Malcolm Butler Mega Thread

[luuked]

What values? He reached out for a guy booked for drunk driving when we were short on WRs.

Apples to Oranges.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Hey, if you think it was worth losing the Super Bowl because Butler missed curfew, good for you. I prefer Bill act like a football coach instead of a petty hall monitor and do what it takes to win, like his job description reads, but that's just me. Sleep easy tonight knowing that sixth Lombardi wasn't worth it because now, thank God, Malcolm truly understands he can't be late to practice, and isn't that the most important thing?

Do you seriously think BB benched Malcolm over a curfew violation? Really?

 

[chumpchange]

Here's just the reality of the situation. Belichick's getting lit up by the media and former players, and one current player who is crucial to our defense gave a tactic approval to the criticism. We've also had multiple people insinuate the locker room was divided over it.

If it was ANY OTHER COACH IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE you'd hear talk about whether this was a big enough deal to get that coach fired. Belichick should not be fired. He also shouldn't get a giant pass because of his history either. Butler making one tackle or one stop was very likely the difference between winning and losing. The Eagles went 10/16 on third down and 2/2 for 4th. Changing outcome on one of those 12 plays is likely 7 points off the board.

Belichick's fortunate that he's in the greatest of all time discussion and that the only thing this will do to him is put a stain on his legacy and have people say "yeah he's one of the greatest coaches ever, but he also likely cost a team a Super Bowl because he made a last minute decision to sit one of the best CB's on the team and refused to budge when it became apparent his defense couldn't get a stop". Like that's part of the equation now.

Now of course if it comes out that Butler was on crack the night before or nearly committed a felony or was punching coaches, etc..... then that's different. But Belichick's going to walk into next season with a lot of questions. And be prepared to hear about this when people talk about Belichick's place in history

I agree. I don't want Bill fired, of course, but this was a big enough blunder that were he not Bill Belichick, it'd be fodder for termination discussions. If Jeff Fisher did this, people would be calling for his head.

 

[lancerman]

Apples to Oranges.

That's a thing that happened. We also signed Kenny Britt this year. But Butler might have smoked some pot and was late for a meeting..

 

[luuked]

I get how people are sad and pissed off. I get it.

For 18 years has hard and fast rules and expectations. Malcolm knew them. All 52 knew them.

For whatever reason, he decided he did not want to adhere to them anymore.

"What will he do? Bench ME for the SB?"

Whatever happened it was an incredibly egoistic choice Butler made. Stay disciplined for 2 more days to cash in on a year of hard work and then a month later in FA.

 

[chumpchange]

Do you seriously think BB benched Malcolm over a curfew violation? Really?

That's what the media's reporting; personally I think Bill made his decision and was too prideful (as Hightower indicated) to change after this new strategy was tanking before his eyes. But what Butler did was immaterial. Short of Malcolm outright murdering someone, he should have played in this game.

 

[ashley]

Wow, 91 pages on this thread...I really think we need to wait and see what happened and we're probably going to have to hear it from Butler.

Are the Pat fans frustrated, sure, but one of the things that makes Bill the GOAT is he is not going to tolerate things that other coaches will. That's why their teams are so undisciplined.

I highly doubt Bill is going to bench Butler for missing or being late for a meeting. I just think we need to hear all the facts first.

 

[lancerman]

I agree. I don't want Bill fired, of course, but this was a big enough blunder that were he not Bill Belichick, it'd be fodder for termination discussions. If Jeff Fisher did this, people would be calling for his head.

I don't want him fired either. But there's a whole subset of people here who think if Belichick made the decision it was 100% justified. And I'm saying, 31 other coaches in the league would not feel comfortable with their job security today if they did what Belichick did

 

[IllegalContact]

I'm talking about 90min before the game.

You don't think he anticipated fallout? Do you think he cares?

He didn’t anticipate losing......this type of **** doesn’t go over nearly as well in defeat

He’d still be with the browns/ravens if he had the same 1st 5 years there as here

 

[luuked]

I agree. I don't want Bill fired, of course, but this was a big enough blunder that were he not Bill Belichick, it'd be fodder for termination discussions. If Jeff Fisher did this, people would be calling for his head.

Yes. People would fire a head coach that despite some key injuries had one of the top scoring offenses and top scoring defenses, won top seed in their conference and made it to the SB because one of his CBs felt he could break the team rules on the eve of the SB and got benched for it.

Exactly that would happen. Jesus..

 

[Huckleberry1]

I get how people are sad and pissed off. I get it.

For 18 years has hard and fast rules and expectations. Malcolm knew them. All 52 knew them.

For whatever reason, he decided he did not want to adhere to them anymore.

I don’t believe it was just a broken rule, I think it was more like sending Collins to Cleveland, I think Butler acted like he didn’t give a sh.t over the two week period leading up to the game and assumed Beluchick would still have no choice but to play him. I think Belichick saw that and something happened the weekend of the game. Belichick decided he was done with his act and went with the players he believed were all in.

 

[lancerman]

Wow, 91 pages on this thread...I really think we need to wait and see what happened and we're probably going to have to hear it from Butler.

Are the Pat fans frustrated, sure, but one of the things that makes Bill the GOAT is he is not going to tolerate things that other coaches will. That's why their teams are so undisciplined.

I highly doubt Bill is going to bench Butler for missing or being late for a meeting. I just think we need to hear all the facts first.

The irony in this statement is that someday he's going to be compared to great coaches in history like Lombardi, Halas, Jackson and Auerbech in basketball etc. And the big knock against Belichick is going to be that he completely crapped the bed here and his decision to bench a starter probably cost his team a title. And that's probably going to make a lot of people feel justified keeping Belichick out of that discussion.

That's just the way those things go. He messed up here.

 

[luuked]

That's a thing that happened. We also signed Kenny Britt this year. But Butler might have smoked some pot and was late for a meeting..

Again. Apples to Oranges. But keep on trying it is entertaining..

 

[chumpchange]

Yes. People would fire a head coach that despite some key injuries had one of the top scoring offenses and top scoring defenses, won top seed in their conference and made it to the SB because one of his CBs felt he could break the team rules on the eve of the SB and got benched for it.

Exactly that would happen. Jesus..

People would fire a head coach who willingly handicapped his own team to prove a point. Kraft has admitted to "tension" and said "egos need to be checked at the door" of the situation; Hightower assessed the whole benching mess as "foolish pride".

 

[RobertWeathers]

That's what the media's reporting; personally I think Bill made his decision and was too prideful (as Hightower indicated) to change after this new strategy was tanking before his eyes. But what Butler did was immaterial. Short of Malcolm outright murdering someone, he should have played in this game.

Ok let's all the players miss flights, smoke weed, get drunk, mouth off and they can still play in the playoffs but not regular season games.

Slippery slope my friend....

 

[lancerman]

Yes. People would fire a head coach that despite some key injuries had one of the top scoring offenses and top scoring defenses, won top seed in their conference and made it to the SB because one of his CBs felt he could break the team rules on the eve of the SB and got benched for it.

Exactly that would happen. Jesus..

People were screaming for Bevell's head because he called a pass instead of a run in a Super Bowl. Imagine if Carroll lost that Super Bowl because he said Richard Sherman couldn't play because he was causing behind the scenes issues?

Maybe a coach wouldn't be fired. But they'd be having some serious talks with management in the off season and there would be a restructuring of power in the organization as far as how much notice he'd have to give the team in these types of situations. Some coaches would be fired. If Marrone benched Bouye or Ramsey in the AFCCG or Super Bowl, he might be fired.

And yeah any other coach would be hearing the media chirping about his job security. Belichick's rightfully built up a resume that defends him from that. But this is a big personal stain on him and his legacy as a coach.

 

[letekro]

Wow, 91 pages on this thread...I really think we need to wait and see what happened and we're probably going to have to hear it from Butler.

Are the Pat fans frustrated, sure, but one of the things that makes Bill the GOAT is he is not going to tolerate things that other coaches will. That's why their teams are so undisciplined.

I highly doubt Bill is going to bench Butler for missing or being late for a meeting. I just think we need to hear all the facts first.

We DID hear from Butler. He seemed to say he thought it was performance related.

“They gave up on me. [Expletive]. It is what it is,” Butler told them. “I don’t know what it was. I guess I wasn’t playing good or they didn’t feel comfortable.”

‘I could have changed that game,’ says benched Malcolm Butler - The Boston Globe

 

[bormio]

Only to play him as an absolute emergency is my guess. Additionally making him inactive would have emotionally messed up the team 90min before the game

Making him inactive would have lent finality to it though. The way he did it - players had to be thinking during the game that Belichick was going to relent. When that did not happen, it was probably even more of a distraction. Precipitating argument in the locker room before kickoff should have been avoided if possible.

 

[RobertWeathers]

He didn’t anticipate losing......this type of **** doesn’t go over nearly as well in defeat

He’d still be with the browns/ravens if he had the same 1st 5 years there as here

That's irrelevant. He isn't there.

 

[lancerman]

Ok let's all the players miss flights, smoke weed, get drunk, mouth off and they can still play in the playoffs but not regular season games.

Slippery slope my friend....

Slippery slope arguments are notoriously awful and have been used to justify countless bad decisions. For one most of what you said is pure speculation in the first place.

Moral stands are nice, but Bill Belichick of all people isn't getting credit for any moral stand, and today he is a loser for it.