It's time for Amendola to step up

[Brady6]

No it was Brady6 initially and Deus defended his description. I don't want to drag B6 over the coals for that, I get being disappointed after a loss, but it just demonstrates that B6 needs to temper his rather over the top assessments of this team. And most importantly, he shouldn't keep telling us that we are wrong if we disagree with his singular view.

I won't even say what he said about Blount in that post <ouch>

No it was me, I admit it I was wrong about Blount he has shown drastic improvement and my knowledge of Chris Jones was limited and I didn't bother to do any research so I just labeled him as not good based on him being an in season pickup.

I never claimed to be right all the time, but if you look at my posting I own my mistakes openly and for the most part I take a solid unbiased that relies on stats and metrics.

I want nothing more than Danny Amendola to be the player you all claim he can be but I am not seeing it on the field or the stat sheet this season or any other season and I'm not going to sit here and put his results on a week 1 groin injury that had a reported max recovery time of 6 weeks and a prognoses that surgery was not needed. I will praise Amendola when he does well as I did after week 15 but I am going to be critical when he doesn't play well and this season there have been more weeks that were poor than good. As far as the groin goes it's not an excuses in my mind because he has played well in games with the injury, heck he played well in the game he suffered the injury, that reflects an inconsistent player who excels and certain match ups and struggles in others not an injured player.

 

[Brady6]

Amendola should be evaluated on his own merits and in that respect he's had an OK season but there have been enough mitigating factors that warrant a further look and an incomplete assessment report. That's all I've said and I've never compared him to Edelman or Welker - although you keep telling me that's what I'm doing.









Have you considered the possibility that having two productive receivers might actually be a good thing in Brady's final years? Just throwing that radical idea out there.

I think it would be great if Amendola was productive, I just fear his contract is going to prevent us from retaining Edelman which would mean Amendola was more harmful than helpful in my opinion. As long as we don't lose players like Edelman, Talib and even Blount because of the overpaying of Amendola I am thrilled to have him, oh and if posters can drag in the hanging carrot that Amemdola is going to make me choke on crow someday soon.

 

[SalemPats]

I think it would be great if Amendola was productive, I just fear his contract is going to prevent us from retaining Edelman which would mean Amendola was more harmful than helpful in my opinion. As long as we don't lose players like Edelman, Talib and even Blount because of the overpaying of Amendola I am thrilled to have him, oh and if posters can drag in the hanging carrot that Amemdola is going to make me choke on crow someday soon.

I wouldn't worry about that we're retaining Edelman. He showed he's the superior WR this year. He's a machine

 

[willard]

I was very pleased with what Amendola produced yesterday.

We do have a problem in the red zone with all the smurfs for receiver. If Dobson can not comeback and if Thompkins is hurt for another game, what about Moss as a red zone threat. Probably no one else could show up and have the instant chemistry needed to work with Tom like Randy could. Just think he could add something to the team that it really is missing.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I was very pleased with what Amendola produced yesterday.

We do have a problem in the red zone with all the smurfs for receiver. If Dobson can not comeback and if Thompkins is hurt for another game, what about Moss as a red zone threat. Probably no one else could show up and have the instant chemistry needed to work with Tom like Randy could. Just think he could add something to the team that it really is missing.

With all that went down in 2010 and what the 2013 Pats have going I don't want Moss anywhere near this team.

 

[Guts]

You would all be ****ting yourselfs if Amendola re injured himself. At this point every WR that can do enough is extremely valuable.

 

[primetime]

Amendola's contract isn't going to affect the Patriots' chance to retain Edelman. You can pay two productive receivers. The salary cap is not a big issue for any team in the NFL.

 

[supafly]

I was very pleased with what Amendola produced yesterday.

We do have a problem in the red zone with all the smurfs for receiver. If Dobson can not comeback and if Thompkins is hurt for another game, what about Moss as a red zone threat. Probably no one else could show up and have the instant chemistry needed to work with Tom like Randy could. Just think he could add something to the team that it really is missing.

With all that went down in 2010 and what the 2013 Pats have going I don't want Moss anywhere near this team.

I think Belichick has proven time and again that no one player is bigger than the team, and while we likely won't know the ins/outs of last week's Spikes situation, the writing may be on the wall that we've seen in very recently.

The odds of Belichick even remotely considering a guy like Randy Moss, who is totally out of football shape and is under contract with FOX sports (not sure why so many overlook this fact), and attempting to add him in the season's most important week are less than 1%.

 

[supafly]

Amendola was unstoppable in the first game. Since then somewhat injured. I hope edelmen will settle for amendola like money.

If anyone is actually considering giving Edelman approx. 6m dollars per year AAV based on one season of productivity when we had no other real options, they need their head examined in my opinion.

You may end up being right, but I think Edelman's ceiling is about 2/3rds of what Amendola signed for, and that may even be a bit generous.

 

[supafly]

In what world will Gronkowski be healthy? I have more faith in Amendola lasting a full season over him. Boyce and Thompkins? Complete unknowns. Amendola had a good game last night, he didn't have many catches, but a few were big, and Brady only completed 11 passes anyway.

Brady completed 13/25 passes last night. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility to think that Gronkowski will be healthy again. The ACL is kind of a strange occurrence, not to mention the multiple arm surgeries due to removing infections, etc. Those aren't necessarily the kind of nagging injuries that scream problems to me for the future, but we'll have to see.

I can understand your questioning for sure, just not the level of apprehension, and the assumption that he'll never be healthy again.

 

[Brady6]

If anyone is actually considering giving Edelman approx. 6m dollars per year AAV based on one season of productivity when we had no other real options, they need their head examined in my opinion.



You may end up being right, but I think Edelman's ceiling is about 2/3rds of what Amendola signed for, and that may even be a bit generous.

I'm confused by this he had a 100+ receptions, 1000+ receiving yards and 5+ touchdowns this season. How are you finding no issue with Amendola being paid what he makes but think a team would need their head examined if they paid Edelman that same amount, Amendola has never achieved anything close to the type of season Edelman has.

Edelman also was very productive as a rookie and last season in his opportunities he had decent numbers for the teams 5th or 6th option in just 9 games.

Amendola played 12 games, Vereen played 8 and Gronkowski played 7, plus the rookies. We had options, not mention a lack of options world mean Edelman faced more coverage and still succeeded.

 

[supafly]

I'm confused by this he had a 100+ receptions, 1000+ receiving yards and 5+ touchdowns this season. How are you finding no issue with Amendola being paid what he makes but think a team would need their head examined if they paid Edelman that same amount, Amendola has never achieved anything close to the type of season Edelman has.

Edelman also was very productive as a rookie and last season in his opportunities he had decent numbers for the teams 5th or 6th option in just 9 games.

Amendola played 12 games, Vereen played 8 and Gronkowski played 7, plus the rookies. We had options, not mention a lack of options world mean Edelman faced more coverage and still succeeded.

I think many have attempted to explain it to you, so there's no use going around in circles due to what is nothing more than a difference of opinions.

One year in an offense with no other options normally doesn't equal to 6m per year, but we'll have to see. It's strange to me that you are continuously knocking Amendola's contract, but yet are completely ready to make Edelman one of the highest slot receivers in the game with the same kind of money after one year under extremely odd circumstances.

Yes--Edelman rose to the occasion and had a great year, but I'm not as certain as you that there won't be any middle stop between 700k and 6m per year....

 

[Brady6]

I think many have attempted to explain it to you, so there's no use going around in circles due to what is nothing more than a difference of opinions.

One year in an offense with no other options normally doesn't equal to 6m per year, but we'll have to see. It's strange to me that you are continuously knocking Amendola's contract, but yet are completely ready to make Edelman one of the highest slot receivers in the game with the same kind of money after one year under extremely odd circumstances.

Yes--Edelman rose to the occasion and had a great year, but I'm not as certain as you that there won't be any middle stop between 700k and 6m per year....

Sup you know I have a lot of respect for you in fact as I have said to you before you’re one my favorite poster on the board so I don’t want this to result in any negative feelings towards each other. With that in mind I will attempt to respectfully respond to your post.

• I never said I wanted to give Edelman a $6,000,000 a year contract; but considering you have advocated that Amendola is deserving of his pay I find it surprising that you feel it would be so crazy for a team to pay Edelman something similar. Amendola never had a 100+ receptions, 1000+ receiving yards and 5+ touchdowns in his career, so why is he deserving and Edelman isn’t in your opinion?
• I think you’re confusing more opportunity for being a better player on some level. Prior to this season Amendola and Edelman’s stats broke down as follows:
o Amendola – targeted 293 times, 196 receptions, 1726 receiving yards, 8.8 yards per average, 7 touchdowns
o Edelman – targeted 122 times, 78 receptions, 789 receiving yards, 10.11 yards per average, 6 touchdowns
• Edelman was playing behind Wes Welker an all pro and widely considered the best slot receiver to ever play in the NFL so his opportunity to play was limited by that, Amendola was in St. Louis and led the team in targets in 2010 and 2012, was 4th on the team in 2009, and in 2011 he only played in 1 games. Edelman ranked 6th (32) in 2012, 10th in 2011 (8), 9th in 2010 (14) and 3rd (54) in 2009 in times targeted on the Patriots. Every time Edelman has had the opportunity he has been successful, as a rookie he caught 43 footballs in 12 games for 404 receiving yards and 3 touchdowns, last season he had 21 receptions for 235 receiving yards and 3 touchdowns despite only 32 balls being tossed his way. He may have only had one really good season but as I said every chance he has received he played well, and if you think Amendola would have had the opportunity and the results he had with Wes Welker on the same team I disagree completely. Sometimes it is the times that make the man and not the man who makes the times.
• Amendola was the #1 option throughout camp, in the preseason Amendola was the starter with Edelman as the 4th receiver, when Edelman returned in week 5 he was given back his starting role and led the team in times targeted, again when he returned from injury in week 8 and was reinserted as the top slot receiver, he was targeted more times in weeks 8, 9 and 11. In week 12 against Denver after Amendola struggled to get open in the first half Edelman was inserted as the #1 option and he has excelled since. He beat out Amendola rising from the 4th WR in preseason to the #1 option despite Amendola being given every opportunity to keep the #1 role over him.
• Brady threw the football 628 times the 2nd most times ever in his career, Edelman was targeted 151 times which equates to 24% of his passes going to Edelman so 76% of the passes went elsewhere so clearly he was not the only option on the team; 27% in 2012 and 28% in 2011 went to Welker so would that make him the only option?
• Edelman was 4th in the NFL in receptions and but 10th in times targeted so it’s not like we forced the football to him and that is the only reason he succeeded.


Nobody has explained anything to me Sup well nothing logical or rational anyway, you and a handful of other Amendola supporters want me to believe that he is a $5,700,000 a year receiver when nothing in his career merits that, we’re talking about a wide receiver who averages under 10 yards per reception in his career and 5 years in has yet to hit double digits in touchdowns but I am supposed to think that he is worth the money but then a receiver who does average 10+ yards per reception in his career, does have 10+ touchdowns in his career, has had a 100 reception and 1000 yards season, has a better catch to target ratio and who took the starting job from the $5,700,000 a year player should not get a similar contract. No offense man but that is ridiculous, everything about Amendola is built on hopes and excuses while Edelman is actually doing the job how in the world is Amendola worth more?

 

[Brady6]

Lmao-Reading comprehension, it's a wonderful thing...........

Happy New Year Ivan I hope you have a happy and prosperous 2014 buddy!

 

[Brady6]

If you paid the same price for a Kia that you pay for a Bentley you’re going to be disappointed with the Kia; if you pay the $15-$30 grand that most Kia’s sticker out at you’re likely going to be pleased/happy with the Kia. The same logic applies to Amendola he is being paid as a top 30 player at his position and performing like a receiver between outside of the top 60 in the NFL. If he was being paid like a player outside the top 60 I would be happy but since his cost is top 30 I am unhappy.

 

[Brady6]

Thanks for reminding us. That is the most narcissistic thread in Patsfans history, NEM not excepted. The fact that you believe you are the arbiter of what is worthy of criticism and what isn't is really screwed up.

Narcissistic? Are you in the mental health profession? If not since I am not a doctor and cant diagnose Amendola’s groin I don’t think you can diagnose me with a mental health disorder by what you read in a sports forum.

Any way I opened the thread in defense of Amendola because many poster felt he cost us the Miami game by not making the play in the final minute, I disagreed because I felt it was a difficult catch that could have went either way and therefore he did not choke as many suggested. The response was to Patsrock who said it didn’t matter what Amendola did cause I would criticize it and I showed him the thread link to show him that was untrue and when Amendola has done well I have recognized openly.

I am not sure why you have so much anger towards me honestly, I actually try and be nice to you and have told you several times that I don’t have any issue with you. We can disagree about a player without having animosity between us Ivan it’s really not like we’re attacking each other first born we’re just passionate about a sports team and the discussions get heated but it is not a personal thing, you seem like a nice guy and we both love the same team I see no reason why we can’t just get along or at least respect each other.

 

[mgteich]

1) You seem not to consider sunk cost. Amendola will cost us a bit more than $1M of new money for his services in 2014. It is reasonable to say that we shouldn't have paid him so much to sign him, but I thought the Welker debates were over. It is almost never right to pay a player a high salary when he is injured for much of the season.

2) The fact that we paid too much for Amendola in 2013 does not affect the market for Edelman in 2014. It probably doesn't even affect how much the patriots are willing to offer Edelman.

3) IMHO, if Edelman had Amendola's 2013 injuries and Amendola was as healthy as Edelman was, then I would have expected that it would have been Amendola would had 100 receptions. Brady had Amendola ready for the season. Injuries intervened.

If you paid the same price for a Kia that you pay for a Bentley you’re going to be disappointed with the Kia; if you pay the $15-$30 grand that most Kia’s sticker out at you’re likely going to be pleased/happy with the Kia. The same logic applies to Amendola he is being paid as a top 30 player at his position and performing like a receiver between outside of the top 60 in the NFL. If he was being paid like a player outside the top 60 I would be happy but since his cost is top 30 I am unhappy.

 

[supafly]

Sup you know I have a lot of respect for you in fact as I have said to you before you’re one my favorite poster on the board so I don’t want this to result in any negative feelings towards each other. With that in mind I will attempt to respectfully respond to your post.

I appreciate that, and it is one of the main reasons why I see no reason to go around in circles since we obviously have a differing viewpoint on the subject itself, which is to be expected at times. Like I said, my comments and responses are nothing more than a difference of opinions, so I don't mean to come off as snarky.

I think you're beating a dead horse a bit, but sometimes that happens and I and many others have been guilty of the same thing at times.

Nobody has explained anything to me Sup well nothing logical or rational anyway, you and a handful of other Amendola supporters want me to believe that he is a $5,700,000 a year receiver

I agree with you that he's not a "5.7m dollar receiver," however he didn't cost 5.7million and very well may never cost 5.7million. As I've tried to explain, he had a cost of 2m base salary and another million for guarantees totaling 3 million dollars this year. I see no reason to overreact about 3 million dollars. If that were the case, we could choose any number of players to complain about.

As has been pointed out, you are seeing Amendola's pact in the same sense as one would've viewed Donovan McNabb's 100 million.

The Patriots may never pay Amendola that kind of money, as a restructuring or outright cut may occur when the decision needs to be made. They don't have much choice for the first 2 yrs, but then they have the option to take it however they wish. That is exactly why I keep telling you to simply chill out about it. He didn't make "5.7 million dollars," nor is he going to in 2014 either. Therefore, it's not a concern!!!

There aren't going to be too many WRs who have the experience in the system already (one of the biggest obstacles out there to talented receivers never making it here), a year under Brady and Belichick's scheme--not to mention JMcD, and the kind of potential to immediately step in at the slot as we saw in game #1 and carry the team on his back. You keep forgetting all of these things, not to mention the fact that Amendola and Edelman are playing roles which Belichick and McDaniels carved out for them. Edelman is the first look on many of these designed plays just the same as Welker was too. It didn't ever mean that other players weren't just as valuable.

Danny Amendola had more receptions this year in 2013 than Aaron Hernandez had in 2/3 seasons here, yet I'm sure you'd have had zero problem with Hernandez having made 3 million dollars this year, right? Just because Edelman (or Welker) or whomever is Brady's first look on plays designed to get the ball out quicker to the shorter timing routes, doesn't mean that Amendola is wasted, or that he'll never amount to a good receiver in other areas---just as Hernandez was in other aspects of the game too.

As far as Julian Edelman's potential 6 million dollar AAV pact, I'll believe it when I see it. Until then, you may end up being right. I'm certainly not claiming to be a know it all. I'm just saying that I don't agree, and that I believe that other GMs will have a middle stop between that 700k and these huge 6 million dollar figures that people are somehow coming up with.

We hear the same exact thing every year. Last year, Talib was a "lock" to get a 5/50 contract, and Welker was a "lock" to get a 5/45 contract. Those 2 pacts totaled almost 100 million dollars in so many projections, and the reality was that they actually only totaled 16.95 million!!

We'll just have to wait and see. I think something like 4/16 or 4/18 would be MUCH more appropriate for a player like Edelman. As I said, that's giving him the benefit of the doubt 100% on top of that....We'll know soon enough.

 

[supafly]

3) IMHO, if Edelman had Amendola's 2013 injuries and Amendola was as healthy as Edelman was, then I would have expected that it would have been Amendola would had 100 receptions. Brady had Amendola ready for the season. Injuries intervened.

This last fact was more than evident judging by Amendola's short time seen in the preseason games, when he had 7 catches in the first quarter alone. I know that he absolutely dominated on his very first drive together with Brady, and the whole fanbase with buzzing about their chemistry already.

Of course he then went on to snag 10 catches in the season opener too, so they were obviously very much in synch, and one could realistically assume that the roles in the WR corps changed dramatically when he became injured, and it was more than obvious that we were having some serious problems with our young rookies. Perhaps some do not remember seeing Brady pissed off and frustrated?

 

[Joker]

Sup you know I have a lot of respect for you in fact as I have said to you before you’re one my favorite poster on the board so I don’t want this to result in any negative feelings towards each other. With that in mind I will attempt to respectfully respond to your post.

Now you see, THAT is something I would NEVER EVER even think of posting.


I LOVE the negative feelings. I embrace them. I bristle when anyone disagrees with MY opinions. Especially YOU, Mr. Sanguine Pats fan of the centuiry, Mr. Supa-diptera.

The internet is SERIOUS business, bud..and the sooner you realize that I am always right and my opinions equal to scientific certainty, the better off YOU will be in your haste to escape Joe Kerr's Mighty Swatter of Correction!