That was pass interference

[Anteros]

GIF me. (Or a link to video of the other angle).

I wasn't watching the game closely (was still recovering from the heart attack I almost had during our game against the Vikings)

All I've seen is the angle that GIF shows, would love another angle though.


And once again, just for the record, I wanted you guys to win today. I wasn't rooting against you this week, and am just stating my opinion. No intentional hard headedness intended.

I would if I could. I'm not that technically adept. Maybe someone else can though?

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

How the rule is normally called: Ball is in the air, defender isn't looking back at the ball, minor contact/minor hindrance can be called. Did this play hit that threshold? Watching the replay in slo-mo multiple times:

- At about the 13 yard line, Boyce turns his head around looking for the ball (he has his head turned, looking toward the ball the remainder of the play).
- The Cleveland player, about 1/2 yard behind him, does not turn his head toward the ball (he never turns his head around on the play whatsoever).
- At about the 11 yard line both players are hand checking each other. Both players have their arms fully extended touching each others jersies (how much pushing is going on? It's hard to tell if there is any).
- At about the 7 to 8 yard line with both of them extending their arms onto each other, the Cleveland player grabs/tugs Boyce at the top front of his left shoulder briefly. Video shows it slows Boyce down to a small degree.
- At about the 6 the Cleveland player hooks Boyce's arm (near the wrist area) for only a fraction of a second.
- Both players disengage any tangential contact with each other around the 5 yard line.
- About 1 yard deep in the endzone the Cleveland player puts his right hand on Boyce's back, his left hand around Boyce's left side and onto his chest. Replay does not show any hindrance of forward motion of Boyce from this.
- About 4 yards deep in the endzone the ball goes off the tips Boyce's fingers, with the pass about a half foot too long (would have required a super amazing finger tip catch otherwise). The Cleveland player appears not to be directly touching Boyce at this point --- though his left hand is around Boyce's shoulder and may be touching his front shoulder.

That is exact or pretty damn close to how it happened.
I would say overall it wasn't a lot that the Cleveland player did. But I don't have a problem with the call because the grab, which is illegal, directly resulted in the ball not hitting Boyce right square in the hands. I don't really care what the rule exactly is, I'd prefer justice by way of rules. IMHO a play on the other side of the field that is much more PI but the ball was never going over there, that is an infraction of the letter of the rules. But that would also give a team the ball on the 1 yard line -- that is not justice. This call was a direct 1 for 1 event (even if it was "not much to the grab"). He grabbed Boyce, it made Boyce miss having the ball laid right into his hands, the penalty results in the Patriots having a chance at a TD (though perfect justice would put the ball at the 1 yard line with the same amount of downs left from the down the original play occured, imho).

Tim

 

[JackBauer]

I thought it was questionable. Had I been the ref, I wouldn't have called it - and I'd probably be pissed as hell if it was against the Patriots.

That said, it only makes up for the terrible Hightower call, so all in all I call it a wash. My takeaway is that Boger sucks and really has no business reffing in the NFL, and holy hell that was the most poorly announced game I've seen...maybe ever.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

I'm sorry - I still don't see PI there. As your receiver runs past the CB, he puts his hand out to push off (albeit slightly) the CB. The CB reaches out and puts his hand on the receivers shoulder.

There wasn't any impediment. There was contact by both players.

I just don't think the refs can call that pass interference, that late in the game which all but guaranteed the victory for the Pats.

And please, stop with the names. They aren't necessary. We can have a conversation and discuss the play, but your anger really is unjustified.

There is, factually, a grab that, factually, hinders Boyce. One can argue it is not much, not enough that it should be called, or that it happens so much in the NFL it can't realistically be considered a penalty. But to say you don't see it at all is nothing but pure troll motivation.

 

[terpsnation]

There is, factually, a grab that, factually, hinders Boyce. One can argue it is not much, not enough that it should be called, or that it happens so much in the NFL it can't realistically be considered a penalty. But to say you don't see it at all is nothing but pure troll motivation.

I don't see PI. There is contact. If there is hindrance, it's negligible. You can argue that Boyce pushing off of the CB is hindrance as well. It dunno, it just doesn't look like enough to throw a flag that has the potential to completely change the outcome of the game.

 

[Anteros]

I don't see PI. There is contact. If there is hindrance, it's negligible. You can argue that Boyce pushing off of the CB is hindrance as well. It dunno, it just doesn't look like enough to throw a flag that has the potential to completely change the outcome of the game.

"Negligible" is all it took for the ball to glance off his fingers instead of settling softly into his hands. PI.

 

[Jackson 2]

If you need an entire thread to convince yourself that it's PI, then it's probably not PI.[/QUOTE/ Bone off...

 

[VJCPatriot]

GIF me. (Or a link to video of the other angle).

I wasn't watching the game closely (was still recovering from the heart attack I almost had during our game against the Vikings)

All I've seen is the angle that GIF shows, would love another angle though.


And once again, just for the record, I wanted you guys to win today. I wasn't rooting against you this week, and am just stating my opinion. No intentional hard headedness intended.

No other angle is necessary because the ref who MADE THE CALL is viewing the play from the same angle. He saw the Browns player pull the shoulderpad of the Pats receiver in the endzone and immediately threw the flag.

This is why posters with under 50 or 100 posts shouldn't be allowed to post in the main forum, they should earn their stripes in the practice squad first. We get so many trolls from other teams who join the forums for just the week of a game and are never heard from afterwards. But their pollution remains on the forum threads.

 

[terpsnation]

"Negligible" is all it took for the ball to glance off his fingers instead of settling softly into his hands. PI.

I don't know if I feel comfortable talking about balls settling softly in another man's hands.

 

[Bella*chick]

Look, I'll be honest. I don't give a flying fig whether it was PI or not, game's over. There are enough questionable calls in the NFL in every game every week. Some go for you, some against.

After the Carolina debacle, we deserved this. I don't even wanna HEAR the word "injustice" tossed around like this is some sort of life or death situation. It happened, it's over, YOU CANNOT CHANGE THE OUTCOME. WE HAD TO DEAL AFTER CAROLINA, NOW YOU DEAL.

 

[Anteros]

I don't know if I feel comfortable talking about balls settling softly in another man's hands.

Yeah, ok, you made me LOL.

 

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

Technically it's PI and it gets called about 50% of the time in the NFL; that percentage just goes up the farther downfield the pass. If a Pats' defender was the offender I would've expected a flag, but I wouldn't really like it.

The announcer's reaction was way more out of line with expectations than the call. Garbage game calling like this makes me with they'd allow regional broadcasts. There's nothing like having such a big moment in the game sullied by listening to someone whine like an opposing team's homer.

 

[RayClay]

You need to watch it again. McFadden had his arm between Boyce's and was a whisker from tipping it. Hardly "beat".

And after rewatching it, I don't think there was a tug. McFadden and Boyce were hand fighting and McFadden almost wrapped his arms around Boyce as they entered the end zone although he didn't affect Boyce that I could see. I'll wait for the gif but I think we got away with one. That however does not detract from the effort in those last two minutes.

No one's arguing the defender didn't have his arm all over the receiver. If he hadn't been impeded at all, that ball would have fallen into his arms like a snowflake and the fact that he got his arm over the receivers shoulder was less an indication that he was playig the ball, than it was a continuation of him putting his arm all over the area and occasionally trying to pin his arms to his side.

Not the most physical of PI, but until they make two penalties for blatant PI and otherwise, he interfered with his ability to catch the ball. He didn't tip the ball. Why would "almost" tipping the ball mean it wasn't interference?

 

[RayClay]

 

[alvinnf]

Horrible call, you are a blind homer if you can't see it. The nfl is becoming more and mor like the WWE! Killing a once great game with all their ***** rules.

 

[Rob0729]

Based on this, my original point stands. It looks clear he tugged on the collar around the 8 yard line. This is where the ball should have been marked.

They don't call that all or even most of the time in the NFL. But is it the definition of pass interference. I have seen worse calls. I have seen worse calls in this game.

 

[Anteros]

Horrible call, you are a blind homer if you can't see it. The nfl is becoming more and mor like the WWE! Killing a once great game with all their ***** rules.

WTF?!? I think, watching that GIF again for the Nth time, there was maybe a half second on that play that the defender didn't have his hands on Boyce.

 

[Kdo5]

That GIF tells me it wasn't an awful call but the spot of the penalty was bad.

 

[Ifleninwasawizard]

I think that we can agree that the PI was a little week. That being said, I can already imagine if that was a patriots DB everyone would be saying 'if you don't want a PI then don't grab the inside of the WR's collar, slap his arm down, and drape your arms around him without ever looking at the ball."

They way the announcers and people on reddit are acting, the browns DB did literally nothing to merit that call.

 

[manxman2601]

No one's arguing the defender didn't have his arm all over the receiver. If he hadn't been impeded at all, that ball would have fallen into his arms like a snowflake and the fact that he got his arm over the receivers shoulder was less an indication that he was playig the ball, than it was a continuation of him putting his arm all over the area and occasionally trying to pin his arms to his side.

Not the most physical of PI, but until they make two penalties for blatant PI and otherwise, he interfered with his ability to catch the ball. He didn't tip the ball. Why would "almost" tipping the ball mean it wasn't interference?

You say that and then post the clip in the very next post. At no stage was Boyce impeded. There was one moment when he slowed as he adjusted to the flight of the ball at about the eight yard line. Maybe there's a different angle I haven't seen yet but certainly from that angle, there was no impediment.

And when MCFadden has his arm on Boyce's shoulder, Boyce is pushing his arm into McFadden's chest/armpit.