Still miss Giannis A....those decisions are history-making, and not in a good way.

This is what you have to understand, AD made it abundantly clear that he was leaving NO after next year no matter what and that he had no interest being there. New Orleans basically got what they got in exchange for opting out of their last year with AD. They were doubtful to be a contender next year and with Zion coming in they have a future to look towards. So this was the right play. Get a haul to build around Zion. They also can package that 4th pick for something else if they want it and compile on this trade.

Also don't be so sure that Kyrie isn't going to LA. He just followed the Lakers. Also Kawhi is out there too and who knows what he will do. He wanted to go to LA last year. Maybe a title changed his mind.

The real take away here is that one in the hand is worth more than one in the bush. We had the option to make moves and make trades to get proven talent and instead we told ourselves to rest on the potential of Tatum and Brown and that Kyrie and Hayward coming back would make all the difference based on a strong showing last year.

This is very dissapointing. Last year we were poised to be set up to run the East for the next decade. Now we are back to square one and the Lakers are pretty much golden for a few years.

 

[rochrist]

This year they can give a max to somebody for one year then obviously next year you have to use it on AD. I could be wrong, but I've been hearing it from Lakers fans all day

They have something like 27.3 mil available and no players.

 

[rochrist]

This is the story on the picks they got:

No. 4 pick in 2019
Top-8 protected in 2021, becomes unprotected in ‘22
Unprotected swap in ‘23
Unprotected first in ‘24
Unprotected swap in ‘25

James will be 38 in 23. And so on.

Note that's 3 1st rounders PLUS TWO unprotected swaps.

 

[ViperGTS]

This is the story on the picks they got:

No. 4 pick in 2019
Top-8 protected in 2021, becomes unprotected in ‘22
Unprotected swap in ‘23
Unprotected first in ‘24
Unprotected swap in ‘25

James will be 38 in 23. And so on.

Note that's 3 1st rounders PLUS TWO unprotected swaps.

Yep. James is always breaking down and will only get worse as time goes on. As an aside, I want Danny to trade for Lonzo. Dude is exactly what the Cs need, a pass first guard that will make Tatum and Brown amazing.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

I'm not convinced Tatum is the guy. I know he's young but he has too many Melo-iso tendencies. They still have a major logjam with Tatum, Hayward, Jaylen at the same positions

.

 

[scout]

Yep. James is always breaking down and will only get worse as time goes on. As an aside, I want Danny to trade for Lonzo. Dude is exactly what the Cs need, a pass first guard that will make Tatum and Brown amazing.

Not to mention AD is not always a healthy player. I was somewhat surprised with Lonzo as part of the equation as his dad is a pain in the .... If NO trades a player, wouldn't be surprised if it is Lonzo. Celtics acquiring Lonzo would produce articles.

 

[PaulNEPats]

I literally got hated on a Celtics forum for standing up to people who said trade everything for one year of AD. Literally had a large part in getting me banned. I said long ago he wasn't coming to Boston for JT, JB and whatever else was needed. Kept it up, for months and months. Got home late today, and opened B/r to see AD traded. To whom I wondered with significant interest? The Lakers? Ahahahahahha I knew it. He can go play with broken down Bron Bron.

Trust me, the Cs will be fine. Tatum and Brown will grow into forces.

Unless Danny pulls something out of his ass, this Cs team as currently constituted is built as a 2nd round playoff exit. Worst place you can be in the NBA is stuck in purgatory.

 

[PaulNEPats]

Also, **** Rich Paul

 

[rochrist]

Not to mention AD is not always a healthy player. I was somewhat surprised with Lonzo as part of the equation as his dad is a pain in the .... If NO trades a player, wouldn't be surprised if it is Lonzo. Celtics acquiring Lonzo would produce articles.

Eh, I doubt he'll be the same pain in the ass in NO. There isn't really any point. Plus, Lonzo will be a major force multiplier for Zion.

 

[captain stone]

This is what you have to understand, AD made it abundantly clear that he was leaving NO after next year no matter what and that he had no interest being there. New Orleans basically got what they got in exchange for opting out of their last year with AD. They were doubtful to be a contender next year and with Zion coming in they have a future to look towards. So this was the right play. Get a haul to build around Zion. They also can package that 4th pick for something else if they want it and compile on this trade.

Also don't be so sure that Kyrie isn't going to LA. He just followed the Lakers. Also Kawhi is out there too and who knows what he will do. He wanted to go to LA last year. Maybe a title changed his mind.

The real take away here is that one in the hand is worth more than one in the bush. We had the option to make moves and make trades to get proven talent and instead we told ourselves to rest on the potential of Tatum and Brown and that Kyrie and Hayward coming back would make all the difference based on a strong showing last year.

This is very dissapointing. Last year we were poised to be set up to run the East for the next decade. Now we are back to square one and the Lakers are pretty much golden for a few years.

I'm not really that upset that Danny didn't sell the farm for one year of Davis; I'm more upset that NO blinked first vs the Fakers and didn't stick to their demand that Kuzma be included in any trade scenarios instead of Joshua Hart.